# Random Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [March 18, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942 "2010-03-18T21:47:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/721 "2010-03-29T15:19:01Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Checking in and reviewing… > > Re: the **Drain/Zeriel thing,** I’ll accept Drain’s argument in the overnight thread that she \*\*wasn’t sure if there was a second person who cited peeker’s “joke vote” \*\*elsewhere. There have been a lot of posts in the thread & I’m not going to expect everyone to quote chapter & verse for every FoS (as opposed to a vote, where I’d at least like to have a clear idea what they’re on about). > > Speaking of which, I really don’t understand [MHaye’s vote on Chronos](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12265736&postcount=591). > > SNIP Night was a whopping 35 posts. Here is what we have :: > [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Usually blue text = Town. > > Since there are no restrictions on strategy talk, when I made my FOS post, I said “everybody” because **I was pretty sure I’d seen that argument made before in a post by someone voting for peeker, although not necessarily in the post where they made the vote. I wasn’t sure who it was and didn’t have time to go through the thread looking for it (and still don’t, although I may at some point in the future) so I just hedged my bets and said “everyone.”** But if it turns out it’s just **zeriel** , then the FOS applies to just him, then. Nothing changes–I still think it’s a horrid reason to vote **peeker** on Day One, since he always makes the same damned joke vote every Day One. And I believe these two are all that Tom Scud said “last night”. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Hi all. I’m assuming that blue text, plus peeker’s “go town” dying message, mean Town. I think I’m going to pretend that there isn’t strategy talk at night even though there is and come back with fresh eyes and brain later. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > And, oh yeah, Screamers mafia went to 880 posts on the first day. I still remember the sinking feeling when we found out it wasn’t over yet on page 13 or so… > [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > The who the what now? I find the use of the word ““Thread”” to be weird as well. From what context is he speaking on “Thread” ? The context of the SDMB, or of a Pro Board? Why does Jimmy bring it up? > [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > The overnight portion of the thread, I’d imagine, since I made my explanation after Nightfall. > > Still, it’s an interesting turn of phrase. In the last game, a Scum **Rysto** referred to a NK power as a “lynch,” and these sorts of Freudian (Sigmund, not Slit) mistakes are the type of slips I think are more often scummy than not. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Yes, the overnight portion of the thread. Seems like an over explanation, IMHO. Seems like it is damage control, by perhaps un-coordinated scummies each trying to clean up the entire mess. It’s like a big sign saying “There is no Secret Here”. Alternately It’s equivalent to “These are not the Scums you want.” – Complete with hand gesture. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > So a comment on the “slip” thing. I’ve been around this particular block with both Zeriel (Lost) and Drain (Screamers) in the past, and since it’s not an argument that has a thing to do with logic or decision-making, it’s not something that can be argued about, so I’m not going to argue about it. > > (That it can’t be argued with doesn’t make it an invalid technique for finding scum, though I haven’t found it terribly useful in my experience.) I find this hard to tackle. Not because I lack the thoughts on it, but because I am in a near similar situation, I feel, regarding Freudian’s vote on me. In a weird sense, I feel I can’t touch it, with out adding complication to the ““Case”” on me. Both arguments seemingly bypass Logic, and Decision making, and fast forward to absolutes. – That may or may not be true. I’ve been told, that even if you learn a new language, and spend the rest of your life exclusively speaking and reading that language, you will always count in your native tounge. Even if only in private. I think there are certain things here that can not be argued. Simply because they are like numbers in my example above. Certain things, right or wrong, can not be changed. No vote here. But, lets look at Tom AND Drain. If this is a slip, let’s not forget that Drain was named. