# Question: Without looking him up, do you know who this person is? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 18, 2010, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667 "2010-06-18T13:00:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![QuercusMax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/8baadc/32.png) [@QuercusMax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuercusMax)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/21 "2010-06-18T13:47:25Z")
Never heard of him. ---
**Author:** ![Small\_Clanger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9fc348/32.png) [@Small\_Clanger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Small_Clanger)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/22 "2010-06-18T13:51:09Z")
Another Brit checking in. Grammar school education, never heard of the geezer. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/23 "2010-06-18T13:52:37Z")
**Cal** , is this [the Latin quote](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:YO-i4u8PW0YJ:findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2386/is_1_111/ai_62685555/pg_11/+%22Chesterfield+hits+him+with+the+Latin+original+of+a+proverb%22&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)? > [@](#): > > There is yet another group of proverbs that stand out in these fascinating letters, namely those from other languages–Latin, French, Italian and Spanish. As a man of the world, Lord Chesterfield had lived and travelled widely in Europe, and developed a keen interest in foreign languages. Again and again he advises his son and subsequently the sons of that son to study French, Italian or German. Not surprisingly, he makes use of the rich proverb repertoire of these languages and cultures. When his son was just seven years of age, in a letter dated 17 October 1739, Chesterfield hits him with the Latin original of a proverb and also the English translation to explain the importance of rhetoric for a well-educated person: > > - It is said that a man must be born a poet; but that he can make himself an > orator. **Nascitur Poeta, fit Orator**. This means, that to be a poet one must > be born with a certain degree of strength and vivacity of mind; but that > attention, reading, and labour are sufficient to form an orator (Stanhope > 1901, 2:375). \* ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/24 "2010-06-18T14:00:55Z")
> [@](#): > > Cal, is this the Latin quote? No. I don’t have the book here with me – I’ll post it later. It’s certainly not a latin quote I’d ever encountered before (And I studied latin on my own and in high school), and I wouldn’t call it “famous”. The writer I was critiquing said that he called it “famous” because it was well-known from Chesterfield’s writing. But, as this thread seems to confirm, Chesterfield’s writing doesn’t seem to be famous even among this Board’s bunch of know-it-alls. ---
**Author:** ![EvilTOJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee59a6/32.png) [@EvilTOJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EvilTOJ)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/25 "2010-06-18T14:11:11Z")
Sorry, never heard of him. ---
**Author:** ![gwendee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/35a633/32.png) [@gwendee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gwendee)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/26 "2010-06-18T14:18:37Z")
In my opinion your criticism stands. I think it would be fair to say that I know a lot of obscure stuff. Lord Chesterfield as a name might have crossed through my consciousness at some point, but I have no specific knowledge of him as quoted or quotable. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/27 "2010-06-18T14:44:47Z")
I’m certain that I learned about him in one of my English history classes but that was over 25 years ago. I couldn’t tell you a thing about him now. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/28 "2010-06-18T14:46:51Z")
A further thought occurs to me. Although this author bashes both the politically Right and the Left about equally (an admirable method, in my mind), his political sympathies were nevertheless clear to me – whenever he wanted to give an example of praiseworthy standards or actions he chose someone from the Right side of the aisle, and whenever he wanted an example of incorrect standards or actions it came from the Left. He seemed surprised when I pointed this out, perhaps because he had been at pains to keep his work apolitical, and the bias of his choices wasn’t apparent to himself. (I suspect I’d be similarly tilted, only the other way). The thing is, our own **Bricker** leans the same way, and he’s one of the few who knew anything of Chesterfield in this thread. I know that when I look through magazines like _National Review_ I see plenty of ads for the works of political and ethical writers I see quite a few of this sort and from this era. I get them in mailings from book publishers and self-taught courses as well from the other side of the political aisle. I never see these sorts of things in Left-leaning publications. Is it possible that knowledge of Chesterfield is greater among the conservative establishment? **Bricker** , are your friends and associates more likely to know of him? Could this be another example of the author’s background affecting his attitudes and knowledge in ways he would not immediately be aware of ? ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/29 "2010-06-18T14:49:17Z")
I have heard of him because in any bookstore, library, or alphabetical list of great British authors, he shows up right next to my favorite author, **G. K. Chesterton**. But I haven’t the slightest clue what he wrote or why he’s famous. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/30 "2010-06-18T14:50:10Z")
Never heard of him, and none of those quotes are even more than vaguely familiar. (American woman, 35, public schooled with a college degree) ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/31 "2010-06-18T14:55:15Z")
I’ve heard of him, and knew he was famous for coming up with pithy maxims, though I couldn’t have quoted one. I wouldn’t assume audience familiarity with him. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/32 "2010-06-18T15:08:05Z")
I’ve written three books about him and his place in Western Civilization, and I’m appalled that his name is not remembered along with Chamberlain and Churchill. No. I, too, only know him in the “cultural literacy” sense mentioned above. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/33 "2010-06-18T15:17:43Z")
