# Rant: US Immigration **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 7, 2006, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359 "2006-03-07T10:12:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2006, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/41 "2006-03-07T22:47:14Z")
Often when I travel on business I have no idea what my address for the first night is. I’ll know that “there will be a driver with a sign waiting for you” or that “suchansuch coworker will arrive earlier, he’s been there before so he knows how to get to the hotel”. There have also been quite a few times when my hotel got changed while I was in flight and I found out when I got to the hotel and received an envelope from my employer (gee… and it’s now 10pm and I’m starving and I hate airplane food and…); once I asked to get a hotel change after one night (the first one gave me claustrophobia, the second one was half the price but with rooms twice the size and a shower I could actually close with me inside, and I’m no “supersize me” product). Usually I carry the address of the factory or client I’ll be visiting and that’s what I give to immigration if they ask for it; even if they recognize it as being a factory address (words like “industrial area Blahblahville” are a giveaway) they have always liked my explanation that it would be the best place to locate me if they needed to. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2006, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/42 "2006-03-07T22:48:40Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > How’s that whole EU thing working out for ya? 🙂 Not too well, thanks. As far as I can tell, the UK is making like an ostrich and pretending that the EU doesn’t exist. I was told with a huge sigh earlier on by a certain motor company representative: “there are only two countries in the EU who behave in such a ridiculous way: the UK, and France”. Make of that what you will. [**Pjen** aside though, I do have to agree with the _sentiment_ of his OP - if you’re not American, the US has now become the biggest pain in the arse in the world to get to (or pass through), at least in terms of western democracies.] ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2006, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/43 "2006-03-07T23:15:32Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > [**Pjen** aside though, I do have to agree with the _sentiment_ of his OP - if you’re not American, the US has now become the biggest pain in the arse in the world to get to (or pass through), at least in terms of western democracies.] The sentiment of his _OP_ was that it was horribly, wrenchingly inconvenient for him to have to scribble an address on a card while waiting in an airport, as opposed to doing it on the plane. (His later “sentiments” delved into complaints about the overall state of airport delays, fears about FBI and Homeland Security agents, perceptions of Americans as buffoons, the unconscionable policies of the U.S. post-9/11, etc. etc. etc.) In many ways, the archetypal **Pjen** “debate”-rant. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/44 "2006-03-08T00:06:50Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > [**Pjen** aside though, I do have to agree with the _sentiment_ of his OP - if you’re not American, the US has now become the biggest pain in the arse in the world to get to (or pass through), at least in terms of western democracies.] If it makes you feel any better, it’s not all that much fun for Americans, either. It never has been. I used to travel out of the country a lot (long before 9/11/01), and I often felt like I wasn’t wanted back in my own country. At least we’re not as bad as Israel (yet). Ever been there? Each passenger is interviewed individually for at least 10 minutes. Sometimes you then get another person who comes over and interviews you again-- asking the same questions but in a slightly different way. They do not mess around, and they couldn’t care less if the process pisses you off. Nor should they. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/45 "2006-03-08T01:02:39Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > Here’s the problem I have with the OP. He reads something about the US that he doesn’t like, but doesn’t understand. Instead of first trying to understand, he opens a Pit thread to bash the US. Where in the OP did he bash “the US”? > [@](#): > > Question silly procedures all you want, but make sure you at least try to understand them before you bash them. Ah. Silly procedures = US. Got it. > [@](#): > > You can hurt your nose with your knee that way if you’re not careful! Indeed. You and **Airman Doors** should both take care. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/46 "2006-03-08T01:17:24Z")
U.S. Customs = US. If you want to quibble that he’s only bashing the Customs dept, fine. But if you think “silly prcedures” is the issue, you didn’t read the thread title. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/47 "2006-03-08T01:41:41Z")
You know what? I pit all dumb immigration procedures in all countries. Fuck them! ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/48 "2006-03-08T01:58:50Z")
How is this different from the UK customs guy in Dover who asked me where I was staying in Britain? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/49 "2006-03-08T02:09:01Z")
That’s how Fascism starts. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/50 "2006-03-08T02:12:10Z")
> [@even sven](#): > > You know what? I pit all dumb immigration procedures in all countries. Fuck them! It’s a good thing we can all agree on which procedures are dumb and which aren’t! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/51 "2006-03-08T02:25:33Z")
