# Rantings about stupid nuclear reporting, and I want to bitchslap somebody, also other crap **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 26, 2011, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077 "2011-03-26T19:11:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 37
**Author:** ![randomface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5fc32e/32.png) [@randomface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randomface)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/721 "2011-06-15T16:53:22Z")
What are your qualifications again? Is all your information based on news articles, or did you ever study anything remotely related to this at a recognized educational location, maybe a college somewhere? If this information has been posted elsewhere, I apologize. Please point me to it. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/722 "2011-06-15T16:55:00Z")
It’s no surprise at this point that the fruitbats would want to talk about anything except reality. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/723 "2011-06-15T17:02:52Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > It’s no surprise at this point that the fruitbats would want to talk about anything except reality. With your posts as the basis for this thread, talking about reality would constitute a hijack. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/724 "2011-06-15T18:01:17Z")
Ah, the good old days. > [@FXMastermind](#): > > No you complete assfuck idiot, that is not why people are afraid, nor is that how radiation works, or why it’s a problem. Go sell your propaganda somewhere else bitch. When nuclear propagandists still got air time, when they still tried to spin it as all quite mundane, a minor accident, not even as bad as TMI > [@FXMastermind](#): > > You see? There is no level of screed or usenet spench that I can summon up to bury that level of idiocy. You can bury it with boron and a million tons of concrete and sand and it will leak out, make it’s way around the world, and stupidity will rain down upon us all. The failed attempts to convince the gullible that radioactive material from reactors and burning fuel rods was just like natural radiation everybody is always exposed to. According to the ‘official’ story, we all get an average background dose of about 2.4 millisievert (mSv) per year.[[3](http://www.unscear.org/docs/reports/gareport.pdf)] This exposure is mostly from cosmic radiation and natural radionuclides in the environment[[2](http://www.taishitsu.or.jp/radiation/index-e.html)] This is a dose rate of 0.000273 mSv/hr That is the hourly dose from natural radiation. (No, you won’t see that on the xkcd chart) [http://xkcd.com/radiation/](http://xkcd.com/radiation/) When you see a report that the Fukushima province has an area with 20MSv/hr due to mostly cesium contamination, you don’t hear this reported as what it actually means. Because it means your yearly dose there is 175,200 mSv/a, which can also be presented as 175 Sv/a You will see that standing next to the Chernobyl reactor after meltdown is 50Sv He leaves out the actual rate, and says 10 minutes is 50Sv it should say the dose is 300Sv/hr, which is important to know. He does mention 8Sv is fatal. So it’s not hard to understand why 20mSv/hr is alarming to those who measure it in Japan. Then with a little effort, you can figure put what the mSv/hr is that will kill you in less than a year. It’s around .9 mSv/hr Or 1mSv/hr You won’t see that on any chart either. It’s not even hard to figure these things out. much less see why TEPCO evacuates everybody when they get a reading of 200mSv/hr at the plant. that rate will kill you in less than two days. Of course you will get sick much sooner than that. But it means death, nothing will save you. Of course you can also get the same dose by working in 20mSv/hr for a longer time. About 17 days and you are dead, no matter what. When they mark debris with a 1Sv/hr sign, they know what that means. It’s all quite fascinating, and the real conversation go on elsewhere with out ceasing. I just come here to vent now and then. You all are so encouraging. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/725 "2011-06-15T18:12:51Z")
> [@randomface](#): > > What are your qualifications again? Is all your information based on news articles, or did you ever study anything remotely related to this at a recognized educational location, maybe a college somewhere? If this information has been posted elsewhere, I apologize. Please point me to it. Naw, My bet is that he is one of those instant internet experts. Before this Japanese thing he probably didn’t know crap about nuclear power. But now that he’s done some reading he’s got it all figured out . Which could have been the case if his logic wasnt all retarded and shit. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/726 "2011-06-15T18:34:21Z")
> [@randomface](#): > > If this information has been posted elsewhere, I apologize. What are you? Like thirteen or something? " I apologize"? Seriously? That troll tactic went out of style 10 years ago or more. At least try to write like you graduated high school. ---
