# Question for Republicans: If Trump wins the Nomination... **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 3, 2015, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332 "2015-12-03T18:22:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/181 "2015-12-10T12:42:32Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > That doesn’t prove Trump personally got the info from a Neo-Nazi site. You’ve deliberately chosen to assert that Trump personally went to a Neo-Nazi site to get that statistic, and you’ve demanded a cite from **adaher** to prove you wrong. I believe the burden should be on you, shouldn’t it. The original assertion was yours. If Trump stood in front of a large banner with the word “HATE!!!” on it, you would want evidence that he himself painted it, wouldn’t you? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/182 "2015-12-10T13:03:50Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I’m not sure that’s where Trump is going. I think he’s going the “deliberately and cynically appealing to bigots” route, without necessarily holding bigoted beliefs himself. > [@](#): > > If Trump was a bigot we’d have heard about it before now, he probably would have been a target of major lawsuits for discrimination seeing as how he runs a lot of companies and all that. I don’t think there’s any place for political correctness in policymaking. Trump’s anti-Muslim plan should be rejected as not consistent with our values, but I’m actually glad someone brought it up. We shouldn’t have a democracy where a large portion of Americans believe something but no politician will represent them. If 37% of Americans think Muslims shouldn’t be allowed in the US, then a candidate should be advocating for that and it should be resolved through the processes we’ve put in place to resolve such issues: elections, and if that fails, the Constitution and the courts. The WORST thing you can do with bigots is to make them believe that they are right but no one is talking about their issues. Having a public debate about this is the right course for our public discourse. I’m fine that the bigots are exposed so that they can be criticized, but Trump is not doing a good thing by advocating for bigotry. Even if 30% of America thought the Holocaust was okay, that wouldn’t mean it’s morally okay for anyone to advocate for killing Jews. They’d deserve harsh criticism, as does Trump. > [@](#): > > There’s about as much support for our beliefs about Democrats as Democratic beliefs that Republicans are racist. I’ve spoke against statements like that about Republicans on the Dope just like I do about bullshit fake-Democratic straw-manning. Such statements are always bullshit – I’ve criticized you for them as well. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/183 "2015-12-10T13:07:12Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > **GIGO** , do you have any evidence whatsoever that Trump himself personally went to a Neo-Nazi to get that statistic rather than simply having it tweeted without attribution either to him or one of his campaign workers or bouncing around on Facebook and the internet? > > There are literally millions of places Trump or his campaign could have come up with that information, yet true to form you immediately assume he got it from the worst possible source in order to paint him as a hater. > > This is a perfect example of the very kind of thing I’ve been talking about. Repeating racist propaganda is a racist action. It’s not lynching, and not slavery, and doesn’t deserve execution, but it does deserve criticism. If someone who’s not a racist accidentally repeats racist propaganda because they misunderstood the source, they should apologize profusely and vow to improve themselves. That’s what decent people do – decent people occasionally do or say bad things, even racist things, but decent people recognize mistakes when called upon it and apologize and try to improve themselves. I think you have a blind spot to this. Where do you disagree with the above paragraph? Do you disagree that the stats were racist propaganda? Do you disagree that it’s, in a minor way, racist to repeat racist propaganda? Do you disagree that decent people apologize and try to improve themselves when they make a mistake, including a racist mistake? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/184 "2015-12-10T13:07:44Z")
Yeah, but Trump never apologizes so it’s not evidence of anything other than the fact that he never apologizes. ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/185 "2015-12-10T13:10:55Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > It is really funny to claim that liberals are the dishonest ones, when I only see conservatives that claim that this did not happen: > > [PolitiFact | Trump's Pants on Fire tweet that blacks killed 81% of white homicide victims](http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2015/nov/23/donald-trump/trump-tweet-blacks-white-homicide-victims/) > > More than pants on fire, what one should wonder really is why is it that he was going to Neo-Nazi sites to get that image for his racist tweet. So it’s OK that blacks have killed only 40% of white homicide victims??? Would it still have been RACISM! If Trump cited the correct statistic? Seems to be much more outrage over his recent Muslim comment than there was over his Mexican and Black statements, so apparently, people hate Muslims less than they hate Hispanics and Blacks. Weird… ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/186 "2015-12-10T13:17:33Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Yeah, but Trump never apologizes so it’s not evidence of anything other than the fact that he never apologizes. That’s evidence of his (lack of) decency and character, as are his appeals to bigotry and bigots. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/187 "2015-12-10T13:21:29Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If Trump stood in front of a large banner with the word “HATE!!!” on it, you would want evidence that he himself painted it, wouldn’t you? :rolleyes: i’d probably be wondering which Democrat he was talking about and what they were saying about which Republican. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/188 "2015-12-10T13:34:48Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Trump apologizes for nothing. Which makes him an asshole, but does not demonstrate that is a racist. It’s a good strategy. When you ignore the calls to apologize on anything practically you cut off from your opponents one avenue of attack. Wasting no time backtracking is working for The Donald. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/189 "2015-12-10T13:36:56Z")
