# question about hate speech **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [June 12, 2018, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989 "2018-06-12T19:46:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/41 "2018-06-13T15:27:47Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > Bro, get the hell out of my thread and quit shitting it up with your trolling. I’m trying to have a discussion here. It’s also highly, highly amusing that you counsel people to stay out of the pit when you were the one crying about all the naughty words in the Skald pit thread because your kids might see them. Now, now don’t get your non-gendered undergarments in a twist. See how easy it is to avoid sexist speech? ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/42 "2018-06-13T15:57:25Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > This conversation about why and when one-trick ponies get topic-banned in ATMB is super interesting, but I can’t see the connection to the OP. No connection to the OP of course, but it’s connected to post #16 of this thread, which as it happens is the post I commented on. And while it’s not connected to the subject of OP, it does impact the develop of this thread - any time you topic ban a prolific poster on one side of an issue it impacts the discussion, especially if that poster’s position is a distinct minority position as it is. > [@](#): > > It sounds to me like it’d make a great new thread– **FP** , wanna start one? No. Among other things, it’s not clear precisely what ECG had in mind altogether, WADR to Fenris. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/43 "2018-06-13T17:08:04Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > My guess: a “boring, one-trick-pony opinion” is a repeated opinion that you disagree with. That can get boring pretty fast. And the real problem is that it gets in the way of the repeated opinions that you do agree with, and in that sense it “derails” the discussion. Clearly needs to be stamped out. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/44 "2018-06-13T17:49:30Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > As a moderator, the problem I have with treating gendered insults as hate speech is the difficulty in drawing bright lines. **At the risk of going all MRA** , if gendered insults are out, is “dick” not allowed? I don’t personally feel there’s any parity there, but can I defend that distinction in the inevitable ATMB thread? Also, where on the continuum of gendered insults do we draw the line? As I have said before, there is a consensus among many people in English Speaking World of 2018, that any compassion for male victims of discrimination is a moral crime. Simple Compassion is a moral misdemeanor, while Aggravated Compassion is a moral felony. The aforementioned discrimination may be as minor as different rules for men ad women on a relatively small Social Media Platform such as SDMB,or something as major as a [63% sentencing disparity](https://www.law.umich.edu/newsandinfo/features/Pages/starr_gender_disparities.aspx). ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/45 "2018-06-13T18:09:45Z")
> [@CCitizen](#): > > As I have said before, there is a consensus among many people in English Speaking World of 2018, that any compassion for male victims of discrimination is a moral crime. Simple Compassion is a moral misdemeanor, while Aggravated Compassion is a moral felony. Yeah yeah, go talk to the guys at r/incels already. ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/46 "2018-06-13T18:46:39Z")
NM ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/47 "2018-06-13T18:52:10Z")
Yes, there is discrimination against men. And where it exists, it should be stopped. But the thing is, it’s much, much less severe, both in frequency and in the severity of individual events, than discrimination against women. So when a guy argues more vociferously against discrimination against men than against the reverse, it really leads one to suspect that that guy is part of the problem, not part of the solution. ---
**Author:** ![expectopatronum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/expectopatronum/32/173_2.png) [@expectopatronum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/expectopatronum)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/48 "2018-06-13T19:00:58Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, there is discrimination against men. And where it exists, it should be stopped. But the thing is, it’s much, much less severe, both in frequency and in the severity of individual events, than discrimination against women. So when a guy argues more vociferously against discrimination against men than against the reverse, it really leads one to suspect that that guy is part of the problem, not part of the solution. Well said. ---
**Author:** ![Fotheringay-Phipps](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/d9b06d/32.png) [@Fotheringay-Phipps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fotheringay-Phipps)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/49 "2018-06-13T19:19:13Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, there is discrimination against men. And where it exists, it should be stopped. But the thing is, it’s much, much less severe, both in frequency and in the severity of individual events, than discrimination against women. So when a guy argues more vociferously against discrimination against men than against the reverse, it really leads one to suspect that that guy is part of the problem, not part of the solution. People make this type of argument all the time, but I don’t agree with it. The implication is that any time someone is worked up about one particular issue this implies that he thinks this is the single biggest issue in the world and that all other issues are of lesser importance. But that’s not how the world works. Everyone has their own interests and concerns. In particular, people sometimes feel that regardless of how their issue ranks in comparison to other issues, it’s worth their while to focus on it because it’s being neglected by the public at large, while other issues - which may possibly be bigger concerns - are already benefiting from an enormous amount of attention. