# Random Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 18, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942 "2010-03-18T21:47:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/281 "2010-03-22T01:37:01Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > Additionally, I have a request. When anyone questions you on your comments or statements, please just answer them instead of turning it into a discussion of ‘why do people pick on Meeko’ This Mafia, not Mafia featuring Meeko. 1. You seem to be doing a majority of the picking on me, frankly. So, it would seem to me, stopping one problem would go a long way in stopping the other. 2.So, the moment I get a method to my madness, and actually start lying down facts, points [arguments], and strong opinions, you ask me to stop? Am I actually doing something good here, that you fear for? Not in regards to my play, but the future of yours? ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/282 "2010-03-22T01:48:02Z")
Meeko, in going back to check, I think I misunderstood you: you stated: > [@](#): > > 5.Scum know who each other are. > 5b.They know the name and [occupation / race / job] of their role. > 5d.It is a simple matter of deduction at that point, to find out the common thread. > \*_5e.They already know more from the names than we do, simply by comparing notes, that were placed out in the open. \* > 5f.This doesn’t happen if Scum suggest we don’t claim_ I though 5b stated that they know the occupation of the other Scum. You didn’t state that. That’s what I thought was PIS. I thought you were saying that the Scum knew the other Scum’s names. However, on rereading you didn’t say that. I thought I was clear about what I was referring to when I questioned you, why didn’t you just point out that you didn’t say what I was accusing you of? As to the other point, that names imply powers. I strongly strongly disagree. Also, please stop stop calling it picking on you. It’s not. When you’re playing this game, you must expect to be questioned. And you have a responsibility to answer those questions. It’s not picking on you. It’s how we figure things out. It’s no fun if you start pouting every time someone questions you. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/283 "2010-03-22T04:10:05Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > I though 5b stated that they know the occupation of the other Scum. You didn’t state that. That’s what I thought was PIS. I thought you were saying that the Scum knew the other Scum’s names. Well, even if it takes twice as long, at least we have a convoluted process to understand each other. :smack: On my part. YMMV. Scum know the Names of other Scum. \*\* Scum players know the names of other scum players.\*\* That is: Cecil, you are Scummy McScumalot. You are scum with Opal and TubaDiva. You can go to X and post night strategy. Opal, you are Mucs Mucsson. You are scum with Cecil and TubaDiva. You can go to X and post night strategy. Tuba Diva your are Thrid Ferguson. You are a Third Party, with Wincon Y. However, you will appear to be scum to any and all detective roles. Here is a Sum role for you to use : Tuba, you are Burt Reynolds. You are Scum with Cecil and Opal. You can go to X and post night stratgy. * * * So, I was saying that Scum know the names of other scum. By virtue of how Scum ““Works””. Cecil Knows upon role PM that Opal and Tuba are scum. He has no idea that Opal is Mucs Mucsson, at least until the first night in the game [Note, I said the first night, not Night 1.] Hopefully, Third Ferguson won’t slip. [[Yes, I was thinking of a PFK and the Third for Turd just popped in.]] So, I meant that Cecil Knows Opal by the name Opal. Not that Scummy knows Mucs. Are we good so far? The rest of the information, AFTER player name usually comes out in the scum boards. Since we had a day start, there is a disadvantage here. BUT because player names of scum are known by all scum, I am willing to bet that scum now know what “fictional character” means, or any other qualifier. -If scum don’t know what what “fictional” or any other qualifier means, we [town] probably shouldn’t worry about it. Not that we will know. \*\*OR \*\* We could have some very powerful, or very unusual town powers. – Then again, as was stated before, the “”“Random”“” aspect is probably muted, as this is a noob friendly game. [[We don’t even have any true noobs in this game, do we?]] ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/284 "2010-03-22T04:17:41Z")
