# R.S.V.P.
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [March 27, 2000, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395 "2000-03-27T21:06:00Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@MR.REED](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MR.REED)
#### Post date: [March 27, 2000, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/1 "2000-03-27T21:06:00Z")
What is the actual meaning of the acronyme R.S.V.P.
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### Author:  [@Trout\_Mask\_Replica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trout_Mask_Replica)
#### Post date: [March 27, 2000, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/2 "2000-03-27T21:08:00Z")
It stands for _repondez s’il vous plait_, the French for ‘Please respond’.
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TMR
You will buy the ukulele, and touch every place.
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### Author:  [@MR.REED](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MR.REED)
#### Post date: [March 27, 2000, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/3 "2000-03-27T22:09:00Z")
thank you. I was told that it was of French origin but I like to confirm my information.
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### Author:  [@MR.REED](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MR.REED)
#### Post date: [March 27, 2000, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/4 "2000-03-27T22:14:00Z")
thank you. I was told that it was of French origin but I like to confirm my information.
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### Author:  [@RussellM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RussellM)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/5 "2000-03-28T12:43:00Z")
MR.REED
> [@](#):
>
> What is the actual meaning of the acronyme R.S.V.P.
The \* meaning \* you know already.
\*repondez s’il vous plait \* is the literal translation not the meaning, and is not really the French for ‘Please respond’ as the French no longer use the term.
This is one of many expressions which the English language has borrowed from others, and kept hold of while the original has changed. The French no longer live in cul-de-sacs or eat hors d’oeuvres.
If anyone is interested in word etymology, I can recommend Bill Bryson’s books on the English language.
Russell
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### Author:  [@RussellM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RussellM)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/6 "2000-03-28T12:44:00Z")
and it’s an acronym
Russell
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### Author:  [@ChuckSki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChuckSki)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/7 "2000-03-28T14:44:00Z")
More accurately, it’s an initialism. Acronyms are usually pronouncable, such as radar, WAC, laser, or zip (code). Initialisms are usually said as the letters they are, such as USN, LAPD, NCAA, c.o.d., and r.s.v.p. Initialisms may or may not have/need periods. Properly used acronyms nearly always avoid periods.
The above is referenced in my United States Government Printing Office (USGPO) Style Manual and in the AP Style Guide.
Chuck L.
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“The intellectuals’ chief cause of anguish are one another’s works.”
Jacques Barzun
Cheers! CAL
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### Author:  [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)
#### Post date: [March 29, 2000, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/8 "2000-03-29T06:37:00Z")
hmmmpph. A lot you know, Chuck. We been sayin’ rizvip fo’ years.
Did’ja get a rizvip on that meetin’ you called?
I rizvipped the ol’ man that we’d have it done today.
Looks like a acr’nym to me.
(Point taken on the style book, of course.)
* * *
Tom~
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### Author:  [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)
#### Post date: [March 29, 2000, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/9 "2000-03-29T06:45:00Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Originally posted by RussellM:
> \*\*MR.REED
> The \* meaning \* you know already.
> \*repondez s’il vous plait \* is the literal translation not the meaning, and is not really the French for ‘Please respond’ as the French no longer use the term.
>
> This is one of many expressions which the English language has borrowed from others, and kept hold of while the original has changed. The French no longer live in cul-de-sacs or eat hors d’oeuvres.
> Russell\*\*
What is this…Neuveaux French? Have these terms become tres gouche? Or, the French don’t say that, either? I knew when I’d get out of school, they’d change all the rules, just so we’d have to learn it all over again!
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“They’re coming to take me away ha-ha, ho-ho, hee-hee, to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time… :)” - Napoleon IV
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### Author:  [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/10 "2000-03-28T20:23:00Z")
Doesn’t anyone here watch _Laverne and Shirley_. Miss Feeny tells us that is stands for “responso, very promptly.”
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### Author:  [@Andy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/11 "2000-03-28T20:30:00Z")
My french is awful, but it seems to me it translates literally as ‘reply if it pleases you’.
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### Author:  [@Powers106](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Powers106)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/12 "2000-03-28T20:51:00Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Originally posted by android209:
> **My french is awful, but it seems to me it translates literally as ‘reply if it pleases you’.**
S’il vous plait (formal version) and s’il te plait (informal version) both mean “please”, literally, “if it pleases you (to do so for me)”.