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/50 "2018-06-13T19:31:01Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > People make this type of argument all the time, but I don’t agree with it. The implication is that any time someone is worked up about one particular issue this implies that he thinks this is the single biggest issue in the world and that all other issues are of lesser importance. But that’s not how the world works. Everyone has their own interests and concerns. > > In particular, people sometimes feel that regardless of how their issue ranks in comparison to other issues, it’s worth their while to focus on it because it’s being neglected by the public at large, while other issues - which may possibly be bigger concerns - are already benefiting from an enormous amount of attention. Thank you. **He who is not at liberty to defend his rights has no rights.** ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/51 "2018-06-13T19:32:31Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > Yeah yeah, go talk to the guys at r/incels already. An interesting point in a thread about acceptability of gendered insults. I would never talk to these people – they have toxic and counterproductive views on many issues. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/52 "2018-06-13T20:18:15Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, there is discrimination against men. And where it exists, it should be stopped. But the thing is, it’s much, much less severe, both in frequency and in the severity of individual events, than discrimination against women. So when a guy argues more vociferously against discrimination against men than against the reverse, it really leads one to suspect that that guy is part of the problem, not part of the solution. What you’re missing is that we are talking about the present and future, not the past. Discrimination against men is just as pernicious as discrimination against women. And what exactly is wrong with someone highlighting discrimination against men? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/53 "2018-06-13T20:26:35Z")
> [@expectopatronum](#): > > So, you’re likening a discussion about gendered insults designed to degrade women to a gathering of a group of gullible idiots trying to raise the spirits of the dead? Is this an accurate reading of your post? Hardly. He’s likening the tactics you are employing in pursuit of your ‘discussion’ to those used by groups of gullible idiots trying to raise the spirits of the dead. Just because you believe yourself on the side of the angels, it doesn’t mean any and every tactic you decide to employ is off limits to critical examination. Nor does it necessarily mean that that criticism itself equals opposition to the subject of the discussion. For example, look at the behavior of someone who your tactics are beginning to resemble - Yvette Felarca of the antifa crowd, who was so incensed at and opposed to the presence of a Nazi demonstrator in her community that she took it upon herself to punch him repeatedly and order him to ‘get off her street’. Without regard to the vileness of Nazism itself, private citizens simply aren’t permitted to strike people or order them off public land because they don’t like their politics, and pointing this out does not mean one is sympathetic to Nazism. Similarly **Shodan’s** criticism of your tactics in this thread does not mean in and of itself that he is being critical of your stance on this issue, but instead that he’s being critical of the dictatorial, intolerant and close-minded way you’re seeking to drive the discussion. > [@expectopatronum](#): > > edit: also, what LHoD said. Start your own thread to cry about octopus being modded and leave this crap out of mine. Thanks everso. Ah, and here we have more of the same. Are OPs permitted to police their own threads now? It’s been the longstanding policy of this board that OPs do not own the threads they start and are not allowed to dictate the direction that the ensuing discussion takes. This is a thread in ATMB, where discussion of moderator action is permitted, and in which moderator action has raised questions as to how to behave in, or what may or may not be permissible as the thread continues. Therefore discussion of it here seems perfectly appropriate. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/54 "2018-06-13T20:37:57Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > For example, look at the behavior of someone who your tactics are beginning to resemble - Yvette Felarca of the antifa crowd, who was so incensed at and opposed to the presence of a Nazi demonstrator in her community that she took it upon herself to punch him repeatedly and order him to ‘get off her street’. > > Without regard to the vileness of Nazism itself, private citizens simply aren’t permitted to strike people or order them off public land because they don’t like their politics, and pointing this out does not mean one is sympathetic to Nazism. Similarly **Shodan’s** criticism of your tactics in this thread does not mean in and of itself that he is being critical of your stance on this issue, but instead that he’s being critical of the dictatorial, intolerant and close-minded way you’re seeking to drive the discussion. Discussion equals punching? We have so much to talk about. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/55 "2018-06-13T20:41:59Z")