Yep. Totally didnt answer your question. NETA : So, when you said **Name** back to me, I totally took it as a second meaning. And I think we both got confused in it. Suffice to say I think we both took the opposite meaning of an ambiguous term, and assumed the worst. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/285 "2010-03-22T13:18:18Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > Scum know the Names of other Scum. > > \*\* > Scum players know the names of other scum players.\*\* Snipped a lot. How do you know that? Were we told scum could communicate in any way before Night One? There was no Night Zero, unless I missed it. Now, if the scum can talk during the Day, then they would know who each other are. However, if they can’t, then they very well may not even know who the other players are, let alone their “role names”. No one can know for sure, except the scum. You talk as if you know a lot about the scum situation in this game. Do you? ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/286 "2010-03-22T13:26:01Z")
Mahaloth, I’ve never seen a game where the scum aren’t told the usernames of the other scum straight off of the bat. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/287 "2010-03-22T13:36:03Z")
You get the feeling that Scum is after me this game, because I have ““changed gears”” twice in as many games. **Well, the best players are taken out in the first day, right?** ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/288 "2010-03-22T13:36:39Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > Mahaloth, I’ve never seen a game where the scum aren’t told the usernames of the other scum straight off of the bat. I’ve played in one where there was a singular secret scum, but most of the team was known to each other. Anyways it appears that spelling mistakes abound! **unvote** ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/289 "2010-03-22T13:38:43Z")
I wonder if Maha and Ed, albeit with a quick backpedal, aren’t PIS slipping on something. Perhaps powers only work in this game, if refer to players by their role name, not their user name. ---
**Author:** ![KellyCriterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b3f665/32.png) [@KellyCriterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KellyCriterion)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/290 "2010-03-22T13:42:21Z")
Has anyone done any serious analysis on the names? Is there something to be had for the fiction vs non-fiction side of things? And I can’t believe the heat that **Wanderers** is copping for latching on to that typo 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/291 "2010-03-22T13:46:06Z")
Interesting fun stuff now. \*\* Unvote One and Only\*\* **FOS One and Only**. Yes, the vote was Weak, Yes it was unvoted. Yes, the fact that he voted that way, and on that reason, is still there. Can’t vote him strictly on my original premise anymore. But, I have to wonder the whole story here. **Vote Mahaloth** I don’t get the sudden case of amnesia. I mean I made a point on something that I figured was unmutable. I have yet to play in a Gastard set up, but I am willing to bet that scum knowing user names of other scum even shows up in that world as well. Do not “Get” why I have heat for suggesting scum know other scum by user name. AT ALL. Further, Maha picked up this ball after Ed. Not to sure why he did that, or why he wants to engage me. ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/292 "2010-03-22T13:54:28Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Has anyone done any serious analysis on the names? Is there something to be had for the fiction vs non-fiction side of things? Again, I _really_ doubt it, though obviously you never know. For example, it looks to me like only three players (one of them is me) have claimed fictional characters as roles. Did **sachertorte** make all three Scum? Strongly doubt it - talk about game breaking, and anyway I know this is not the case because I know my own alignment. Did he make all three Town? Possibly. Certainly not game breaking if he did, simply because we could never know with sufficient certainty to confirm a player on this basis. Did he make some of them Town and some of them Scum? Possibly. Is there gameplay significance to the Fictional vs. Real thing? I don’t know. I asked, actually, immediately upon receiving my PM. **sach** responded with, essentially, the dictionary definition of the word “Fictional,” so either there’s no connection to the game or our moderator is keeping the connection under wraps. So basically, nearly any scenario is possible. So what value is there in banging this back and forth for Days on end? We know what we know, and maybe it will be useful later, but it’s not right now, at least, not as far as I can see. ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/293 "2010-03-22T14:01:09Z")
I count 4 fictional. I assume the wicked witch of the west is fictional, but I am still not sure that is really peeker’s claim, nor what the description in parentheses after it would be. **peeker**? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/294 "2010-03-22T14:06:02Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > Mahaloth, I’ve never seen a game where the scum aren’t told the usernames of the other scum straight off of the bat. Ah, I guess I’m wrong in wondering why Meeko “knew” that then. It just seemed like he stated it as fact. Not sure I deserve a vote from him for it, though. I was just asking, which seems reasonable to me. ---
