In 20 years time you’ll know you were not even wrong 
I know I (foolishly) mentioned the Smiths as a point of comparison, I didn’t mean that you could actually try and compare the two on a like for like basis - that would be an error of scale.
REM’s stature is not in doubt - I don’t rate them in the top drawer myself, but you can clearly make the argument. Their influence and legacy is a good discussion because it’s harder to quantify than other bands with a more polarised sound / image.
I’m kind of astonished that Murmur is so low. For many years it was always near the tops of these sorts of lists. So yes, it will be interesting to see if there is a rediscovery and reassessment some years down the road.
And I will not fight with Smiths fans. Those guys are great too. I hope both bands are rediscovered by teenaged archaeologists of the future, digging through dusty record bins.
A band can be pretty dire and still be highly influential, yet it still does not make them great.
I won’t deny they got lots of airtime, sold lots of plastic, plenty of t-shirts and its hard to imagine that most musos have not heard their material and been influenced by it, this still does not make REM great. I cannot deny they are rather wealthy and that I will never be as popular in anything I ever do - still, I can’t connect with their material, heck I’ve even picked out Madonna and ABBA stuff I like better - this from someone who does have a large amount of Indy music in his collection.
I find ‘Losing my religion’ an odd sort of concept for a song, how does someone who loses his temper and become so angry get to sound so drearily miserable - it should have been called ‘Losing my gravestone’ it is just so depressing.
There just isn’t any joy, vicarious living, passion, or innovation - I honestly do not get it, and never have. On the other hand, there are no absolute duffer songs, they all seem to sit in a mediocre dimension, never reaching up, outward or even taking risks.
I can go with a band that takes a risk that it can’t pull off, REM never did that - if you don’t take a chance then you can’t climb the heights.
I’m just as astonished that Automatic for the People is that low. While Murmur hits more the sweet spot for the kind of music I tend to like, I’d think AFTP would rank high on a Rolling Stone list.
Of course, music taste is subjective and opinions are like assholes and all that, so it’s pointless to argue about it. But regardless of your expereince of their music, to say there is no “passion” in any of their music is on-it’s-face ludicrous, as is “never taking risks.” Those statements make your opinions about REM easily ignored, IMO.
I don’t know about that. When I listen to Murmur, I’m doing so a bit retroactively: I hadn’t really started listening to R.E.M.'s work until maybe the 2000s, while going through my post-punk phase (well, it’s more than a phase.) Comparing it with other albums at the time, it sounds quite fresh and different to me, combining the drive of post-punk with the jangle of a band like the Byrds. Wonderful melodic bass work there by Mike Mills. It’s one of my favorite albums for just listening to the bass. And then it has these atmospheric slow to mid-tempo numbers with piano, vibraphone, etc. I wasn’t listening to them at the time (I was only 8), but I hear a unique sound for the time, so I don’t think it’s fair to say they didn’t take any chances. They certainly mixed things up on their debut LP vs their previous release, the Chronic Town EP.
Hmmm…re-listening to Murmur after all these years is perhaps upping my lukewarm estimation of REM.
On those early albums, the production work of Mitch Easter and Don Dixon is a big part of the sound.
If you like that vibe, you might also give a listen to the album Cypress from Mitch Easter’s band, Let’s Active.
Maybe the reason for your post is that you already knew this, but the similarity of the Decemberist’s The King Is Dead to R.E.M. is more than just influence: Peter Buck played guitar on three of the songs, including Calamity Song. That opening riff, and in fact the whole song, could easily be vintage R.E.M.
Good points. Another band from Athens in a similar vein is Pylon. They formed a bit before R.E.M. and were a big part of the early Athens music scene. R.E.M. later recorded a version of their song “Crazy”.
“Crazy”
Missed edit window…
Oh, well, as long as we’re trotting out music generated by that same group of Georgia-NC contemporaries, I think Don Dixon is playing on this catchy-as-hell song. It’s by a buddy of his, anyway. This song (which is not at all in the style of R.E.M.) will feature prominently in the soundtrack if and when I ever direct a quirky independent movie:
Buddha, Buddha - Rick Rock
We now return you to your regularly-scheduled R.E.M. thread.
My favorite 80’s band, by a long shot. I love those IRS albums, and believe that the songs sound fresh (at least to my ears).
Here are a handful of songs that I adore still.
Harborcoat.
Sitting Still.
Cuyahoga.
7 Chinese Brothers.
Begin the Begin.
These Days.
I Believe.
Can’t Get There From Here.
Laughing.
I always liked this Don Dixon song. It used to get quite a bit of airplay on the college radio station.
“Praying Mantis”
In the early eighties as a teenager I was channel flicking TV and there was a late night show whose name I’ve forgotten that used to feature whole concerts by obscure alternative bands. I stopped on the show for a few seconds, listened, flicked channels again, then thought, “Hey, wait, what was that?” and flicked back. It was a concert by some band that played highly melodic, minor key tunes, and had this really full sound even though they were a four piece in which the singer didn’t play an instrument. And they could really play, which stood them apart from much plastic pop of the time. A few songs in I knew I had to watch to the end to find out the band’s name.
I’m a bit late to the thread, but I’m just listening to Automatic For the People and browsing CS, so I have to comment. If it wasn’t for Wilco, I’d say that R.E.M. was the last great American rock band. Not being from the U.S., I discovered them late when Document came out and the singles got airplay in Germany. I really got infected when Out Of Time came out and been a fan since then. Of course I know their early work by now and won’t dismiss it (it’s great), but for me their peak was from Document to New Adventures In Hifi. When Bill Berry went, it was over, nevermind the occasional decent song or album. I was born in 1968 and the eighties should be my reminiscing era, but I hated most of the mainstream music of that time and hadn’t access to all the good stuff that was being made then, living in a small village in Germany pre-Internet. So it was the nineties when all boundaries between corporate rock and alternative were broken when my real musical socialization took place, and R.E.M. were a big part of that. So a lot of my favorite albums of all time are from then, but Automatic is the best album of the nineties, hands down. I don’t understand the comments about R.E.M. becoming radio-friendly or commercial, because I find that listening to Murmur is just as pleasant as listening to say Out Of Time, the sound isn’t that much different, and the band really never did get much out of the way of sounding lovely. Pavement, they ain’t.
I even will defend their two most controversial songs, because I both like them. Ok, Everybody Hurts may sound terrible to a depressed person (and I speak from experience, having been depressed quite some chunk of my grown life) with the “cheer up” message, but there is some good advice in it like “take comfort in your friends”, and the melody is just irresistible . And “Shiny Happy People” is just good fun (and it got Kate Pierson as a bonus) that even a cynic like me can enjoy.
Oh, Murmur is pleasant, but it doesn’t sound like “radio” music to me, even today. It doesn’t have the polished sheen that the later albums have. It’s night and day to me. It’s not an album I would have been ready for in high school, but Out of Time and Green were “clean” enough for my ears at the time.
“Shiny Happy People” is a wonderful song! That said, I don’t see anyone knocking it in this thread.
No not here yet, but I have seen it knocked and made fun of quite some time.
Maybe the difference is that I wasn’t listening to radio music exclusively since 1983 because I had some friends who were into punk rock, some really crude stuff, which opened my eyes to explore any kind of music. But I have never given up the love for a good melody, and R.E.M. always delivered much in that regard.
This. Along with Nightswimming, Man in the Moon, Losing My Religion, Orange Crush, Great Beyond, etc. I don’t know if today’s kids (or kids down the road) would hear the song and go “Oh, yeah, that’s R.E.M.”, but they would at least know the songs.