# Rank the Avengers (from new movie) by strength **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 1, 2012, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406 "2012-03-01T00:09:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2012, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/61 "2012-03-04T13:59:28Z")
There is no “World War Thor” plot arc, because Thor wouldn’t be a challenge for the combined powers of all superheroes and villains in the world. “World War Hulk” only ended because Hulk graciously decided not to kill literally everything. We all (including Thor) exist at Hulk’s whim. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2012, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/62 "2012-03-04T15:19:25Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > There is no “World War Thor” plot arc, because Thor wouldn’t be a challenge for the combined powers of all superheroes and villains in the world. > > “World War Hulk” only ended because Hulk graciously decided not to kill literally everything. We all (including Thor) exist at Hulk’s whim. During Civil War, when Iron Man ‘recruited’ Ares, he told Ares that if Ares didn’t comply, he’d bring down a world of hurt on him from a host of heroes capable of stopping Ares. When he tried to get Thor to sign on, Thor sent him back with his tail between his legs, and their was no Stark boasting. I don’t know if Thor has been ‘de-powered’ again, though. Where does Juggernaut fit in versus the Hulk. I don’t think he and Hulk tangled in WWH (though I could be wrong). I also don’t know what has happened to Juggie in the past ~15 years. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2012, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/63 "2012-03-04T17:49:05Z")
Colossus is Juggernaut now. In either incarnation, he’s right up there with Thor and Hulk. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2012, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/64 "2012-03-04T23:11:49Z")
> [@Ephemera](#): > > Colossus is Juggernaut now. WTF Some days I really miss comics, then I hear something like this and not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Reno\_Nevada](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Reno\_Nevada](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reno_Nevada)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/65 "2012-03-05T01:21:15Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Is there anyone in Marvel who, canonically, has _normal_ human strength? It seems like all of the badass-normal heroes have “peak human strength”, and then you’ve got literal cripples like Professor X, but without really anyone in between. The only one I can think of off-hand is Dr. Strange, Sorcerer Supreme, but I am sure there are others. ---
**Author:** ![GovernmentMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e9c0ed/32.png) [@GovernmentMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GovernmentMan)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/66 "2012-03-05T01:48:49Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > There is no “World War Thor” plot arc, because Thor wouldn’t be a challenge for the combined powers of all superheroes and villains in the world. > > “World War Hulk” only ended because Hulk graciously decided not to kill literally everything. We all (including Thor) exist at Hulk’s whim. Odin Force Thor would have been an even more difficult opponent for Marvel Earth to handle. World War Hulk could have easily been ended if Dr. Strange wasn’t affected by plot-stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/67 "2012-03-05T02:05:51Z")
> [@GovernmentMan](#): > > World War Hulk could have easily been ended if Dr. Strange wasn’t affected by plot-stupidity. Yes, but that’s true of just about every story. Dr. Strange has to be taken out of the loop immediately or the book is very slim. ---
**Author:** ![bramma23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@bramma23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bramma23)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/68 "2012-03-05T04:25:41Z")
Pardon what I’m sure is a stupid question, but where does Soloman Grundy rank amongst a crowd? Or is he in a different universe that doesn’t fit with these characters? What about Bane? ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/69 "2012-03-05T04:27:15Z")
Those are DC characters. Avengers is a Marvel property. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/70 "2012-03-05T04:28:30Z")
> [@bramma23](#): > > Pardon what I’m sure is a stupid question, but where does Soloman Grundy rank amongst a crowd? Or is he in a different universe that doesn’t fit with these characters? What about Bane? Well, they’re DC not Marvel, so yeah - different universe, different publisher. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/71 "2012-03-05T04:54:17Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Yes, but that’s true of just about every story. Dr. Strange has to be taken out of the loop immediately or the book is very slim. Heck, all three _X-Men_ movies did this with Professor X - take him out midway (or earlier). ---
**Author:** ![Binarydrone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3da27b/32.png) [@Binarydrone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Binarydrone)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/72 "2012-03-05T18:06:39Z")
Thought you folks might find this interesting: [For Figs: The scans of the Strength listings from Amazing Spider-Man Annual #15 - Forum 2.0 - Captain Comics](http://captaincomics.ning.com/forum/topics/for-figs-the-scans-of-the) ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/73 "2012-03-05T19:24:51Z")
