I wonder just how fucked up some people must already be to try krokodil when they know what it does to their flesh.
It’s not. Krokodil is worse than heroin in every way except one: even a self-destructing junkie can make it. A dose of krokodil isn’t even better than heroin’s withdrawal symptoms.
That’s what I think whenever I hear about a case like Hoffman. I hear about how people threw away, their careers, their families, even their lives, just to get more drugs, and I think, “Man, drugs must be GREAT!”
I think you’re overlooking the importance of ego. Especially for those in the performance arts, where completion is unending and rejection commonplace. How you gonna nail that audition if you’re feeling insecure? Wondering if you can measure up to your last ‘hit’? When a little coke will make you feel like you freaking own Hollywood!
Hollywood seems all about, “What have they done lately?”, “Can they do it again?”, and “How the mighty have fallen/where are they now?” That’s pretty tough ground for an aging star.
And I suspect, once you’ve ‘enhanced’ your ego, to get through one thing, pretty soon you easily feel like without it they’ll see through you.
Yeah, that’s pretty much what I was going to say.
I’m really not interested in drugs- okay, I’ve tried weed a few times, but I’ve never been tempted by anything else… except a few years back at a party, when I got a bit too drunk and a guy I had a really big crush on offered me a line of ketamine (really big round here for some reason). I was actually a bit too drunk and uncoordinated to manage it properly, but I would have tried anything he offered me at that point.
It really freaked me out the next morning, but I can see how someone (especially someone who’s always had the ‘drugs will KILL YOU’ message hammered in) could wake up after something like that and go “Hey! I feel fine, and I don’t feel a desperate need to have some more- it’s obviously not as dangerous as everyone told me!” So I can see how someone would start occasionally socially using.
Plus, if you’re a really successful person, it’s quite possible you don’t really know anyone who’s messed up their life with drugs (well, maybe some total losers you lost touch with ages ago, but you’re a successful person, you’re not like them); most of your friends are probably successful too, and some of them will likely be taking illegal drugs…
A quote from Trainspotting:
That was me with my first ever valium. The wife doesn’t like to ride airplanes so her doc prescribes a half-dozen diazepams when she has to travel. I was ramping up for a good panic attack one evening and she gave me a spare 5 mg. Well that was just dandy–panic was snuffed and I felt kinda [del]comfortable[/del] comfy. Hit it again several weeks later when I was entering a manic rage and poof back to normal. Visited the shrink, chatted a bit and got the prescription for “30 - 5mg as needed.” It didn’t take more than a couple more trips to the pill bottle before I realized 5mg wasn’t doing anything, and then 10mg wasn’t helping. When I was getting ready to take 15mg I stopped and realized what was going on. I could just as easily gone for 20–it’s just tolerance, not addicton, right? And what’s the next step from there if not augmenting with rum or finding something a bit stronger. Because it would be ok as long as I’m combating a symptom, right? Manic rage & panic harms relationships. If dope can chase it away, everybody wins, right? Don’t I owe it to my family to keep myself in check, and to myself to just be content for a change? Oh, YOU do heroin? Well you’re presentable and seem to have a handle on things. I suppose if I’m mindful I can manage it, right?
That’s how I see this 40-something family guy with a decent life climbing aboard the drug train. Just to be clear–I never went past the 10mg Valium step, but the hypothetical progression is exactly how my thought process would take me.
I’m not the biggest Russell Brand fan, but I thought this was an interesting perspective:
That’s the answer. For some people, life is good just as it is. For others, it isn’t, and drugs make it so. That’s why it’s hard for non-users to understand the motivation of users. “I don’t need drugs, so why should anyone else?”
It is not 100% of people that are “addictable” to hard drugs. IIRC, only 25% or so of people who use heroin get addicted to it. So for each Hoffman there are 3 others who use heroin and are not addicted and can lead productive lives. Maybe even more productive because they can kinda self-medicate.
Actually, I have no idea whether Hoffman was one of the 25%. Maybe he was in the 75% and just got a bad batch of heroin.
Now if there was a method to find out before trying it whether you are one of the 25% or 75%…
I read this today and thought about this thread. This might be useful to you, Sampiro:
700 Words that explain exactly what it feels like to do heroin
The implication that people are broken before they become addicts is a fallacy. It’s true that a large number of people begin using drugs because they have underlying problems they are trying to medicate. But it is also possible for an apparently “normal” person to become an addict.
Remembering that the addiction process is a progressive one and that the disease progresses in roughly identifiable stages it can be noted that there is a reward for using at each level of progression.
A beginning user may be rewarded by increased social good cheer and comfort.
