# Quit jogging in the street you neuticle! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 30, 2005, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234 "2005-08-30T12:15:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/161 "2005-09-03T03:11:09Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > [The law in New Hampshire](http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/XXI/265/265-37.htm) requires that drivers shall give pedestrians in the roadway an audible signal when necessary; when a runner is endangering the public and himself by illegally running in the roadway, it is my civic duty to warn him of the potential hazard. I always exercise due care to avoid them, in accordance with the law. To “make them jump out of their skins” isn’t necessary or lawful. You’re a scumbag if you do this kind of shit. In fact, you are a very specific type of scumbag. A very common type. You’re an innefectual loser lacking in any qualities that would lend a person consideration or notice. Meek, weak, and stupid. The feeling of power you have behind the wheel is the **only** time in your life when you feel like you are actually in control and a person to be reckoned with. Safe and protected within your vehicle, and capable of driving away real fast without being held personally accountable for your actions, suddenly you feel like your somebody. Like all cowards you take advantage of your only opportunity to fulfill your sick little revenge fantasy. But you know what? You don’t fool me. I **know** you don’t actually do it. You just fantasize about it. The fact is that even under the circumstances you describe, you’re just too much of a coward and a pussy to actually risk it. > [@](#): > > Since you are back, I would like to comment on this argument:If this were organized races, sponsored by a running club, they were in all likelihood covered by a permit from the local government, in which case they are entirely legal, the same a parade. However, running in a sanctioned race with a permit, and going out for your morning jog are two entirely different things. Unless you have a permit; do you have a permit? I didn’t think so. I assume there is a permit for the races. However, I **know** there isn’t one for the Sunday club runs which are informal and take place partially on the roads. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/162 "2005-09-03T03:26:42Z")
New Hampshire being another state where “roadway” is defined as being the area exclusive of the shoulder of the road. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/163 "2005-09-03T03:28:50Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > To “make them jump out of their skins” isn’t necessary or lawful. \*\*You lying, scumsucking coward! You have fabricated a slanderous quote I never uttered, not in this thread or any other. False attribution of quotes, especially of heinous, defamatory words, is grounds for banning from this board, and I have reported your post to the moderators. See ya!\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/164 "2005-09-03T03:29:29Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > New Hampshire being another state where “roadway” is defined as being the area exclusive of the shoulder of the road. Cite. PDF page 35. The shoulder ain’t the road. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/165 "2005-09-03T03:43:47Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > **You lying, scumsucking coward!** Scumsucking? Never! Well, just once. > [@](#): > > \*\*You have fabricated a slanderous quote I never uttered, not in this thread or any other. > > False attribution of quotes, especially of heinous, defamatory words, is grounds for banning from this board, and I have reported your post to the moderators. > > See ya!\*\* Well, I see you’re actually techically correct. Double checking, I see that the actual quote was “dive into the gutters,” not “jump out of their skins.” Somehow I don’t think the mods will find this distinction particularly impressive, but I do apologize for not quoting your filthy sentiment accurately. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/166 "2005-09-03T03:45:20Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > New Hampshire being another state where “roadway” is defined as being the area exclusive of the shoulder of the road. If there is a sidewalk, you cannot legally run on the shoulder either. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/167 "2005-09-03T03:49:33Z")
Did Prefontaine have sex with your girlfriend or something? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/168 "2005-09-03T10:21:36Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Did Prefontaine have sex with your girlfriend or something? He could never find the time, he was too busy ass-fucking your mother’s bloody, syphilitic bunghole. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/169 "2005-09-03T16:45:38Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Well, I see you’re actually techically correct. Double checking, I see that the actual quote was “dive into the gutters,” not “jump out of their skins.” > > Somehow I don’t think the mods will find this distinction particularly impressive, but I do apologize for not quoting your filthy sentiment accurately. Altering the words someone else posted is wrong, **Scylla**. It’s unfair, not only to the original poster but to anyone who reads a thread. Posters shouldn’t have to track back, search, dig, etc. to check if a quote is accurate. Do _not_ do this again. Veb ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/170 "2005-09-03T20:11:05Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > Altering the words someone else posted is wrong, **Scylla**. It’s unfair, not only to the original poster but to anyone who reads a thread. Posters shouldn’t have to track back, search, dig, etc. to check if a quote is accurate. I agree. That’s why I acknowledged the error and apologized. Respectfully, I don’t see any need for the ethics lecture. > [@](#): > > Do _not_ do this again. I didn’t **do it** the first time. You seem to be suggesting that I deliberately miquoted this jerk. I didn’t. I read the quote I wanted and in the 30 seconds it took to change pages and type my reply, I misremembered it. I acknowledged the error and apologized even though my error did not substantively change the meaning of what I quoted. I don’t beleive that I’ve ever made such a mistake before in 10,000 + posts. Based on that, I think your warning is ill-considered, and I think it’s unreasonable to demand that I not make such errors in the future when every indicator should show you that it was a simple and inadvertent mistake. Since it was an accident, I didn’t decide to do it. While it’s unlikely to happen again, I can’t decide **not to** either. Sheesh. I don’t know whether to dive for the gutter or jump out of my skin. ---