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/722 "2010-03-29T15:39:21Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > **Meeko** says “ **Meeko** would like to take this time to assure you that **Meeko** has nearly always referred to ‘ **Meeko** ’ as **Meeko** at least once in every game \*\*Meeko \*\*has played, or if you will, the grand sum of all games **Meeko** has played in, that had posts written by **Meeko** ” > > **Meeko** thinks that was a tad overboard, but **Meeko** hopes that you get **Meeko** ’s point. > > No. But seriously, there are times where I just find it easier to refer to myself in the third person. I think way too many people refer to themselves in the first person, when the third person is actually better. I do think it avoids confusion. Over here. " I " can point to the teeming thousands. Over here, “Meeko” can refer to me, or a Walt Disney Raccoon. Good Lord but you sound like Elmo in this post! > [@Freudian\_Slit](#): > > Well, since all I have to do to see who’s posting is glance over at the username above, it’s not too difficult for me to parse “I.” > > Anyway, I’m also leaning towards **One and Only Wanderers** , as others have also, due to this: > > This is a pretty huge reach. I mean, I think the whole misspellings are a null tell at this point. Yeah, one of the other misspelled people could be scum. But they just easily could be town. And the fact that you keep harping on the misspelling is odd to me. Whether or not the mis spellings originally meant anything, the fact that they are there, and have been noticed and discussed means they mean something _now_ scenario Naf = town Meeko = scum. Both have a misspelling completely randomly and unintentionally. I stomp in and attribute it as being scum. Most people disagree with me at least one follows along with me. Anyway it is now something on the radar. Scum team (knowing that NAF isn’t scum) decide to kill NAF to prove misspelling \<\> scum, thus removing the shadow from Scum Meeko. Now this is all pure conjecture, but NAF was targeted for some reason, and I feel it is in town’s interests to think about who was targeted why. ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/723 "2010-03-29T15:47:38Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > Now this is all pure conjecture, but NAF was targeted for some reason, and I feel it is in town’s interests to think about who was targeted why. I don’t. I’ve never seen this turn out well for town. Take Cecil Pond. We scum killed Freudian one Night, and it turned out that she was an unclaimed mason. This surprised the Town because there were two claimed masons still alive. One player posted an analysis of the voting patterns of the known masons and showed that if you assumed that the masons wouldn’t vote for fellow masons, then the last mason was in a pool of three players: Freudian, Oredigger and Alka Seltzer. He then pointed out that if there were scum in that pool, then the scum could have gotten it down to a one-in-two chance of hitting a mason. The thing was, we scum _didn’t_ do that analysis. We killed Freudian because we suspected that she might be a cop, not a mason. Now, as it happens, both Oredigger and Alka were scum. But that was pure luck: the reasoning was invalid, so the conclusion was flawed even if it happened to be true. You yourself have given a list of what, five or six reasons why NAF might have been killed? Never assume that you can work out what the scum is thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/724 "2010-03-29T15:49:10Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > :rolleyes: > > So the fact that: > > a) Drain did, in fact, give the explanation Tom mentioned overnight in _this_ thread > b) If she were scum, it would make no sense for Drain to be discussing this in private with the scum > c) The off-board games all have separate Day and Night threads, so it would be entirely reasonable for a player used to that to make the mistake > > means nothing to you? Heh, says the guy who got caught on a similar slip recently. ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/725 "2010-03-29T15:52:15Z")
> [@Zeriel](#): > > Heh, says the guy who got caught on a similar slip recently. That’s a primary reason why I’m suspicious of such “slips”. I make those kind of mistakes all the time, whether I’m town or scum. I once almost posted “but I know that I’m scum” in a game, and I was _town_. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/726 "2010-03-29T16:32:04Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > That’s a primary reason why I’m suspicious of such “slips”. I make those kind of mistakes all the time, whether I’m town or scum. I once almost posted “but I know that I’m scum” in a game, and I was _town_. YMMV, man, I see these things catch scum far more often than they bite townies in the ass, and hell I’ve been caught in one or two as town myself (my crowning achievement was getting speed-lynched (as the vig/roleblocker, with a successful scum kill) because I brain-farted and voted for a confirmed, out mason. =P ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/727 "2010-03-29T17:05:18Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > I don’t. I’ve never seen this turn out well for town. Take Cecil Pond. We scum killed Freudian one Night, and it turned out that she was an unclaimed mason. This surprised the Town because there were two claimed masons still alive. One player posted an analysis of the voting patterns of the known masons and showed that if you assumed that the masons wouldn’t vote for fellow masons, then the last mason was in a pool of three players: Freudian, Oredigger and Alka