# Railroad fuel cars explode in small Quebec town **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 7, 2013, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851 "2013-07-07T03:51:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![EmilyG](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emilyg/32/364_2.png) [@EmilyG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmilyG)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/21 "2013-07-08T21:16:18Z")
Unfortunately, I’d be really surprised if any of the missing people were found alive. ---
**Author:** ![Fir\_na\_tine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Fir\_na\_tine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fir_na_tine)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/22 "2013-07-08T22:20:34Z")
Body count now up to 13. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/23 "2013-07-08T22:27:53Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > So, it sounds like any talk about Alberta tar sands is just BS from people with an agenda. > > So far, there hasn’t been much reporting about this in the US, but I suspect that will change as the official death toll rises. Right, because it’s been all Trayvon Martin, all the time. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/24 "2013-07-08T22:29:34Z")
> [@EmilyG](#): > > Unfortunately, I’d be really surprised if any of the missing people were found alive. True, unless they happened to not be in the area at the time. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/25 "2013-07-08T22:34:24Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > True, unless they happened to not be in the area at the time. Let’s hope they were all visiting friends. ---
**Author:** ![K364](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k364/32/5_2.png) [@K364](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/K364)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/26 "2013-07-08T22:59:51Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > … > So far, there hasn’t been much reporting about this in the US, but I suspect that will change as the official death toll rises. Well, it’s starting to infiltrate their radar - on tonight’s NBC news it was third after the two air crashes. Can you imagine if it was the other way around? A Canadian crash landing that kills two, and an American rail disaster obliterating a town and killing dozens? From what I saw of CNN over the weekend, it was 24 hour coverage of the SF air crash. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/27 "2013-07-08T23:08:34Z")
What I heard is that it wasn’t the fire department that shut off the engine but somebody from the RR, not an engineer because something was sparking. The engineer was asleep in the hotel (perfectly normal). I’ve also heard that these were older, more-or-less obsolete, tank cars. The opposition leader, Thomas Mulcair, is claiming that it was due to the government stinting on inspections, but that is his job. Like most accidents, this will turn out to involve many little things, no one fatal, but coming together just wrong. Apparently most of the missing (and by now certainly presumed dead) were in a nightclub. So the likely death toll will be around 45. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/28 "2013-07-08T23:42:35Z")
With orphaned children, because there were some young couples there. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/29 "2013-07-09T00:29:09Z")
> [@EmilyG](#): > > Unfortunately, I’d be really surprised if any of the missing people were found alive. I’ve seen some speculation that some of the people in the night club will never be found - that they were vaporised by the intense heat of the fire and are, just, gone… ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/30 "2013-07-09T00:33:24Z")
> [@K364](#): > > Well, it’s starting to infiltrate their radar - on tonight’s NBC news it was third after the two air crashes. It’s the old news adage: "My next door neighbour dies in a car wreck - it’s a tragedy on the front page. 10,000 people die in a flood on the other side of the world: an inch of space on p. 20." ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/31 "2013-07-09T00:47:43Z")
the train scene was unapproachable for days. the numbers involved still not known. the possible cause(s) far less clear. ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/32 "2013-07-09T02:08:23Z")
{{{Hugs to Quebec. (And, well, everyone, because it’s being kind of a rough month…)}}} ---
**Author:** ![EmilyG](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emilyg/32/364_2.png) [@EmilyG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmilyG)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/33 "2013-07-09T11:22:39Z")
Thank you, **Sunspace**. CBC has a[live blog](http://live.cbc.ca/Event/Lac-Megantic_train_derailment)for information. I imagine it’s updated often. ---
**Author:** ![jools](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b3f665/32.png) [@jools](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jools)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/34 "2013-07-09T13:42:28Z")
I finally heard from my friends who live in that area, they are shaken up but alive and well. They live a out of the “affected” area and they were gone camping when it all happened. They got back Monday afternoon, and been returning calls most of the afternoon, on top of finding their friends, so far so good, people close to them are all accounted for but some people they know, without being close to them, are missing, which of course probably means dead ☹ I was seriously freaking out most of the weekend. ---