Only in the sense that **Shodan’s** post equals likening a discussion about gendered insults designed to degrade women to a gathering of a group of gullible idiots trying to raise the spirits of the dead. ---
**Author:** ![CCitizen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@CCitizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CCitizen)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/56 "2018-06-13T20:47:31Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Discussion equals punching? We have so much to talk about. Many people who take refuge on Social Media have Depression. People with Depression are over-represented among those who live on the Internet. They may suffer severely when verbally abused. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/57 "2018-06-13T21:01:56Z")
> [@Fotheringay-Phipps](#): > > People make this type of argument all the time, but I don’t agree with it. The implication is that any time someone is worked up about one particular issue this implies that he thinks this is the single biggest issue in the world and that all other issues are of lesser importance. But that’s not how the world works. Everyone has their own interests and concerns. > > In particular, people sometimes feel that regardless of how their issue ranks in comparison to other issues, it’s worth their while to focus on it because it’s being neglected by the public at large, while other issues - which may possibly be bigger concerns - are already benefiting from an enormous amount of attention. When cops are shooting unarmed black men downtown, I don’t find it equaling compelling to protest that my garbage wasn’t picked up this week, even though it smells really bad. > [@Quartz](#): > > What you’re missing is that we are talking about the present and future, not the past. Discrimination against men is just as pernicious as discrimination against women. (snip) A carefully chosen word. Some discrimination against men, _where it exists_, may be as pernicious as discrimination against women. That doesn’t mean that it is anywhere near as frequent or as deeply-entrenched. If you are trying to slip by an assertion that it is, I’d want to ask for cites. In any case, to return to the OP, I think she will probably have to be satisfied with Miller’s remarks that the excessiveness of any gender insults will have to be modded on a case by case basis, and that the alert system (not sure what that is) has improved since those threads were published. ---
**Author:** ![SisterCoyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@SisterCoyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SisterCoyote)\ **Post date:** [June 13, 2018, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/58 "2018-06-13T21:33:53Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > In any case, to return to the OP, I think she will probably have to be satisfied with Miller’s remarks that the excessiveness of any gender insults will have to be modded on a case by case basis, and that the alert system (not sure what that is) has improved since those threads were published. For the record, in case you ever see something you feel needs to be reported, in the upper right hand corner of each post, approximately even with the user name, is a little red-and-white icon that’s supposed to look like an exclamation point in a triangle, I think. If you click that, you can report a post. That’s what expecto was talking about, if I understood correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/59 "2018-06-14T00:44:50Z")
> [@SisterCoyote](#): > > For the record, in case you ever see something you feel needs to be reported, in the upper right hand corner of each post, approximately even with the user name, is a little red-and-white icon that’s supposed to look like an exclamation point in a triangle, I think. If you click that, you can report a post. > > That’s what expecto was talking about, if I understood correctly. I think **Roderick** was referring to the part in my post where I mentioned an automated reporting system. When you report a post (the triangle icon) it sends an email to the inbox of every mod assigned to that forum. Around 2014, we added a plug in so that, in addition to the email, the report is also posted to a thread in the Moderation forum. The threads **expecto** linked to were posted before we added that system, so there’s no easy way to tell if those posts got reported at the time. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [June 14, 2018, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989/60 "2018-06-14T05:50:15Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > The bad thing is that **Sleeps** and **Diosa** left the dope. I wonder if **Scumpup’s** patent misogyny in that thread was part of that? The sexism on the SDMB is why they left the boards and **Scumpup** ’s misogyny was part of that, yes. They aren’t the only ones who left right around then, specifically because of the sexism. And we’ve lost other great posters due to the same issues even before that (I miss **MissPurlMcKnittington** :(). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-hate-speech/815989.md?page=2)