# Question regarding dual citizenship of the US and UK **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 17, 2015, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952 "2015-02-17T21:17:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![davidmich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@davidmich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidmich)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2015, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/1 "2015-02-17T21:17:32Z")
> **[Jonathan Ive and the Future of Apple](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/02/23/shape-things-come)** > > Inside the top-secret lab where the world’s most powerful design team created the Apple Watch. “In 2012, Ive was knighted in Buckingham Palace; by then, he and his wife had become U.S. citizens, although they did not relinquish their British passports” I don’t believe giving up one’s British passport is necessary if a British citizen becomes a naturalized US citizen. Is that correct? I look forward to your feedback. davidmich I found this link on the subject but the opinions are contradictory. > **[Yahoo | Mail, Weather, Search, Politics, News, Finance, Sports & Videos](https://www.yahoo.com/)** > > Latest news coverage, email, free stock quotes, live scores and video are just the beginning. Discover more every day at Yahoo! ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2015, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/2 "2015-02-17T21:35:11Z")
There is no requirement to give up another citizenship if you become a naturalized US citizen. The United States has a policy of not _recognizing_ dual citizenships; as far as they’re concerned, you’re a US citizen and nothing else. If you hold another citizenship, that’s between you and the other country.k Tons of people hold dual US/other citizenships. ---
**Author:** ![slash2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@slash2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slash2k)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2015, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/3 "2015-02-17T21:37:19Z")
> [@davidmich](#): > > I don’t believe giving up one’s British passport is necessary if a British citizen becomes a naturalized US citizen. Is that correct? I look forward to your feedback. > davidmich The U.S. does not require giving up a foreign passport (although they will generally [require you to use your U.S. passport to enter/exit the states](http://travel.state.gov/content/travel/english/legal-considerations/us-citizenship-laws-policies/citizenship-and-dual-nationality/dual-nationality.html)). I don’t know what British law says on the subject, however. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2015, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/4 "2015-02-17T21:54:20Z")
The New Yorker article making much ado about nothing; their statement is unnecessary. Some countries don’t allow dual citizenship, or restrict it after the age of majority. The UK and US do not do this, and he has no reason to get rid of his UK citizenship unless he wants to or under some rare circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2015, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/5 "2015-02-17T22:08:24Z")
> [@slash2k](#): > > I don’t know what British law says on the subject, however. Essentially the UK doesn’t care if UK citizens have dual nationality. A joint UK/Australian citizen doesn’t have to do a UK tax return if they are resident in, and only earning in, Australia, for example. The only restriction I can think of offhand is that the UK/Oz citizen cannot access help from the UK High Commission while in Australia. ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/6 "2015-02-18T01:11:56Z")
The US used to say you can’t have dual citizenship, but the problem is that they really can’t control the laws of other countries with respect to citizenship, so they can’t force you to, and in same cases you can’t anyway, give up you foreign citizenship. What they can do is deny you or remove your US citizenship if you do something to compromise it. So basically if you were a dual US citizen and joined a foreign army or foreign diplomatic service, you could loose your US citizenship as you have a somewhat compromised position. Well that’s how it was explained to me by an immigration lawyer ( I am working on US citizenship, just a few years to go) . ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/7 "2015-02-18T02:33:53Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > The US used to say you can’t have dual citizenship. But not since 1967. The US will only take away your citizenship if you become a citizen of another country with the _intention_ of giving up your US citizenship. I intend to emigrate to the UK in 2 years when Cad Jr. is done in high school with full intention of keeping my US passport and filing my US tax returns so they would be hard pressed to prevent me from becoming a dual-citizen 5 years after that. See _Afroyim v Rusk_ about the necessity of intent. ---
**Author:** ![ruadh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d2c977/32.png) [@ruadh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ruadh)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/8 "2015-02-18T06:43:11Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > So basically if you were a dual US citizen and joined a foreign army or foreign diplomatic service, you could loose your US citizenship as you have a somewhat compromised position. No, all you can lose is the presumption that you didn’t intend to give up your US citizenship. It means you may have to explain yourself to State Department officials, rather than them simply assuming that you intended to be a dual national. But if you can satisfy them that you intend to keep your US citizenship, you will. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/9 "2015-02-18T11:02:49Z")
> [@davidmich](#): > > …was knighted in Buckingham Palace; by then, he and his wife had become U.S. citizens, although they did not relinquish their British passports" There shouldn’t be a problem with the citizenship, but there is a problem with the knighthood. The US constitution prohibits titled gentry. If you have such status when you become a citizen, you have to formally state that you relinguish your title to the nobility. Athough I suppose that the Britsh aristocracy probably doesn’t really care what you signed in America. So as a knight, when you visit the Palace, you can probably still wear the red garter; just remember to remove your armor and sword before you travel to America. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![kferr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/71e660/32.png) [@kferr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kferr)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/10 "2015-02-18T11:27:54Z")
I have dual US UK citizenship, I got the UK side about 15 years ago. I looked into some of this at that time. If I remember right I could join the British military and run for local government. On the political side I think you could go as high as being an MP before having to give up the US citizenship. ---