**Author:** ![johnpost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f17d59/32.png) [@johnpost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnpost)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/35 "2013-07-09T14:39:48Z")
tv news said about 1% of the towns population is dead/missing so likely everyone will know of a person killed. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/36 "2013-07-09T22:34:57Z")
This whole event (and the location where it occurred) sounds like a plotline cooked up by Steven King. > [@scr4](#): > > I was thinking that too and read up on [wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Railway_air_brake). You’re right that releasing air pressure on the line _activates_ the brakes. But the brakes are _powered_ by a compressed air reservoir on each car. And if the brake is kept on for a long time, eventually the air in the reservoir leaks away, and the brakes lose power. Modern trains have a 2nd air line to keep those reservoirs topped off; apparently it’s this supply that was shut off in this accident. Ex-short-line railroader here. My understanding is that at least one locomotive (of five on the train) was kept running to keep the air brakes charged up; either the engine shut off on its own or a leak developed in the system. There are definitely some strange things about this event; that there might be a fire (prior to the runaway) on a trainload of flammable materials and that either the railroad management was never informed or never bothered to send someone to inspect the train is decidedly odd. For another: all freight cars in interchange service have hand brakes, and it would seem prudent (if not expressly written in the operating rules), that a certain number of these (say ten or 15 cars’ worth) would be set when leaving a train unattended. I haven’t seen anything yet in the reporting that suggests that this was done. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/37 "2013-07-10T00:59:16Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Ex-short-line railroader here. My understanding is that at least one locomotive (of five on the train) was kept running to keep the air brakes charged up; either the engine shut off on its own or a leak developed in the system. The news reports say fairly consistently that the firefighters turned off the engine to stop fuel from getting near the fire they were putting out. There appears to be some disagreement what happened next - some reports say the firefighters waited for a fellow from the railway to come (not the original engineer), but other reports say they left before the railway rep arrived. > [@](#): > > all freight cars in interchange service have hand brakes, and it would seem prudent (if not expressly written in the operating rules), that a certain number of these (say ten or 15 cars’ worth) would be set when leaving a train unattended. I haven’t seen anything yet in the reporting that suggests that this was done. I’ve seen some reports that say the original engineer put hand-brakes on before he left for the night, but that they weren’t sufficient by themselves to hold the train in place once the air brakes were turned off. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/38 "2013-07-10T02:02:18Z")
Two links I posted in the CanaDoper Café that I thought you folks ought to see. La Presse showing a [before and after shot](http://a.yfrog.com/img877/7922/ejtpvm.jpg) of Lac Mégantic. And a [Huffington Post article](http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/07/09/transport-canada-rules-lac-megantic_n_3569228.html?utm_hp_ref=canada-politics) saying that Transport Canada says there are no rules against leaving an unlocked, unmanned, running locomotive and its flammable cargo on a main rail line uphill from a populated centre. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/39 "2013-07-10T03:53:52Z")
> [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](#): > > La Presse showing a [before and after shot](http://a.yfrog.com/img877/7922/ejtpvm.jpg) of Lac Mégantic. Le woah… ---
**Author:** ![Nanoda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Nanoda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanoda)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2013, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851/40 "2013-07-10T06:17:33Z")
Even after I read the number of train cars involved, I still found it hard to understand how ~50 people couldn’t get out - then I saw [this video](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRb3JHsiqfA). The size of the fire is immense. Right now I don’t get the airbrake issue. I thought that loss of air pressure _activated_ the brakes, but apparently the brakes fail _off_, rather than _on_, which makes no sense to me. The MMA chairman blaming the fire department also seems weird. If I put out your train fire and leave it with one of your dudes, that’s job done IMHO. Why didn’t we wake up your engineer to look at the scene? Why didn’t _your_ guy wake your engineer to look at the scene? 😕 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/railroad-fuel-cars-explode-in-small-quebec-town/662851.md?page=3)