# Question for anti gun people? home defense? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 13, 2019, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475 "2019-02-13T17:00:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/21 "2019-02-13T18:16:02Z")
Really, this is a problem I spend zero time thinking about. I just googled some statistics on home invasions, and it appears that while burglaries are common, the number of times that (a) someone is home and (b) the offender has a weapon and © the offender is not known to the homeowner is quite small. Since I’m pretty sure I don’t know anyone who is going to try to steal from me or try to murder me, I feel confident that I’m better off watching reality TV while checking out Facebook on my phone than planning how to defend myself. But since I know that’s not what the OP is asking, I’d probably barricade my bedroom door and look for something to defend myself if someone smashed in the door. After all, I am extremely confident that the police would be at my home extremely quickly; because when I’ve called them for nuisance crimes they have responded with incredible alacrity. ETA: I’m also saying this with the knowledge that I live in Washington, DC, not some Syria-like rural area where Hobbes would be scared stiff at raising a family, where libertarians insist that public safety services are only for the rich and crazy-ass murderers roam the woods and farms. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/22 "2019-02-13T18:16:28Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Only a psychopath wouldn’t hesitate to use deadly force in a situation they could avoid. Swinging a baseball bat is easier. Swinging a baseball bat can be deadly force. ---
**Author:** ![sps49sd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@sps49sd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sps49sd)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/23 "2019-02-13T18:17:04Z")
XT and others- Apartment dwellers may not have ‘run away’ options. iiandyiii, Buck Godot- the objective for my mother’s home intruder included sexual assault. Sitnam- a bat may be a good option for you, but not everyone. Ravenman- not everyone enjoys rapid PD response times. I don’t mind if some of you don’t want a firearm. I’d rather you didn’t try making that choice for my mother (or myself). ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/24 "2019-02-13T18:17:44Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Swinging a baseball bat can be deadly force. Can is the key word. Firing a gun is ALWAYS deadly force. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/25 "2019-02-13T18:20:13Z")
> [@sps49sd](#): > > XT and others- Apartment dwellers may not have ‘run away’ options. > > iiandyiii, Buck Godot- the objective for my mother’s home intruder included sexual assault. > > Sitnam- a bat may be a good option for you, but not everyone. > > I don’t mind if some of you don’t want a firearm. I’d rather you didn’t try making that choice for my mother (or myself). If you live in an apartment, you have the option of calling for help – people are literally a door away. I don’t trust you or your mother with a deadly weapon, so I have no problem making that choice “for” you, just like we as a society made the choice to prevent your mother from keeping a tiger in her apartment for protection. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/26 "2019-02-13T18:22:40Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Can is the key word. Firing a gun is ALWAYS deadly force. Are you trying to make a legal distinction here? Lots of people survive being shot at. Some don’t. Lots of people survive being hit with a baseball bat. Some don’t. In both cases, you might face legal peril if you use the object in a manner / time that does not enjoy approval by the government. ---
**Author:** ![sps49sd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@sps49sd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sps49sd)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/27 "2019-02-13T18:26:17Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > If you live in an apartment, you have the option of calling for help – people are literally a door away. > > I don’t trust you or your mother with a deadly weapon, so I have no problem making that choice “for” you, just like we as a society made the choice to prevent your mother from keeping a tiger in her apartment for protection. Babale, you \_\_\_\_\_\_\_ \_\_\_\_\_\_, this isn’t a hypothetical. It happened. Hollering did not help. Her building was not a nice building with basell bat wielding meanly men awaiting a cry for help 24/ 7. \_\_\_\_ \_\_\_. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/28 "2019-02-13T18:27:32Z")
Are there any stats as to how often home break-ins are done by intruders carrying firearms? ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/29 "2019-02-13T18:28:02Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > … I have no problem making that choice “for” you… Tyrants never do. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/30 "2019-02-13T18:30:00Z")
Are a lot of people trying outlaw private handgun ownership? I must have missed it ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/31 "2019-02-13T18:31:27Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Are there any stats as to how often home break-ins are done by intruders carrying firearms? [DoJ - Victimization During Household Burglary (PDF)](https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/vdhb.pdf) > [@](#): > > An estimated 3.7 million household burglaries occurred each year on average from 2003 to 2007. In about 28% of these burglaries, a household member was present during the burglary. In 7% of all household burglaries, a household member experienced some form of violent victimization … > > A household member was present in roughly 1 million burglaries and became victims of violent crimes in 266,560 burglaries … > > Overall, 61% of offenders were unarmed when violence occurred during a burglary while a resident was present. About 12% of all households violently burglarized while someone was home faced an offender armed with a firearm. … ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/32 "2019-02-13T18:33:22Z")