**Author:** ![randomface](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5fc32e/32.png) [@randomface](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randomface)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/727 "2011-06-15T19:04:33Z")
Apparently being civil is a troll tactic. So, moron, what credentials do you have to be even remotely knowledgeable about anything more complicated than an empty box? ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2011, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/728 "2011-06-15T19:14:28Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > The level of intellect here is fucking astounding I think all sides of this debate would agree that you have a truly unique understanding of this event. Tell me, in your expert opinion, do you think that the world’s smokers should be concerned about heightened levels of cancer following this terrible incident? ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/729 "2011-06-16T00:40:45Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Ah, the good old days. > When nuclear propagandists still got air time, when they still tried to spin it as all quite mundane, a minor accident, not even as bad as TMI. > > The failed attempts to convince the gullible that radioactive material from reactors and burning fuel rods was just like natural radiation everybody is always exposed to. > > According to the ‘official’ story, we all get an average background dose of about 2.4 millisievert (mSv) per year.[[3](http://www.unscear.org/docs/reports/gareport.pdf)] > > This exposure is mostly from cosmic radiation and natural radionuclides in the environment[[2](http://www.taishitsu.or.jp/radiation/index-e.html)] > > This is a dose rate of 0.000273 mSv/hr > > That is the hourly dose from natural radiation. (No, you won’t see that on the xkcd chart) > [http://xkcd.com/radiation/](http://xkcd.com/radiation/) Okay. So far so good. > [@FXMastermind](#): > > When you see a report that the Fukushima province has an area with 20MSv/hr due to mostly cesium contamination, you don’t hear this reported as what it actually means. And straight away, you run into your old problem of not actually LINKING to the report you’re talking about, and using the wrong units anyway (capital M is mega, small m is milli, and µ is micro). I can find no such dose rates for anywhere in Fukushima prefecture. 20 millisieverts a YEAR, yes [http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10\_08.html](http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/10_08.html). Or up to 91 microsieverts/hour, yes. (Micro, not milli!) [http://blog.energy.gov/content/situation-japan](http://blog.energy.gov/content/situation-japan) But 20 millisieverts an hour, no. Give a LINK. Because otherwise you end up posting a load of crap. > [@FXMastermind](#): > > Because it means your yearly dose there is 175,200 mSv/a, which can also be presented as 175 Sv/a Load of crap. Correct maths, incorrect starting data. > [@FXMastermind](#): > > You will see that standing next to the Chernobyl reactor after meltdown is 50Sv > > He leaves out the actual rate, and says 10 minutes is 50Sv > > it should say the dose is 300Sv/hr, which is important to know. > > He does mention 8Sv is fatal. So it’s not hard to understand why 20mSv/hr is alarming to those who measure it in Japan. > > Then with a little effort, you can figure put what the mSv/hr is that will kill you in less than a year. > > It’s around .9 mSv/hr > > Or 1mSv/hr > > You won’t see that on any chart either. It’s not even hard to figure these things out. much less see why TEPCO evacuates everybody when they get a reading of 200mSv/hr at the plant. > > that rate will kill you in less than two days. Of course you will get sick much sooner than that. But it means death, nothing will save you. > > Of course you can also get the same dose by working in 20mSv/hr for a longer time. About 17 days and you are dead, no matter what. > > When they mark debris with a 1Sv/hr sign, they know what that means. > > It’s all quite fascinating, and the real conversation go on elsewhere with out ceasing. I just come here to vent now and then. > > You all are so encouraging. Without a cite for your 20 mSv/h dose rate, it’s a load of crap. Again. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/730 "2011-06-16T00:57:36Z")
[![](http://maptd.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/fukushima-ground-radiation.jpg) ](http://maptd.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/fukushima-ground-radiation.jpg) While the levels stop at .091 mSv/hr on the chart, isolated areas within the two highest zones measured 20mSv/hr, downspouts, ditches and ponds where rainwater collected. But you don’t even need that to realize the reality, the .1 mSv/hr rates (which they do acknowledge) means 8.75 Sv/a (8 Sieverts in a year) That is from the official report/chart Once again, 8 sieverts means death. That red zone is a death zone. Nobody is even trying to deny that. OK the moonbats are, but nobody who deals with reality is. Plans to decontaminate the soil are already being made. Meanwhile, levels in sewage treatment plants have gone up so high the sludge is too radioactive to use. For anything. (radioactivity ends up washing into the lowest points, and nothing is lower than sewage it seems) Back to Fukushima. Areas outside the plant have readings of 300 mSv/hr Areas inside the plant reach 700 Sv/hr Of course you want sources. That you don’t have any, that is sad man. I told you that you haven’t kept up. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/731 "2011-06-16T00:59:17Z")
Now of course if this was a serious science based discussion, sources and links would be numerous. But cmon, you act like a moron, insult and try to distract from every last thing you don’t like, and then expect me to treat you like an adult? Grow the fuck up. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/732 "2011-06-16T01:02:24Z")