**Author:** ![zenith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e19b73/32.png) [@zenith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zenith)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/171 "2005-09-03T20:15:16Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > I think this brings us back to the beginning. If a jogger is running such that cars have to swerve to avoid them, then they are selfish. I’ve had only the one incident with a car alluded to earlier. I’ve never been yelled at by a driver or swerved around. Plus, I live (for another two weeks!) in Manhattan. It’s not just not practicable to run on the sidewalk, it’s not possible. I run about a mile on the street to get to a path where I do most of my run, and then the mile home. People in Manhattan don’t have cars, and I have to get to the path somehow. > > Let me use an example of why it is safer in the street. When cars pull out of driveways, or out of parking lots, they inevitably turn on the engine and back out across the sidewalk, stopping only when they reach the actual road. They stop there because they are looking for vehicular traffic. No one (myself included) stops before they get to the sidewalk, passes over it, and stops again. > > Two joggers, one on the sidewalk, one on the shoulder. The one on the shoulder is protected by the fact that the car pulling out is looking for other cars. The one on the sidewalk has a better chance of being hit (albeit at a hopefullylow speed). > > I’m not just running on the street because I can, and I’m flaunting it to those bastard drivers. I’m doing it in the interest of safety and efficacy. Hey, idiot! Run on the track, walk on the sidewalk. I’m not a runner, but I do quite a bit of walking, and I do it without my ears full of music. At walking speeds, you can react to people’s pulling out of driveways. Running, you’re somewhat in an endorphin-induced haze and ,if you’re the typical jogger, you’ve got your ears full of music or cellphone on headphones. Walk,unimpaired, to your track. Then cram your ears with music or cellphone, or whatever, and do your running. You’re no better than the motorist who drives too fast and with too many distractions. Travelling too fast for conditions on foot is just as dangerous as doing it in a car. Your post says to me , “I’m too goddamn important to have to stop at driveways. I’ll just break the law and run in the street and inconvenience some more people who aren’t anywhere near as important as me.” What an asshole! ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/172 "2005-09-03T20:29:20Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > I agree. That’s why I acknowledged the error and apologized. Respectfully, I don’t see any need for the ethics lecture. Yeah, I noticed your acknowledgment and apology of the error. FWIW, this one was borderline. The ‘ethics lecture’ is pretty much boilerplate explanation for why misquotes cause problems for readers, i.e. the reason behind the rule, for the benefit and elucidation of all. (gag) > [@](#): > > Based on that, I think your warning is ill-considered, and I think it’s unreasonable to demand that I not make such errors in the future when every indicator should show you that it was a simple and inadvertent mistake. If it’s any solace (probably not), this is under discussion right now by mods because we’re not very comfortable with the rigidity of the rule either. I debated for a while before issuring the warning because it seemed more like a technical violation than one of malicious intent. We’re hashing out clarifications right now and I’ll be quite willing to recind the warning if the process goes that way. ---
**Author:** ![overlyverbose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/9dc877/32.png) [@overlyverbose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/overlyverbose)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/173 "2005-09-03T21:04:04Z")
> [@Mooch](#): > > Oh dammit. 🙂 > > The joints thing may make sense - why don’t they jog on the grass? Or if their joints are so bad that the asphalt seems so much softer - pick a lower impact type of excercise. We have a rather large lake a few blocks to the east. > > The way they roll their eyes you would think I was driving on their personal excercise track. Another runner checking in. I run in the road whenever I can because it _does_ feel a lot softer on the joints (especially if you’re doing a long run); however, if I can’t find a street that’s nice and wide with a pedestrian lane, I usually pick streets that have sidewalks and jump on the sidewalk if a car is nearby. I think it’s silly to worry about making a personal record over the possibility of getting myself killed. And in answer to your question about doing lower impact exercise over running - I find running a lot more efficient. To burn the same amount of calories on a walk, I’d have to walk twice as long than I would have to if I were running. Also, since your footstrike is different when you’re walking versus running and I’m used to running, walking fast enough to burn more calories for me is kind of uncomfortable (which probably means that I ought to be doing it to develop additional muscles, but I’m a lazy person). The way my feet hit the ground and the way my legs work while running is a lot more comfortable than if I were walking fast enough to get a workout. Of course, I have no problems walking to get from A to B - it’s powerwalking that kicks my ass. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/174 "2005-09-03T21:33:43Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > Yeah, I noticed your acknowledgment and apology of the error. FWIW, this one was borderline. The ‘ethics lecture’ is pretty much boilerplate explanation for why misquotes cause problems for readers, i.e. the reason behind the rule, for the benefit and elucidation of all. (gag) Well, as long as we’re serving to better humanity, than I’m cool with it. > [@](#): > > If it’s any solace (probably not), this is under discussion right now by mods because we’re not very comfortable with the rigidity of the rule either. I debated for a while before issuring the warning because it seemed more like a technical violation than one of malicious intent. We’re hashing out clarifications right now and I’ll be quite willing to recind the warning if the process goes that way. I appreciate your taking the time to explain that to me. Personally, I’m not completely broken up about the warning. The thing that I’ll offer for your consideration is that Mr. Homicidal Fixation of Joggers here, **used** you and the rigidity of the rules, to rhetorical advantage… drawing the foul as it were. Personally I think your warning should have read: " **Scylla** while it looks like a mistake, you **are** responsible to quote other people accurately, and can be held accountable when you don’t. Be more careful in the future or there will be consequences. **Fear Itself**. You worthless meatbag. Do not use the Report function to gain personal satisfaction in petty bickering. No harm no foul. Scylla acknowledged the error, so climb off your cross, light up a lucky, have a Coke and a Smile and shut the fuck up." ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/175 "2005-09-03T21:37:51Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Personally I think your warning should have read: > > " **Scylla** while it looks like a mistake, you **are** responsible to quote other people accurately, and can be held accountable when you don’t. Be more careful in the future or there will be consequences. > > **Fear Itself**. You worthless meatbag. Do not use the Report function to gain personal satisfaction in petty bickering. No harm no foul. Scylla acknowledged the error, so climb off your cross, light up a lucky, have a Coke and a Smile and shut the fuck up." Respectfully, I don’t see any need for the ethics lecture. ---
**Author:** ![TVeblen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4bbf92/32.png) [@TVeblen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TVeblen)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/176 "2005-09-03T23:09:15Z")
Okay, here’s the consensus after discussion: The purpose of the rule is to prevent misunderstanding of what someone actually meant when posting. We already allow some latitude in quoting, e.g. bolding for emphasis, to paraphrase, express skepticism, etc. Unless an alteration of a quote significantly changes the original poster’s intent then it’s no big deal–and no warning is deserved. If anyone feels they’ve been maliciously misquoted, he/she is free to document the changes in support of their honor, argument, whatever. I’ve recinded your warning, **Scylla** –my apologies, btw–and made note of that in The Official Record we maintain. Veb ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/177 "2005-09-03T23:29:25Z")
> [@zenith](#): > > Hey, idiot! Run on the track, walk on the sidewalk. > > I’m not a runner, but I do quite a bit of walking, and I do it without my ears full of music. At walking speeds, you can react to people’s pulling out of driveways. > > Running, you’re somewhat in an endorphin-induced haze and ,if you’re the typical jogger, you’ve got your ears full of music or cellphone on headphones. > > Walk,unimpaired, to your track. Then cram your ears with music or cellphone, or whatever, and do your running. > > You’re no better than the motorist who drives too fast and with too many distractions. Travelling too fast for conditions on foot is just as dangerous as doing it in a car. > > Your post says to me , “I’m too goddamn important to have to stop at driveways. I’ll just break the law and run in the street and inconvenience some more people who aren’t anywhere near as important as me.” What an asshole! Stop at driveways. Every driveway. That’s too dumb to respond to. Yeah, I’ll go hit the track. In Manhattan. We’ve lots of those around. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/178 "2005-09-03T23:39:09Z")
> [@Fiveyearlurker](#): > > Stop at driveways. Every driveway. That’s too dumb to respond to. I’ll bet those traffic signals are just to dumb to stop at as well. > [@](#): > > Yeah, I’ll go hit the track. In Manhattan. We’ve lots of those around. [Central Park Reservoir Running Track](http://www.centralparknyc.org/virtualpark/thereservoir/reservoir) > [@](#): > > The Reservoir, which covers a large area of Central Park from east to west and from 86th Street to 96th Street, was constructed between 1858 and 1862. It is probably best known for the 1.58 mile track surrounding it, where thousands of runners tone up every day. But that’s probably not conveeeenient for you, is it? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/179 "2005-09-03T23:48:37Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > I’ve recinded your warning, **Scylla** –my apologies, btw–and made note of that in The Official Record we maintain. > > Veb 39 indictments… 0 convictions. I have a permanent record? Can I see it? Fair credit reporting and all. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2005, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234/180 "2005-09-04T01:01:39Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > I’ll bet those traffic signals are just to dumb to stop at as well. > [Central Park Reservoir Running Track](http://www.centralparknyc.org/virtualpark/thereservoir/reservoir)But that’s probably not conveeeenient for you, is it? Look at a map and realize that some people in Manhattan don’t live anywhere near Central Park. It’s a pretty big island, and we don’t have cars here. Because it’s an island where anyone who can afford a car is an elitist. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/quit-jogging-in-the-street-you-neuticle/319234.md?page=10)