**Author:** ![storyteller0910](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@storyteller0910](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/storyteller0910)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/295 "2010-03-22T14:09:00Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > I count 4 fictional. I assume the wicked witch of the west is fictional, but I am still not sure that is really peeker’s claim, nor what the description in parentheses after it would be. **peeker**? Yeah, I’m not sure how to count **peeker** right now. Dear peeker: please claim. The cat’s kind of out of the bag right now, and continuing to dance around it is just going to create a massive distraction. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/296 "2010-03-22T14:14:52Z")
well i guess if **sach** were kind enough to tell us how many of each and various roles are available then some enterprising sould could grab the claims and run it through some random number generator assigning roles based randomly. pemutate this a couple of million times and then we could arrive at some conclusion that, for example, 7 percent of the time a person with a religion sounding name ends up being a doc. additionally, maybe one could also come up with a statistically valid way of assuming that out of x number of fictional characters y are scum/town/3rd party. but i am unsure whether **sach** would enteratain sharing this information. so any conclusion based on the above scenario would have to be based on assumptions which may or may not have any relationship to the actual game set up. i have to agree with **story** , when **sach** says random i tend to believe him. so could a good sounding name translate into a town power role, maybe. but it would be just based on random. in a given subset of characters could some be scum, certainly. just depends on how the dice role. because if i were to believe that name = alignment i sure as heck would have picked something other than wicked witch of the west which i was assigned by our mod. so i see little benefit in discussing how names could have any bearing on role or alignement except in the most random and indeterminate way. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/297 "2010-03-22T14:19:37Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Were we told scum could communicate in any way before Night One? There was no Night Zero, unless I missed it. Now, if the scum can talk during the Day, then they would know who each other are. However, if they can’t, then they very well may not even know who the other players are, let alone their “role names”. No one can know for sure, except the scum. > > You talk as if you know a lot about the scum situation in this game. Do you? It says flat out in the rules scum can’t talk during the day. Ane Meeko’s right–most games, scum get their teammates’ names in the PM. > [@Meeko](#): > > You get the feeling that Scum is after me this game, because I have ““changed gears”” twice in as many games. No, I don’t get that feeling. It’s just day one banter, chill. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/298 "2010-03-22T14:24:16Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Ah, I guess I’m wrong in wondering why Meeko “knew” that then. It just seemed like he stated it as fact. > > Not sure I deserve a vote from him for it, though. I was just asking, which seems reasonable to me. I just don’t understand why people are after me because of it. Up and until now, I thought it was fact. The vote comes not from the asking, but from the timing. It just seems ““Added on”” after Ed’s. Seems not needed, seems rushed, seems designed to stick to me, for whatever reason. Paranoia or what ever, I just don’t get why ““fact”” is in question for this game. Whatever. \*\* Unvote Maha\*\* ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/299 "2010-03-22T14:25:02Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > It says flat out in the rules scum can’t talk during the day. Ane Meeko’s right–most games, scum get their teammates’ names in the PM. Again, OK, I retract the questioning of Meeko’s statement if so many people think it was weird. I’ve only been Scum once(in one of ped’s games) and I can’t remember. Pretty sure pedescribe and I do not PM the other scums names, but rather have a Night Zero where the scum “sign-in”, so to speak, for the scum to swing by their board and meet each other. I even remember in the game I was scum, we were unsure how many of us there were because one player became highly inactive early on. Having said that, with no Night Zero, I agree it makes sense for the scum to know who each other are. Moving on! ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2010, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/300 "2010-03-22T14:33:48Z")
I think I see the problem here. Does my outline approach over explain things? Too much ammo for scum? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942.md?page=16)