Look, I know it’s a complete waste of time, but learn to use Google for crying out loud. Here, let me show you, you put in “300 mSv/hr Fukushima” See? Like magic, sources. Like the one about the radiation leaking from reactor one BEFORE the tsunami struck. > [@](#): > > Data taken by workers entering the No. 1 reactor building at the crippled plant on the night of March 11 showing the radiation level was as high as 300 millisieverts per hour suggest a large amount of radioactive materials from nuclear fuel in the reactor was already released. [http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/world/2011-05/15/c\_13875604.htm](http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/world/2011-05/15/c_13875604.htm) So seriously, you really think I am going to do your homework for you? Grow up. ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/733 "2011-06-16T01:03:37Z")
What’s so damned pathetic is that it’s perfectly easy to rant about the TRUE state of affairs. 20 mSv/year is the annual limit for radiation workers, quite a bit higher than normally accepted for the general public, and it’s been exceeded in Date city 60 km away from the plant. That is palpably rantworthy. But instead you post utter shit about how “the Fukushima province has an area with 20mSv/hr” causing death in two days and complain about the “real” conversation going on elsewhere. It’s this kind of thing that earns you the abuse you receive, and yet you show no awareness of your own terrible judgement. To hell with it. I’m going to do you the favour of assuming that you’re actually smarter than you appear and you’re just jerking our chains. That you knew full well that your 20 mSv/h figure was bullshit and you composed your post just to provoke a correction, which you would then ignore and move on in your traditional manner. You’ve destroyed your credibility enough that there’s no longer any reason to refute your shit. At this point you could post a perfectly good, well reasoned, well referenced argument and everyone’s just going to assume it’s crap if they read it at all. Congratulations. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/734 "2011-06-16T01:19:20Z")
It was the link to the 300mSv/hr detected from reactor one before the tsunami. That’s what got you so upset. I can feel it. All this time the cry of the poor nuclear lover was how the reactors stood up to the worst earthquake ever and it was the bad tsunami that did them in. Now that your spurious claim is trashed, you must feel bad. ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/735 "2011-06-16T02:02:26Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > It was the link to the 300mSv/hr detected from reactor one before the tsunami. That’s what got you so upset. I can feel it. > > All this time the cry of the poor nuclear lover was how the reactors stood up to the worst earthquake ever and it was the bad tsunami that did them in. > > Now that your spurious claim is trashed, you must feel bad. I made that claim back on March 14th based on information available at the time. So no, your month-later cite of one news source quoting another quoting an un-named “utility source” doesn’t really make me feel bad since the claim wasn’t in fact spurious and is still not proven either way. I’m glad you linked to the same DOE map that I’ve been linking to for weeks showing the red zone, which has rightly been evacuated and will have to be quarantined for maybe more than a century as I’ve also been saying for some time. Thing is, that link didn’t actually support your 20 mSv/h, 8-days-till-death figure that you talked about right after it. In case you misunderstood, I was actually hoping for a source that supported this contention. You made the claim, it’s YOUR homework to back it up. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/736 "2011-06-16T02:31:54Z")
Naw, that would be in some science based discussion. Amongst the trolls and idiots, I don’t give two fucks. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2011, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/737 "2011-06-16T02:42:36Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > Naw, that would be in some science based discussion. Amongst the trolls and idiots, I don’t give two fucks. It’s actually pretty funny how you bounce back and forth between “I don’t need cites, you guys are chumps” and “WHY WON’T YOU READ MY AWESOME CIIIIIIITES?!” Depending, naturally, if your ass has been debunked with better cites on that particular page or not. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/738 "2011-06-18T15:32:32Z")
The latest nuclear crisis, which has been almost completely ignored by the major media (until today), illustrates why I am very skeptical of spurious claims that the ‘the media’ is alarmists. It’s obvious they are not. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/739 "2011-06-18T17:24:09Z")
> [@FXMastermind](#): > > The latest nuclear crisis, which has been almost completely ignored by the major media (until today), illustrates why I am very skeptical of spurious claims that the ‘the media’ is alarmists. It’s obvious they are not. And it’s obvious that you are. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2011, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077/740 "2011-06-18T17:28:19Z")
More trollish nonsense. I didn’t even say where or when or anything about the crisis. That you don’t know what I am even talking about is pretty damning. And funny as hell to boot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077.md?page=36) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rantings-about-stupid-nuclear-reporting-and-i-want-to-bitchslap-somebody-also-other-crap/576077.md?page=38)