> [@Binarydrone](#): > > Thought you folks might find this interesting: [For Figs: The scans of the Strength listings from Amazing Spider-Man Annual #15 - Forum 2.0 - Captain Comics](http://captaincomics.ning.com/forum/topics/for-figs-the-scans-of-the) Someone seriously goofed with the Silver Surfer. He’s up with Thor, Hercules, etc. I know that some of those have changed over the years, but I’m pretty sure Surfer has consistently been up there. Of course, that is all Spidey’s opinion and maybe he just didn’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/74 "2012-03-05T20:05:46Z")
I think that’s covered under “this is just physical strength, not total power”: The Surfer could beat almost anyone on that chart, but he wouldn’t do it by just punching them. The two I’m wondering about are She-Hulk being only at Spidey’s strength level, and the Beast being _weaker_. And who’s the top-tier dude who only wants to be an actor? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/75 "2012-03-05T20:19:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The two I’m wondering about are She-Hulk being only at Spidey’s strength level, and the Beast being _weaker_. > > And who’s the top-tier dude who only wants to be an actor? Wonder Man wants (or at one time wanted) to be an actor/stuntman. She-Hulk should most definitely _not_ be at Spider-Man’s level, but an order of magnitude above. I can picture Beast being at or slightly below Spidey’s level, and while a one-on-one fight would be interesting, in all fairness I’d give it to Spidey. Of course, my knowledge base is a decade or more out of date. I actually have the comic book being cited, and maybe at the the time, She-Hulk (being a relatively new character, first appearing only a year or two earlier) was still in flux. By the time of the first Secret Wars series, though, she’d be in the “Heavyweights” section. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/76 "2012-03-05T20:29:26Z")
As an further incidental, Colossus should also be moved up a tier, though the comic does indicate that was going to happen when he matured. I don’t see how Luke Cage outmuscles Spider-Woman, though, even in 1981. It looks like this list is at least partly biased by how well established and/or popular the character is, perhaps with a touch of sexism thrown in for laughs. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/77 "2012-03-05T22:51:30Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I think that’s covered under “this is just physical strength, not total power”: The Surfer could beat almost anyone on that chart, but he wouldn’t do it by just punching them. True, Silver Surfer doesn’t need to punch, but as long as I can remember (and I was reading lots and lots of comics in 1981) SS has had at least Class 100 strength. I’ll still no prize it as Spidey truly didn’t know as SS never really needed to show his strength. I’m pretty sure that Beast, at that time, was ‘officially’ weaker than Spider-Man. Spidey has long been in the 10-ton lift range, beast was about 2 ton. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [March 5, 2012, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/78 "2012-03-05T23:37:58Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > True, Silver Surfer doesn’t need to punch, but as long as I can remember (and I was reading lots and lots of comics in 1981) SS has had at least Class 100 strength. I’ll still no prize it as Spidey truly didn’t know as SS never really needed to show his strength. I’m pretty sure that Beast, at that time, was ‘officially’ weaker than Spider-Man. Spidey has long been in the 10-ton lift range, beast was about 2 ton. Batman would still win. ---
**Author:** ![Satchmo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/satchmo/32/4223_2.png) [@Satchmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satchmo)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2012, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/79 "2012-03-06T00:24:04Z")
> [@Candyman74](#): > > Batman would still win. Only if … well, you know. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2012, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406/80 "2012-03-06T00:30:34Z")
> [@D\_Odds](#): > > True, Silver Surfer doesn’t need to punch, but as long as I can remember (and I was reading lots and lots of comics in 1981) SS has had at least Class 100 strength. I’ll still no prize it as Spidey truly didn’t know as SS never really needed to show his strength. I’m pretty sure that Beast, at that time, was ‘officially’ weaker than Spider-Man. Spidey has long been in the 10-ton lift range, beast was about 2 ton. The official Marvel handbooks gave numbers like this, as best I can recall. I’d have to dig up my copies, but as best I remember, the Surfer _could_ be Class 100 if he brought his Power Cosmic into play (the equivalent of wolfing down a can of space spinach, I guess), but rarely bothered to do so for strength when he could just zap his opponent, all while verbalizing at length how tragic and barbaric the battle was, or some damn thing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rank-the-avengers-from-new-movie-by-strength/614406.md?page=5)