It won’t get him very far. Imagine if Obama hadn’t apologized for his special olympics comment. Trump’s problem is that he fights every battle like it’s life or death. Sometimes you got to decide you’re not going to die on an unimportant hill. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/190 "2015-12-10T13:38:22Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Repeating racist propaganda is a racist action. It’s not lynching, and not slavery, and doesn’t deserve execution, but it does deserve criticism. If someone who’s not a racist accidentally repeats racist propaganda because they misunderstood the source, they should apologize profusely and vow to improve themselves. That’s what decent people do – decent people occasionally do or say bad things, even racist things, but decent people recognize mistakes when called upon it and apologize and try to improve themselves. > > I think you have a blind spot to this. Where do you disagree with the above paragraph? Do you disagree that the stats were racist propaganda? Do you disagree that it’s, in a minor way, racist to repeat racist propaganda? Do you disagree that decent people apologize and try to improve themselves when they make a mistake, including a racist mistake? Mistake #1 is your assumption that people that seek power over others are decent. There’s a reason why the founders desperately tried to restrict power from the federal government. They understood the nature of man far more than any naive, modern statist. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/191 "2015-12-10T13:41:19Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Mistake #1 is your assumption that people that seek power over others are decent. There’s a reason why the founders desperately tried to restrict power from the federal government. They understood the nature of man far more than any naive, modern statist. When have I assumed that? Decency and character are relative. Apologizing for a mistake and trying to avoid doing or saying racist things is more decent and demonstrates better character than not doing so, all other things being equal. This is just one of many things to judge someone by. Some people and some politicians are worse than others. I generally try and vote for the least bad option. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/192 "2015-12-10T13:41:38Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It won’t get him very far. Imagine if Obama hadn’t apologized for his special olympics comment. Trump’s problem is that he fights every battle like it’s life or death. Sometimes you got to decide you’re not going to die on an unimportant hill. It won’t? His overall strategy is winning so far. Hard to say what portion can be attributed to his obstinance. I know many on these forums don’t know a single Trump supporter. I do. And they like that he doesn’t apologize. They like that he says what’s on his mind. The strong man appeal is not limited to the Middle East and Africa. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/193 "2015-12-10T13:44:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > When have I assumed that? Decency and character are relative. Apologizing for a mistake and trying to avoid doing or saying racist things is more decent and demonstrates better character than not doing so, all other things being equal. This is just one of many things to judge someone by. Some people and some politicians are worse than others. I generally try and vote for the least bad option. You arent as cynical as I am. I think they are all corrupt to some degree. Some just hide it better. ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/194 "2015-12-10T13:44:20Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Mistake #1 is your assumption that people that seek power over others are decent. There’s a reason why the founders desperately tried to restrict power from the federal government. They understood the nature of man far more than any naive, modern statist. Decency comes in shades. Even if you assume that those who seek power are inherently indecent (a sentiment I reject wholesale, by the way), Trump is still far further down the scale than, say, John McCain. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/195 "2015-12-10T13:45:44Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > You arent as cynical as I am. I think they are all corrupt to some degree. Some just hide it better. Where in my post do you think I disagree with any of this? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/196 "2015-12-10T13:48:25Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Decency comes in shades. Even if you assume that those who seek power are inherently indecent (a sentiment I reject wholesale, by the way), Trump is still far further down the scale than, say, John McCain. That’s a very valid point of view. Again, I’m admittedly cynical and distrustful about politicians. So, if I have to choose I’m choosing the scum that makes the nation ever more powerful instead of the scum that will weaken it. I’m not sure The Donald has any real plans though. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/197 "2015-12-10T13:51:33Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Where in my post do you think I disagree with any of this? I don’t know if you disagree with the quoted post. I just am distrustful of politicians to the point that I don’t trust that their apologies reveal anything positive about their character. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/198 "2015-12-10T13:57:48Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > **GIGO** , do you have any evidence whatsoever that Trump himself personally went to a Neo-Nazi to get that statistic rather than simply having it tweeted without attribution either to him or one of his campaign workers or bouncing around on Facebook and the internet? > > There are literally millions of places Trump or his campaign could have come up with that information, yet true to form you immediately assume he got it from the worst possible source in order to paint him as a hater. Did he apologize for it? Serious question; I don’t know. If he did, I’d be willing to give him a pass. If he hasn’t… well, we can only assume he stands by it. ---
**Author:** ![inscrutable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a88e4f/32.png) [@inscrutable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inscrutable)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/199 "2015-12-10T14:02:36Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Did he apologize for it? Serious question; I don’t know. If he did, I’d be willing to give him a pass. If he hasn’t… well, we can only assume he stands by it. “Sorry, it’s only 40%.” ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332/200 "2015-12-10T14:21:51Z")
> [@inscrutable](#): > > So it’s OK that blacks have killed only 40% of white homicide victims??? > > Would it still have been RACISM! If Trump cited the correct statistic? > > Seems to be much more outrage over his recent Muslim comment than there was over his Mexican and Black statements, so apparently, people hate Muslims less than they hate Hispanics and Blacks. > > Weird… So you have to go then to still exaggerate the numbers, Why? The FBI reported that the number is closer to 15%. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-for-republicans-if-trump-wins-the-nomination/739332.md?page=11)