Never heard of him. The last quote is vaguely familiar in a Franklin-Coveyish kind of way. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/34 "2010-06-18T15:23:19Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > Never heard of him, and none of those quotes are even more than vaguely familiar. > > (American woman, 35, public schooled with a college degree) You mean the quotes in the OP, right? “_Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today_” is so well-worn that it’s essentially cliche. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/35 "2010-06-18T15:30:59Z")
> [@](#): > > “Never put off until tomorrow what you can do today” is so well-worn that it’s essentially cliche. Indeed. It makes me ask if a.) He really did say/write it? (I’ve recently come across other quotes on the internet that turn out to be misattributed) b.) If so, did he originate it? c.) If he didn’t originate it, did he essentially popularize it? The reason that I wonder is because many of his quotes aren’t at all familiar, while others are so familiar they’re virtually cliches. There seems no middle ground, and it seems odd that so several very familiar quotes are attributed to this person that a lot of us have never heard of. if true, he _definitely_ deserves tobe better known. None of the quotes I read in that book, by the way, were of the “cliche familiar” variety. They were all new to me. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/36 "2010-06-18T15:38:09Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Indeed. It makes me ask if > a.) He really did say/write it? (I’ve recently come across other quotes on the internet that turn out to be misattributed) > b.) If so, did he originate it? > c.) If he didn’t originate it, did he essentially popularize it? You may find this page interesting, assuming the accuracy of the quotes therein. > [@](#): > > The proverb is often humorously reversed (see quots. 1869 and 1980). Cf. mid 14th-cent. Fr. _le bien que tu peus faire au matin, n’attens pas le soir ne l’endemain_, do not wait for the evening or the next day (to do) the good which you can do in the morning. > > An olde proverbe‥seith that ‘the goodnesse that thou mayst do this day, do it, and abide nat ne delaye it nat til to-morwe’. > [c 1386 Chaucer Tale of Melibee l. 1793] > > Deferre not vntill to morrow, if thou canst do it to day. > [1616 T. Draxe Adages 42] > > Secretary Cecil‥would ofttimes speak of himself, ‘It shall never be said of me that I will defer till to-morrow what I can do to-day.’ > [1633 J. Howell Familiar Letters 5 Sept. (1903) II. 140] > > **No procrastination; never put off til to-morrow what you can do to-day. > [1749 Chesterfield Letter 26 Dec. (1932) IV. 1478]** > > These slow coaches think that to-morrow is better than to-day, and take for their rule an old proverb turned topsy-turvy—‘Never do to-day what you can put off till tomorrow.’ > [1869 C. H. Spurgeon John Ploughman’s Talk vii.] > > Lord Sackville was‥a lovable, easy-going but indolent peer whose philosophy is best summarized in one of his pet sayings: ‘Never do today what you can possibly put off until tomorrow.’ > [1980 J. Lees-milne Harold Nicolson xv.] > > ‘Brutus, weren’t you going to take down the Christmas lights this weekend?’ ‘No‥Next weekend, Gladys! Never put off till tomorrow what you can put off till next weekend!’ > [2002 Washington Post 16 Feb. C13 (Born Loser comic strip)] EDIT: Googling also reveals that this proverb is quite often attributed to Thomas Jefferson. . ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/37 "2010-06-18T15:39:09Z")
> [@Duke](#): > > The name rang a bell for me but I certainly wouldn’t have remembered who he was, let alone anything “famous” he’d said. Yep. I have seen the second quote before somewhere, but in no way was it linked in my mind with a particular individual. ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/38 "2010-06-18T15:41:12Z")
I have a bachelor’s in English literature and political science and I couldn’t have told you who he was. I _may_ have known in college, but God that was 25 years ago. 😉 So for a general, reasonably educated reader, no. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/39 "2010-06-18T16:41:59Z")
> [@](#): > > You may find this page interesting, assuming the accuracy of the quotes therein. Thank you. One day you must tell me which page it is. An omission I have, in the past, made myself, I must admit. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2010, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667/40 "2010-06-18T16:47:06Z")
Yes, I know who Lord Chesterfield is, mainly in connection with his “letters to his son,” which I read when I was in my early twenties, but also for his connection to Samuel Johnson, whom I was also “into” and read a lot of at about that time. [QUOTE=Wikipedia] In preparation for the work, Johnson wrote a Plan for the Dictionary. This Plan was patronised by Philip Stanhope, 4th Earl of Chesterfield, to Johnson’s displeasure. Seven years after first meeting Johnson to go over the work, Chesterfield wrote two anonymous essays in The World recommending the Dictionary. He complained that the English language lacked structure and argued in support of the dictionary. Johnson did not like the tone of the essay, and he felt that Chesterfield had not fulfilled his obligations as the work’s patron. Johnson wrote a letter expressing this view and harshly criticising Chesterfield, saying “Is not a patron, my lord, one who looks with unconcern on a man struggling for life in the water, and when he has reached ground, encumbers him with help? The notice which you have been pleased to take of my labours, had it been early, had been kind: but it has been delayed till I am indifferent and cannot enjoy it; till I am solitary and cannot impart it; till I am known and do not want it.” Chesterfield, impressed by the language, kept the letter displayed on a table for anyone to read. [/QUOTE] I think I first ran across both Chesterfield’s letters to his son and Johnson’s letter that is quoted above in some anthology of literature. Anyone who’s studied the English Lit of Johnson’s era is going to know about Chesterfield, but alas, I think that era is somewhat out of fashion nowadays. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/question-without-looking-him-up-do-you-know-who-this-person-is/543667.md?page=3)