When the usage progresses to where there are problems related to the use then the reward can become escape from worldly concerns/physical pain. Using to feel the high becomes the reason for using.
In later stage dependency the reward is to use to feel normal because when the addict isn’t using he is physically ill (withdrawal.)
Late stage chemical use aims for oblivion. And so the addict has been cheated of a good friend which provided confidence, happiness and a state of well-being to a curse which drives him to seek a state as close as possible to living death. It’s no substitute at all but one over which there is no longer rational choice.
It’s really simple. You can feel better, have more confidence, have more motivation and be happier with yourself by simply taking a drug. Once you realize that, it’s hard to forget it.
I don’t know about that division there. I think it might just be dumb random luck and circumstance that decide who gets addicted and who walks away.
I don’t know. I smoked (cigarettes) for something like 20 years, then quit and never did again. Wasn’t that hard for me. Don’t feel any craving to smoke today at all. I was on very strong painkillers a couple of times - morphine, demerol - for months, and when they stopped them, it was fine, no withdrawal symptoms etc. Don’t think it’s luck and circumstance. Probably genetic.
What if instead of that you felt normal for the first time ever, your entire life was objectively better, felt happier, slept better, got along with people better. What then? Might have wanted to keep taking it right?
I liked the painkillers. Called them my “happy pills”. But I knew you don’t take that stuff unless it’s for pain. So - quit, and no problem.
You’re talking about psychological addiction. Not physical one. I like cheesecake. It makes me feel better, and it tastes great. After I eat it I feel objectively better, feel happier, and probably get along with people better (at least for a short while). Yet I know it is not good for me. So I don’t eat it (except for very special occasions).
There is a difference between casual drug use and addiction. Apparently some people (again, from the stats I saw, 75% of all people) can use heroin and not get addicted. So they could use it casually and may even overuse it because they like it (like people overeat because they like it) but it wouldn’t be an “addiction”. An “addiction” is something you cannot quit even if you REALLY want to.
From what I’ve learned going through rehab, intensive outpatient addiction therapy, NA and the like, this is what I believe too. In one of my group therapy groups I was taught that there are three things that cause the perfect storm for addiction: using the drug for the first time, availability of the drug for future use, and the genes and/or brain chemistry to get hooked.
My father used drugs in his younger years. I’m not talking about smoking pot - though he did that daily - I’m talking about cocaine, methamphetamines, barbiturates, hallucinogens, etc. He told me he did cocaine almost daily for years, but when I was born he put it down and never looked back.
I was in active opiate addiction for years. Started with prescription pills then switched to heroin because it was cheaper. I went through rehab multiple times before I finally put it down. It took me by the face and drug me through hell. I’d never wish that on anyone. By the time I realized I had a problem it was too late. I didn’t use to get high, I used to not get sick, to be able to go to work, to just feel something close to normal. And every time I’d quit I’d make it through the worst of it, but that nagging feeling of being uncomfortable in my own skin would drive me over the edge.
For the record, I’ve been clean for four years now with the exception of one use in October of 2012. But it took a lot for me to get to where I am now. I still drink, I’ll occasionally do other things if I’m out partying, but as long as I don’t touch the junk I’m fine.
Heroin truly is it’s own demon in my eyes. I think some people assume that drug addicts just don’t care what they do to others, but that’s not the case.
I’m surprised that you’ve had all that treatment and that no one addressed the concept of cross-addiction with you. It’s the idea that although various mood-altering substances may seem different and affect different areas of the brain the one thing they have in common is the release of dopamine into a brain already conditioned to habitual overuse of dopamine.
It has been addressed, and for the first two years of my sobriety I didn’t touch a single mind or mood altering chemical with the exception of one drink on my 21st birthday (which I celebrated in the same week as six months clean). I think my issue was mainly with a physical dependency that formed after being on pain medication for an extended period of time due to an injury. Once I finally got over the physical withdrawals and the PAWS (Post-acute Withdrawal Syndrome) which lasted well over a year, knowing what I’d been through to get to the point where I could wake up without feeling like I needed something to get out of bed killed my urge to use. I still think about it from time to time, I’m not going to say I don’t. And I know if I were to touch any kind of opioid the risk would be extremely high, so I steer clear. I feel normal again, and I’m finally happy with myself, so no need to go back there. Plus I’m fucking terrified of what I was.
I consider myself lucky. In N.A. they teach that in order to be “clean” you can’t do any kind of drug (including alcohol). I know for some people that is the case, and until I had a decent amount of time behind me and learned how to live without it, I couldn’t do that either. Some of the “old-timers” would say I’m still in active addiction since I drink once or twice a week, but I say screw them.
I’m happy, I feel better than I ever have, and I don’t need them to tell me otherwise.