As for RSVP and the French no longer using it, I disagree. I’ve seen it used plenty of times in the same context.
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Even if I had a signature, I doubt I’d have room for it.
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### Author:  [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/13 "2000-03-28T21:19:00Z")
OK, seriously now:
Was this a joke?
Don’t you know how to use a dictionary?
They can really be chockablock with information on what words **and abbreviations** mean.
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### Author:  [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/14 "2000-03-28T21:24:00Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Originally posted by MR.REED:
> **What is the actual meaning of the acronyme R.S.V.P.**
Literal translation from french to English:
“Respond if you please.” (It’s a phrase, not an acronym. Tell me I’m mistaken in my reading that someone referred to it as an acronym; maybe they were answering some other post.) Incidentaly, the poor expression, “if you please” means the same thing as “if you will be so kind.”
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### Author:  [@ChuckSki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ChuckSki)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/15 "2000-03-28T21:29:00Z")
Mjollnir,
Ummmmm, not exactly an abbreviation, either. An abbrev. is a shortened form of a word, acording to my dictionary and the aforementioned style guides. But I agree that the dict. is an excellent source, as you note.
Chuck L.
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### Author:  [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/16 "2000-03-28T21:31:00Z")
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by ChuckSki:
\*\*More accurately, it’s an initialism.
Oh, yes; RSVP is an abbreviation or, most precisely, an initialism. Remember that acronyms are, (effectively), words formed from the initials of a phrase or heading or title or such. (BYOB is an initialism for Bobby Yelled Over Barbara.
BOW is an acronysm for Brdge Over Water.)
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### Author:  [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/17 "2000-03-28T21:33:00Z")
I think the person who said it was an acronym knows what acronym means, but was saying that he pronounces it as a word.
I’ve read that acronyms are a relatively recent thing, in the debunking of some word origin legends (like ‘posh’). I was watching a documentary the other day, and the narrator (Martin Sheen) said that the Greek words for “Jesus Christ, Son of God, the Saviour” started with letters that spelled out the Greek word for “fish”, and this is how the little fish symbol came to be associated with Christianity.
If this is so, might it be the oldest acronym? I certainly don’t think Mr. Sheen is a trustworthy source, so I’m not convinced it’s so.
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### Author:  [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/18 "2000-03-28T21:34:00Z")
Hey, Chuck, we were tapping our posts at the same tyme. It appears we’re answering each others, when we’re not. Sorry for the confusion. You’re points are well-taken. I was replying for general attention and not to adjust your points.
BOW is an acronysm for Brdge Over Water.)
\*\*
[/QUOTE]
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### Author:  [@ASPA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASPA)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/19 "2000-03-28T21:37:00Z")
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by CurtC:
[B…[a] narrator (Martin Sheen) said that the Greek words for “Jesus Christ, Son of God, the Saviour” started with letters that spelled out the Greek word for “fish”, and this is how the little fish symbol came to be associated with Christianity.
If this is so, might it be the oldest acronym?
Interesting!
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### Author:  [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)
#### Post date: [March 28, 2000, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/r-s-v-p/9395/20 "2000-03-28T22:54:00Z")
We’ve had discussions on ICHTHUS every so often going back to the AOL board.
The acronym theory goes:
I = Iesous (Jesus)
CH = CHristos (Christ)
TH = THeo (of God)
Y = 'Uios (Son) (Greek upsilon is related to both English U and Y)
S = Soter (Savior)
The arguments _for_ include the prevalence of the fish as an early icon in Christianity and the fact that it makes a neat package. There is, indeed, a tradition in art of using initials to represent well understood words and that initials were not unknown in the Roman Empire (remember S.P.Q.R.)
The arguments _against_ include the fact that acronyms, as such, were not common in the ancient world (interestingly, a couple of ancient writers did use acronyms as pseudonymns) and that acronyms need a fairly literate population to be effective, and the early christians can not be supposed to have been very literate.
The oldest attestation that _I_ can find for the ICHTHUS = Fish = Jesus dates only to the late nineteenth century. This indicates that it could have been simply speculation by a person at that time.
Fish as an icon for Jesus or Christianity is generally recognized to be linked to the statement of Jesus to Peter and company that they would be “fishers of men” along with reinforcing miracles of the loaves and fishes and of the bursting nets.
* * *
Tom~
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