Why would anyone have jet lag flying from Europe to the US? That is the easy direction. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/52 "2006-03-08T02:41:41Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > How is this different from the UK customs guy in Dover who asked me where I was staying in Britain? Or the UK Customs guy who not only asked me the address where I was staying in England, but my relationship to the residents of that address, as well as their own immigration/citizenship status in the UK and their current occupations? As well as whether I had an onward ticket from the UK? You think US immigration rules are fun, just try applying for a Soviet exchange student visa. I had to show a negative HIV test with my name on it (as do all foreigners who plan to spend more than 90 days there), which was difficult considering that at the time, basically all testing labs only did anonymous testing. Luckily that summer I was working for a psych counseling office that did a lot of gay couples counseling, so they had a connection with a lab. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/53 "2006-03-08T03:42:54Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > U.S. Customs = US. If you want to quibble that he’s only bashing the Customs dept, fine. But if you think “silly prcedures” is the issue, you didn’t read the thread title. You’re right, I judged the OP by its content, rather than its title. How careless of me. And no, U.S. Customs most definitely does not equal the U.S. Good lord, if I judged the U.S. or any other country based on the things I encountered at customs and immigration, I’d have joined Al Qaeda by now. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/54 "2006-03-08T05:54:46Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > You’re right, I judged the OP by its content, rather than its title. How careless of me. “Careless” is not the adjective I’d use. The title is an important indication of what the OP’s motivation is, and should be considered part of the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Sublight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/439d5e/32.png) [@Sublight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sublight)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/55 "2006-03-08T06:48:46Z")
Really. Why don’t you go ahead and tell me which adjective you’d use? To quote [yourself,](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7162413&postcount=28) I think you may have placed too much emphasis on the thread title. And even with the title, the OP still does not bash “the US”. ---
**Author:** ![Pjen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Pjen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pjen)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/56 "2006-03-08T07:05:43Z")
A rant is just a rant. The difficulty of traveling to the US has increased exponentially since 9/11. It was a rant. However, the rant has demonstrated a certain buffoonery among some Americans- Criticise my Country and I’ll criticise you Foreigners shouldn’t criticise the US, even tangentially. My Country right or wrong America, love it or leave it. Really! Can you imagine any of the Brits on this board responding in the same way if an American had criticised the appalling sub-facist mess that comprises British Immigration. No, I think most people would have joined in. I can’t imagine that anyone would respond in the way that **Airman Doors** and **John Mace** have done. Maybe we are just a little more laid back about our national identity and the possible imperfections in our social system. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/57 "2006-03-08T12:58:42Z")
No. It’s a very common occurance in the Pit that if your “rant” is stupid or unfounded, the Pit thread gets turned back on you. It has nothing to do with reflexive patriotism-- this happens in non-politcal threads, too. I can’t speak for **Doors** , but I’d have taken the same position if you had compalined about procedures in Britain, Spain or Australia. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/58 "2006-03-08T13:46:49Z")
> [@Pjen](#): > > However, the rant has demonstrated a certain buffoonery among some Americans- I find this amusing, coming from the guy in the clown suit. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mellivora\_capensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mellivora\_capensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mellivora_capensis)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/59 "2006-03-08T13:53:28Z")
> [@Sublight](#): > > And no, U.S. Customs most definitely does not equal the U.S. Good lord, if I judged the U.S. or any other country based on the things I encountered at customs and immigration, I’d have joined Al Qaeda by now. Imagine having to deal with _these_ guys on a regular basis. [http://www.news24.com/News24/South\_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442\_1834903,00.html](http://www.news24.com/News24/South_Africa/News/0,,2-7-1442_1834903,00.html) :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2006, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359/60 "2006-03-08T22:39:33Z")
> [@Eva Luna](#): > > You think US immigration rules are fun, just try applying for a Soviet exchange student visa. You know, something tells me that _would_ be very difficult…maybe even impossible. My question was serious, btw. Are you equally upset that the (really very friendly) man at the Dover customs wanted to know what I would be doing in Britain, where I would be staying, and how long I would be there? I dunno, it seemed fairly reasonable to me that they would want to know what the citizen of another country was doing there. Possibly I should have had a hissy fit and refused to answer? Not that US immigration isn’t absurd. As a US citizen, I don’t have to deal with it, but the stories I’ve heard make my head hurt. Especially those from non-US citizens who’ve married Americans and are trying to get green cards. My Canadian coworker practically burst into tears when I asked him about the process. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rant-us-immigration/347359.md?page=4)