> [@sps49sd](#): > > I don’t mind if some of you don’t want a firearm. I’d rather you didn’t try making that choice for my mother (or myself). Removing every firearm from every citizen in the United States was exactly what I wanted to do today. Damn it. Guess I’ll go to a movie or something instead. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/33 "2019-02-13T18:33:37Z")
> [@sps49sd](#): > > I don’t mind if some of you don’t want a firearm. I’d rather you didn’t try making that choice for my mother (or myself). One thing I’d be much more comfortable with is only allowing guns to people who have had extensive training and continue that training. So police, military, etc. would be okay. But Joe Citizen often has very little training, and typically no training at situations involving close-quarters, high-stress, low-light, high-confusion, etc. A random person in an apartment is probably pretty likely to shoot at random noises, miss their target and shoot something else, shoot at someone they think is a burglar but is a maintenance worker, etc. With everyone being able to purchase a gun, you end up with people shooting because of road rage, shooting because a strange car turned into their driveway, shooting because they’re mad their sports team lost, etc. Look at this story recently in the news: [Fire chief charged with pulling gun on Boy Scout placing flyers on homes](https://www.mcall.com/news/breaking/mc-pol-south-whitehall-fire-chief-pulls-gun-on-boy-scout-20190129-story.html) That guy used pretty poor judgement even though he’s a first responder who presumably has been in high-stress environments. I’m not faulting him for trying to figure out what was going on, but dude! observe for a while before pointing a gun at a 12-year-old! ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/34 "2019-02-13T18:37:55Z")
I think you’re probably overestimating the amount of training that the average police officer or member of the military receives. Dramatically. Ask if you can visit your local police shooting range. Take a look at the walls, floor, and ceiling while there. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/35 "2019-02-13T18:38:53Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > [DoJ - Victimization During Household Burglary (PDF)](https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/vdhb.pdf) I would surmise that there was a chance that of a violent confrontation if the intruder was armed…but this dances around the question I actually asked. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/36 "2019-02-13T18:40:13Z")
> [@sps49sd](#): > > XT and others- Apartment dwellers may not have ‘run away’ options. > > iiandyiii, Buck Godot- the objective for my mother’s home intruder included sexual assault. > > Sitnam- a bat may be a good option for you, but not everyone. > > Ravenman- not everyone enjoys rapid PD response times. > > I don’t mind if some of you don’t want a firearm. I’d rather you didn’t try making that choice for my mother (or myself). I don’t see how this conflicts with anything I wrote. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/37 "2019-02-13T18:41:26Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I think you’re probably overestimating the amount of training that the average police officer or member of the military receives. Dramatically. > > Ask if you can visit your local police shooting range. Take a look at the walls, floor, and ceiling while there. Good point. Okay, even they don’t get to have guns! 🙂 The only people who can have personal weapons are those who regularly engage in close-quarters combat training, like SWAT, SEAL teams, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/38 "2019-02-13T18:41:51Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I think you’re probably overestimating the amount of training that the average police officer or member of the military receives. Dramatically. > > Ask if you can visit your local police shooting range. Take a look at the walls, floor, and ceiling while there. I haven’t been to one in awhile so I guess I don’t know. Do they typically make shooting ranges high pressure situations and turn the lights off? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/39 "2019-02-13T18:44:40Z")
Are the police usually required to have more training than civilian gun owners, less, or are the requirements about the same? ---
**Author:** ![sps49sd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@sps49sd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sps49sd)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2019, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475/40 "2019-02-13T18:45:25Z")
> [@filmore](#): > > One thing I’d be much more comfortable with is only allowing guns to people who have had extensive training and continue that training. So police, military, etc. would be okay. But Joe Citizen often has very little training, and typically no training at situations involving close-quarters, high-stress, low-light, high-confusion, etc. A random person in an apartment is probably pretty likely to shoot at random noises, miss their target and shoot something else, shoot at someone they think is a burglar but is a maintenance worker, etc. With everyone being able to purchase a gun, you end up with people shooting because of road rage, shooting because a strange car turned into their driveway, shooting because they’re mad their sports team lost, etc. > > Look at this story recently in the news: [Fire chief charged with pulling gun on Boy Scout placing flyers on homes](https://www.mcall.com/news/breaking/mc-pol-south-whitehall-fire-chief-pulls-gun-on-boy-scout-20190129-story.html) That guy used pretty poor judgement even though he’s a first responder who presumably has been in high-stress environments. I’m not faulting him for trying to figure out what was going on, but dude! observe for a while before pointing a gun at a 12-year-old! I was in the military. I did not ONCE touch a firearm with a bore less than five inches. I did do a lot of backyard and country shooting with my father, mother, brothers, cousins. One of those firearms we used is the one my mother had. Still has. ‘probably pretty likely to shoot at’ It was someone coming in a window. Your imagination and excuses mean little to me, and the idiot fire chief is an idiot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-anti-gun-people-home-defense/829475.md?page=3)