# Question about the Joan Crawford/Bette Davis feud **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 8, 2003, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816 "2003-05-08T02:30:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/1 "2003-05-08T02:30:04Z")
How did the feud start? Was there a clash of egos while working on particular movie? Did someone replace the other as the studio head’s favorite? Were they fighting over the same man? How did these two giant divas end up hating each other so much? And is there any truth to the oft-told anecdote of Bette Davis’s reaction to news of Joan Crawford’s death: “I was taught to speak only good of the dead. Joan Crawford is dead. Good!”? ---
**Author:** ![Payton\_s\_Servant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3da27b/32.png) [@Payton\_s\_Servant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Payton_s_Servant)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/2 "2003-05-08T03:57:12Z")
Bette Davis always looked down at Joan Crawford, referring to her as a _“movie star,”_ while Davis herself was an _“actress.”_ There were tensions on the set of **Whatever Happened To Baby Jane?** and the director recalled that after shooting for the day was done he would get a phone call from either Davis or Crawford, in which Crawford/Davis would invariably ask, "_What did that **bitch** say about me today?_ Soon after that phone call was over, the other actress would call and the conversation would be repeated. Much to Joan’s annoyance, Davis recieved an Oscar nomination while Crawford was passed over. But on Oscar night, Crawford managed to upstage and steal the spotlight from her rival when Bette lost. In winner Anne Bancroft’s abscence, Joan regally waltzed on stage watched by a stunned Davis to accept on Bancroft’s behalf. Davis remembered Crawfords humiliation of her at the Oscars and reportedly drove Crawford to something of a nervous breakdown on the set of **Hush, Hush, Sweet Charlotte**. ---
**Author:** ![Liz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/liz/32/17737_2.png) [@Liz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liz)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/3 "2003-05-08T05:49:39Z")
> [@](#): > > Davis remembered Crawfords humiliation of her at the Oscars and reportedly drove Crawford to something of a nervous breakdown on the set of Hush, Hush, Sweet Charlotte. Bette was _lethal_. To the OP, if you can pick up a bio on Bette, it’s a damn good read. I can’t remember the author of the particular one I’m thinking of, but look for a bio that has a stylistic, old-Hollywood glamour shot of Bette on the front. She was a diva in the true sense of the word. ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/4 "2003-05-08T06:21:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by QueerGeekGirl \* > \*\*Bette was _lethal_. \*\* Yeah. Never look into her eyes. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/5 "2003-05-08T13:29:25Z")
(Joan Crawford) “Jane, you wouldn’t be treating me this way if I wasn’t in this wheelchair.” (Bette Davis) “But ya ARE, Blanche! Ya ARE in a wheelchair!” Possibly the best line EVER. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/6 "2003-05-08T13:41:34Z")
A good gossipy read on Bette and Joan and the feud (which both actresses publicly denied and disavowed all knowledge of fairly consistently throughout their lives) is _Bette and Joan: The Divine Feud_ by Shaun Considine. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/7 "2003-05-08T14:18:50Z")
Best_factual_ Davis and Crawford books, which also get the best sense of their personalities and talents across, are Whitney Stine’s **Mother Goddam: The Story of the Career of Bette Davis** (1974) and Roy Newquist’s **Conversations with Joan Crawford** (1980). Both include extensive, non-edited, interviews with the stars. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/8 "2003-05-08T14:28:53Z")
I love the SDMB! I’ve gotten a few new anecdotes about the feud as well as additions to my reading list! I have to return books to the library tomorrow, so I’ll look for the recommended reads. Thank you all (with special genuflections to **Otto** and **Eve** for expanding my “to read” list)! ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/9 "2003-05-08T14:30:32Z")
Stine and Davis also did a sequel, _I’d Love to Kiss You…Conversations With Bette Davis._ As I understand it, both of Stine’s books were sent to Davis and she responded extensively, and her comments were included in the published editions in italics. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/10 "2003-05-08T16:24:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Davis remembered Crawfords humiliation of her at the Oscars and reportedly drove Crawford to something of a nervous breakdown on the set of Hush, Hush, Sweet Charlotte. 😕 Crawford wasn’t in _Hush, Hush_; what, was she just hanging around or something? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Liz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/liz/32/17737_2.png) [@Liz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liz)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/11 "2003-05-08T16:36:16Z")
Crawford was slated to star in _Hush, Hush_. After a few days of shooting, she became “ill” and Olivia de Havilland replaced her. Ill? Or _did_ Bette drive her to a nervous breakdown? Hrm! ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2003, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/12 "2003-05-08T16:44:06Z")