**Author:** ![davidmich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@davidmich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidmich)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/11 "2015-02-18T11:47:09Z")
> **[Why Boris Johnson Is Renouncing His American Citizenship](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2015/02/boris-Johnson-renounces-us-citizenship-tax-bill-mayor-london/385554/)** > > The mayor of London is a quintessential American in many ways—including hating the IRS. Now he's giving up his U.S. passport to avoid double taxation. How does the IRS get wind of Boris Johnson’s (dual British-US citizen) property sale? How do they deliver the bill/How is a US citizen abroad informed that they owe the IRS? Does the IRS keeps tabs on US citizens abroad? ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/12 "2015-02-18T11:56:42Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > The US constitution prohibits titled gentry. It just prohibits the federal government and states from having their own, and prohibits federal officeholders and employees from receiving foreign honors without the consent of Congress. The amendment prohibiting private citizens from accepting foreign honors and titles of nobility was rejected (or, rather, it never gained enough support to be ratified, as technically it’s still out there waiting for enough states to say yes). ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/13 "2015-02-18T12:23:13Z")
Mr. Boris Johnson, the Mayor of — and I swear to heck I have no idea why we _have_ one — London, is **[relinquishing his US citizenship](http://rt.com/uk/232491-london-us-johnson-citizenship/)**, from being born in New York ( not a very unique event — had he been born in Wanker County it would have been far more appealing ). Unlike Churchill he feels this will be a barrier when he is called to office to replace the wretched Cameron. The easiest way out of this imbroglio would be for America to reclaim him, peaceably if they can, forcibly if they must, deny him exit to anywhere abroad, and place him on the right hand of Donald Trump, and in that lair of the Deep Ones dwell together amidst wonder and glory for ever. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/14 "2015-02-18T12:25:37Z")
> [@davidmich](#): > > How does the IRS get wind of Boris Johnson’s (dual British-US citizen) property sale? If he obeyed the law, they got wind of it when he reported it to the IRS on his tax return. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/15 "2015-02-18T12:58:40Z")
> [@Claverhouse](#): > > Unlike Churchill he feels this will be a barrier when he is called to office to replace the wretched Cameron. I don’t think Churchill was a US citizen, until he became [an honorary US citizen in 1963](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honorary_citizen_of_the_United_States). Although his mother was a US citizen, US law at the time of his birth didn’t allow citizenship to descend through the mother, only through a US-citizen father. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/16 "2015-02-18T13:41:10Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > There shouldn’t be a problem with the citizenship, but there is a problem with the knighthood. > The US constitution prohibits titled gentry. If you have such status when you become a citizen, you have to formally state that you relinguish your title to the nobility. So very very wrong. The Constitution outlaws the United States from handing out titles and specifies that a government official (as in does not apply to other Americans) needs the consent of Congress to accept a title. [QUOTE=Article I, Section 9] No title of nobility shall be granted by the United States: and no person holding any office of profit or trust under them, shall, without the consent of the Congress, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title, of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state. [/QUOTE] There is a proposed amendment (never expired) called the Titles of Nobility Amendment (TONA) that would strip a citizen of their US citizenship if they accept a foreign title. > [@](#): > > If any citizen of the United States shall accept, claim, receive or retain, any title of nobility or honour, or shall, without the consent of Congress, accept and retain any present, pension, office or emolument of any kind whatever, from any emperor, king, prince or foreign power, such person shall cease to be a citizen of the United States, and shall be incapable of holding any office of trust or profit under them, or either of them. It came close to being ratified but sorry, it is not in the Constitution although through some misprintings many people in the 1800’s thought it was. IIRC some sovereign citizens still base an argument on those misprintings that claim that it DID pass and since judges are lawyers and lawyers are given the title esquire which is English that they all lost their US citizenship. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/17 "2015-02-18T13:51:53Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > If he obeyed the law, they got wind of it when he reported it to the IRS on his tax return. And also when he filed quarterly returns listing all bank accounts for which he has signing authority, including any businesses or non-profit boards he sits on. The American tax laws are extremely intrusive for Americans living abroad. I have a friend who is dual, and he has to provide quarterly statements of all bank accounts, in Canada, where he has signing authority, to the IRS. That can hamper one’s employment chances, if the Canadian employer is not prepared to allow that information to be filed; they could pass on an American for a position with signing authority, rather than agree to that reporting requirement. ---
**Author:** ![Claverhouse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/13edae/32.png) [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/18 "2015-02-18T14:05:04Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > IIRC some sovereign citizens still base an argument on those misprintings that claim that it DID pass and since judges are lawyers and lawyers are given the title esquire which is English that they all lost their US citizenship. Whereas it is my understanding this ship of Admiralty Law has passengers enobled by a foreign court, as a sovereign person I declare these proceedings null and void. Ship Abandoned ! NOT ACTIONABLE ALL RIGHTS UNALIENABLE CLAIMED, KNOWN AND RESERVED WITHOUT PREJUDICE. ---
**Author:** ![Blue\_Mood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac91a4/32.png) [@Blue\_Mood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blue_Mood)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/19 "2015-02-18T18:16:36Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > If he obeyed the law, they got wind of it when he reported it to the IRS on his tax return. > [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And also when he filed quarterly returns listing all bank accounts for which he has signing authority, including any businesses or non-profit boards he sits on. Filing creates a big burden for US citizens living overseas. Though there are agreements with many countries so as to avoid double-taxation, forms must still be completed. In my case it’s easy, but for others it’s a costly and time-consuming waste of resources, both for the individual and for the IRS workers who have to go through this unnecessary paperwork. Also, any US citizen who has an overseas bank account that has ever had more than $10,000 in it (or who is a signatory on a joint or company account) has a duty to report that account, known as FBAR. My children are dual citizens, so they too will have to adhere to these rules, despite never having lived in the US. Come to think of it, their children will as well, unless they want to renounce their citizenship. Here’s an article explaining the predicament: [NY Times](http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/11/us/11iht-expats11.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0) And there are horror stories out there involving heavy fines. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2015, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952/20 "2015-02-18T19:03:13Z")
And, if you renounce for the purpose of avoiding US tax rules, you get a lifetime exclusion from the US. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-regarding-dual-citizenship-of-the-us-and-uk/712952.md?page=2)