Seltzer. He then pointed out that if there were scum in that pool, then the scum could have gotten it down to a one-in-two chance of hitting a mason. The thing was, we scum _didn’t_ do that analysis. We killed Freudian because we suspected that she might be a cop, not a mason. > > Now, as it happens, both Oredigger and Alka were scum. But that was pure luck: the reasoning was invalid, so the conclusion was flawed even if it happened to be true. > > You yourself have given a list of what, five or six reasons why NAF might have been killed? Never assume that you can work out what the scum is thinking. Since it was my list, I’m going to comment on it. Any reasoning based only on that list would have been 100% invalid (As I said at the time, it was just data and could have been coincidental). Just like anyone basing a vote solely on their opinion about why someone was killed is equally invalid, although possibly subject to confirmation bias. On to Kelly/Meeko/Freudian. NAF’s original case against kelly was weak, it looks to me like someone playing rashly. If you want to attribute rashness as a scum play, you’ll have to convince me since I just don’t buy it on face value. If I have Meeko’s argument correct, he is arguing that Kelly is being bussed so that he will be lynched and Freudian would get town credit for it. This doesn’t add up for me since a 1 for 1 trade rarely benefits scum. Not that it’s not possible, but it’s not the first thing I think of. @Zeriel: I’m a little confused, are you voting for Drain because of the “overnight thread” or is it a continuation of your case against her yesterday regarding everyone=zeriel? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/728 "2010-03-29T17:11:13Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Checking in and reviewing… > > Re: the Drain/Zeriel thing, I’ll accept Drain’s argument in the overnight thread that she wasn’t sure if there was a second person who cited peeker’s “joke vote” elsewhere. There have been a lot of posts in the thread & I’m not going to expect everyone to quote chapter & verse… snipped I have read it fully and followed actively, but I agree it’s hard to remember every detail. I’m willing to be more than one person feels like I do right now, so I’ll just flat out ask. What was Drain’s alleged slip? I see the “overnight thread” slip by Tom, but I totally see what he meant there. What did Drain say that is somewhat “slippy”? What post was it in? ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/729 "2010-03-29T17:21:15Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > I didn’t read OAOW’s post as trying to divert attention as much as trying to look for answers which was my first response to seeing who was killed. It also looks like Jimmy is trying to build a case but not putting a vote behind it. Since I managed to not vote yesterDay I’m going to put out an early vote based on Jimmy’s misinterpretation of OAOW and saying that there was a benefit to that misinterpretation of giving OAOW townie cred. Tacking on a sentence at the end to make it seem like you’re not attributing OAOW’s actions to being scum bothers me too. Was your first response to think that probably **NAF** was killed in order to throw up a smokescreen and protect the rest of a “Brotherhood” of people with misspelled posts? Is it helpful to the search for answers to obliquely suggest that this unidentified class of people (which upon 30 seconds’ investigation is revealed as a class of one: **Meeko** ) will benefit from the kill, and thus are scum, and that’s the most likely explanation? And you’re bothered both by my bringing it up and asking for clarification, and not voting, _and_ by me allowing that it’s hard for me to believe scum would be that bold about it? What do you want me to do in the future when I see something weird that I want other people to look at, and that I want to hear more about? Either vote right away or just not say anything at all, those are the options? ---
**Author:** ![Rysto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecccb3/32.png) [@Rysto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rysto)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/730 "2010-03-29T17:21:45Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > What was Drain’s alleged slip? I see the “overnight thread” slip by Tom, but I totally see what he meant there. What did Drain say that is somewhat “slippy”? What post was it in? Zeriel is upset about this post: > [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > FOS at everyone who brought up **peeker** voting **story** straight off as a reason to vote him. That “everyone” was really only Zeriel, and he doesn’t like the fact that Drain couched an FOS of a single player in terms that appeared to be general. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/731 "2010-03-29T17:44:46Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > scenario Naf = town Meeko = scum. Both have a misspelling completely randomly and unintentionally. > > I stomp in and attribute it as being scum. Most people disagree with me at least one follows along with me. Anyway it is now something on the radar. > > Scum team (knowing that NAF isn’t scum) decide to kill NAF to prove misspelling \<\> scum, thus removing the shadow from Scum Meeko. > Now this is all pure conjecture, but NAF was targeted for some reason, and I feel it is in town’s interests to think about who was targeted why. The first word is “scenario,” and you say yourself it’s pure conjecture; in other words, you’ve made up a set of assumptions, and then based on those assumptions you’re giving us an explanation of why it happened that way. The question is, why that particular conjecture? It’s all well and good that within the constraints you’ve created, you can give us reasons why the logic is consistent. That doesn’t tell the rest of us anything about why you _created_ the scenario in the first place. I mean, hey, scenario: NAF town, Meeko town. In this universe, you’re being ridiculous and scummy. See how easy that was for me to do? Re: **Tom** and the slip, or not-slip, I’m with **Zeriel** in that I pointed it out because I do think that following up on those kinds of accidental references will help you find scum more often than it’ll prevent you from doing it. It’s far from an ironclad case – of course it’s possible that an innocent townie might just use the wrong combination of words – and I don’t think this is foolproof, but I think that the other kind, the capital-s Slip kind, happens fairly regularly. Even though, sure, there are other games with multiple threads, there aren’t really that many, and it seems highly worthy of notice when a player acknowledges (inadvertently) thinking about even the _existence_ of another thread somewhere. It seems hard to believe that it would ever occur to my fingers to type “overnight thread” because it’s just a fact to me that there’s only one thread, and there’s nothing special about discussions overnight for me. You have to admit, in a game where the scum can talk, in a separate place for discussion, and only at night, that is a particularly unfortunate coincidental way to refer to something. Over time, I’ll take my chances that that signifies something important more often than it happens just by random inattention or incorrect phrasing. I plan to keep it in mind, is all. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/732 "2010-03-29T18:18:20Z")
> [@Rysto](#): > > That “everyone” was really only Zeriel, and he doesn’t like the fact that Drain couched an FOS of a single player in terms that appeared to be general. snip Oh, I see. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/733 "2010-03-29T19:37:26Z")
OK, so I’ve thought about it and I actually think Zeriel makes a pretty good case about Drain’s attempt to rope a bunch of people into a FOS when it was only him. I see very little case for the whole “overnight thread” thing Tom said, though. It never occurred to me that he meant some other thread on another board and Drain did comment in this thread. So, Drain definitely looks odd with that statement, but not enough to get a vote from me, at least not yet. However, shouldn’t we have more talking by Monday of a Day? Things are oddly calm aside from Meeko and Ed’s continuing hilarity, so to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/734 "2010-03-29T19:53:09Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > Was your first response to think that probably **NAF** was killed in order to throw up a smokescreen and protect the rest of a “Brotherhood” of people with misspelled posts? Is it helpful to the search for answers to obliquely suggest that this unidentified class of people (which upon 30 seconds’ investigation is revealed as a class of one: **Meeko** ) will benefit from the kill, and thus are scum, and that’s the most likely explanation? My first reaction was to create a list of reasons why NAF was killed which OAOW did. Umm . . . or not. I went to quote the post where OAOW listed the reasons for the scum killing NAF turns out it was by Guiri right after the posts by OAOW pointing out the ‘brotherhood of the misspellings’. I screwed up. And you’re bothered both by my bringing it up and asking for clarification, and not voting, _and_ by me allowing that it’s hard for me to believe scum would be that bold about it? What do you want me to do in the future when I see something weird that I want other people to look at, and that I want to hear more about? Either vote right away or just not say anything at all, those are the options? [/QUOTE] I still don’t like the way you brought it up. Your post felt like it was building a case against OAOW and then at the last second you decided you were pushing too hard and tried to pull the punch with a single tacked on sentence. But now that I’ve gone back and straightened myself out I’m going to withdraw my vote. I don’t like you’re presentation but you are right only coming up with one reason for the scum to kill last Night is a bad play since it’s WIFOM. **Unvote Jimmy** ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/735 "2010-03-29T23:21:27Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > OK, so I’ve thought about it and I actually think Zeriel makes a pretty good case about Drain’s attempt to rope a bunch of people into a FOS when it was only him. I’m going to ask this question to you too, but it’s really to **zeriel** , since **zeriel** is the only one voting me for it… If I’m Scum, what’s my motivation for hiding **zeriel** in what is ostensibly a larger group of people? The only way it makes sense to me is if _ **zeriel** is also Scum_! Then I might have the motivation of trying to look pro-Town by coming up with a nice Townie argument defending **peeker** for something he does every game, but I don’t have to smear my Scum teammate by name to do it. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2010, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/736 "2010-03-29T23:52:13Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > I’m going to ask this question to you too, but it’s really to **zeriel** , since **zeriel** is the only one voting me for it… > > If I’m Scum, what’s my motivation for hiding **zeriel** in what is ostensibly a larger group of people? The only way it makes sense to me is if _ **zeriel** is also Scum_! Then I might have the motivation of trying to look pro-Town by coming up with a nice Townie argument defending **peeker** for something he does every game, but I don’t have to smear my Scum teammate by name to do it. There’s also the opposite–throw out something plausible that generates heat for a single known townie (if you’re scum, you know I’m townie) while allowing you to pretend you’re making a general statement. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/737 "2010-03-30T00:14:36Z")
Well, here’s the thing. If it’s true that _nobody_ else voting for **peeker** made comments regarding his joke vote (and I’m not sure of that, as I don’t have the time right now to go through 19 pages searching for it) then the strategy fails miserably. All it does is end up getting me in trouble, because it’s something that’s clearly untrue. So that doesn’t make sense to me. And look at my other option. I could have simply said FOS **zeriel** , and why, and had there been someone _else_ who made similar comments, it then becomes “Why are you protecting so-and-so”? Better to hedge one’s bets, especially since I’m pretty sure I saw other people refer to the joke post when smudging **peeker**. If people think it’s a Scumfight, that’s one thing. But if you’re Scum, you know I’m Town, and if you’re Town, the motivation behind my actions makes no sense as Scum, when you parse it out. So your vote for me pretty much boils down to ill-supported OMGUS. Final thing to bring up. Had I simply said FOS **zeriel** , what would your response have been? Because this whole thing is a distraction from my initial point in making the FOS in the first place, and you’ve never really answered the substance of it that I can see. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/738 "2010-03-30T01:00:02Z")
Basically trying to stir disorder up by taking what one individual did and try to spread it out and make it sound like there is some kind of negative trend occurring. Perhaps trying to get us talking about that and distract us from more productive talk. Having said this, I don’t think it is that big of a deal. A bigger deal is how little active conversation is going on. Perhaps my perception is wrong, but this Day Two seems very slow. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/739 "2010-03-30T01:02:47Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > Good Lord but you sound like Elmo in this post! I was trying to go for the absurd with that one. Looks like I passed, and failed. Does no good if no one else gets me, right? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942/740 "2010-03-30T01:31:15Z")
Catching up here, since I didn’t look in much on the thread over the weekend: The first thing I can say is that I don’t think it’s profitable to speculate about Scum’s reason for killing **NAF**. If, say, we had some claimed power roles on the table and NAF got killed over them, then, yeah, it might be interesting to speculate about (though, of course, the Scum might kill someone else in that situation just to keep Town confused, so it still isn’t all that helpful to Town). And if it were a later Night, and the deceased turned out to be a valuable power role, we might consider the possibility that the Scum have an investigator (though frankly, I’ve seen a lot of Scum lucky shots on power roles). But on Night 1, with no power claims, Scum are probably just going to pick at random from the set of skilled Town players. **NAF** is a skilled player, and apparently Town, so his death is consistent with this simplest hypothesis. The second thing I’m wondering about: Is there some easy way to check the history of the games at Idle and Giraffe? I’m wondering just how many games **Tom Scud** has played in where each Day/Night has a separate thread. If he’s played a lot of them, then it makes his “slip” much more plausible, but if he’s only played a few, then it’s more suspicious. I’ll probably have more to say after I’ve had a chance to go through and update my notes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/random-mafia/532942.md?page=38)