I admire Bette Davis very much as an actress, but she herself was the first to admit she was impossible to work with. She was even mean to Lillian Gish while shooting _The Whales of August_—I repeat, she was _mean_ to _Lillian Gish!!!_ ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/13 "2003-05-10T22:58:28Z")
I would also recommend **My Mother’s Keeper** , by B.D. Hyman, Bette’s daughter. Her description of Bette’s method of cooking macaroni casserole had me ROFL. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eve \* > \*\*I admire Bette Davis very much as an actress, but she herself was the first to admit she was impossible to work with. She was even mean to Lillian Gish while shooting _The Whales of August_—I repeat, she was _mean_ to _Lillian Gish!!!_ \*\* :eek: There’s a place in hell for that! ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2003, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/14 "2003-05-10T23:17:06Z")
I would most heartily not recommend My Mother’s Keeper. Poorly written tripe, although it did give Bette the opportunity to end her book This ‘n’ That with an open letter to B.D. with the salutation “Dear Hyman”. As more than one witty person commented at the time, she could hardly start off the letter “Dear C\*nt” but she did the next best thing. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2003, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/15 "2003-05-11T01:14:24Z")
Yeah, I deliberately passed up _My Mother’s Keeper_ while I was at the library on the assumption that it was, like _Mommy Dearest_, just an ill-tempered “she was mean to me” rant with significant amounts of bullshit thrown in. Got _The Divine Feud_, _Conversations with Joan Crawford_, and _I’d Love to Kiss You_, though. I’ll start those next week. ---
**Author:** ![moi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@moi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moi)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/16 "2003-05-12T05:19:15Z")
Rather than start up a new Crawford thread, I’d like to add a question here; hope you don’t mind, jayjay. _Mommy Dearest_–Is there a general opinion on how much crap vs. fact this is? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/17 "2003-05-12T05:28:34Z")
**Eve** knows much more than I do, but it is telling that Considine, in _The Divine Feud_, picks apart the infamous rose garden scene by noting that: a) Philip Terry was still in residence with the Crawfords at the time. b) The rose garden had already been dug up long before to make way for a victory garden. c) Joan was not unemployed when Mayer let her go, but already negotiating a deal with another studio. The discrepancies with just this one scene make me doubt the veracity of the whole thing. I mean, the garden **didn’t even exist** at the time that the firing happened! I’ve thought for a long time that _Mommy Dearest_ was the greatest injustice ever perpetrated on Joan Crawford. Admittedly, she could be an iron-skinned bitch, but for the daughter she raised to attack her so viciously and falsely when Joan had no way to possibly fight back (being dead and all) was a monstrous thing. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 6:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/18 "2003-05-12T06:55:10Z")
Re: _Mommie Dearest_: **Please don’t conflate the book with the movie**. If you can find discrepancies in the biography, that’s one thing, but the movie wasn’t consistent with the biography. **Eve** , if you’re reading this, I know you’ve discredited the biography, and I’m not going to get into that. But the movie wasn’t Christina’s story; it was some screenwriter’s conception. ---
**Author:** ![SkipMagic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skipmagic/32/20706_2.png) [@SkipMagic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SkipMagic)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/19 "2003-05-12T13:20:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Eve \* > \*\*… I repeat, she was _mean_ to _Lillian Gish!!!_ \*\* Yeah. A lot of people talk about “Baby Gladys” Pickford, but for my money, it was always her ex-flatmate, Lillian, who got my schnizzle stick… schnizzlin’. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816/20 "2003-05-12T13:29:28Z")
There’s already been a couple of threads on this—but it is 85% crap. Christina submitted a typical, dull memoir to the publisher (where a friend of mine worked, this is how I know this), and it was combined with an unpublished novel called _The Hype_—which is where a lot of the stories came from. Joan was an overly strict mother, she herself admitted, and obsessive about cleanliness (read _Conversations with Crawford_ for her unvarnished opinion of herself!). And she did have a drinking problem till she quit in the 1960s. But the two older kids, Christina and Christopher, were unmanageable, emotionally disturbed. The two younger daughters have said repeatedly, “Joan was a good mother—Christina made up most of that stuff,” but no one wants to hear that. Joan did a lot of admirable things she never got credit for: nursed her dying ex, Franchot Tone, through his final illness; frequently gave young performers a hand up and bought them clothing; donated a wing to an L.A. hospital where people in the industry could be treated free of charge, at her expense . . . Plus, her coworkers always said she was 100% professional, a delight to work with. . . . Well, OK, except Norma Shearer . . . [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-about-the-joan-crawford-bette-davis-feud/173816.md?page=2)