# Re "Marriage is for White People" what is the "swag" that black men have, and white men do not? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 4, 2011, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147 "2011-09-04T06:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/61 "2011-09-08T17:18:49Z")
Gosh, I hate macho postering. The worst is when guys use nails instead of thumbtacks to hold up their posters because they think thumbtacks are for girls. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/62 "2011-09-08T17:33:41Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Gosh, I hate macho postering. The worst is when guys use nails instead of thumbtacks to hold up their posters because they think thumbtacks are for girls. Oops, I meant ‘posturing’. Smart ass. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/63 "2011-09-08T17:41:25Z")
And here I thought I’d found my soul mate, the one other person who shared my disdain for overly aggressive poster hanging techniques. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/64 "2011-09-08T17:49:13Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > And here I thought I’d found my soul mate, the one other person who shared my disdain for overly aggressive poster hanging techniques. 😉 Sigh. Ok. I will admit that[this](http://www.bagnewsnotes.com/files/bagnews/images/_us.yimg.com_p_rids_20050114_i_r3176634300.jpg)makes me a bit excited. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/65 "2011-09-08T17:54:25Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > According to several posters here, in a thread that I once had a long time ago about pickup artists, you CANNOT learn this “swagger thing.” According to these people, you are either born with it or you’re not. > > […] > > Apparently not. In some peoples’ minds, YOU CANNOT LEARN SWAGGER. So don’t even TRY! Resign yourself to living in a basement and masturbating to World of Warcraft, because you will be a loser for life! Okay, I’m not sure why you felt the need to make this post, **Argent Towers** , but here’s what I’ve learned from the dating/seduction/pick-up artistry threads here. Never ask women how to be a better seducer, because they don’t know, and what they think they know is actually counter-productive. They think they want a good man with similar interests as theirs to act as an equal partner, and that may not be untrue, but that’s not what melts them: what they want is, I wouldn’t say authoritarian, but at least a dominant man who’ll lead them into the relationship. God, I feel dirty and misogynistic typing this, since it just sounds like “bitches be crazy, they don’t know what they want, but they want a REAL MAN”, but looking at the definitions of swagger by the women here, it seems to be true. So in a sense “swagger” might just be going around _telling_ women what to do instead of _asking_. (Not forcing them, of course, but acting as if you’re the authority.) What’s weird is that this is almost exactly how I act with my ex. Of course, in her case, it’s because she’s so indecisive that I _have_ to take the decisions, if I don’t want to stare at the walls for hours while she decides something. In fact that’s one of the reasons I left her; I wanted someone who was much more active and who’d actually do something unprompted once in a while. But I think that when we’re doing something together I’m clearly the dominant partner. Then again, I wonder how much of what is said in these dating and seduction threads is general, and how much is specific to American culture. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2011, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/66 "2011-09-08T18:12:12Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Please people stop with the ‘black men needed to toughen up because the ghetto is tough and aren’t we lucky we don’t need to pretend to be macho’ stuff. > > Swagger is NOT macho postering. Macho postering is some kind of corny shit that cornballs do and it isn’t hot. Swagger = steez = style. It is an easy, confident, cool way that some people have. A-fuckin’-men. I grew up in quiet ruralville, PA, and there were plenty of guys who had swag. Sports stars, guys who were getting straight As at Vo-Tech–in my years, I have still not seen as much swagger on a guy as I did on the one dude who skipped a year in vo-tech welding and had a job lined up for the instant he turned 18, he was sufficiently good. He had it going on, in a meaningful way, and he was a whitebread guy from a nice churchgoing family with a living room done in pink and lace. ---
**Author:** ![Incubus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c68b51/32.png) [@Incubus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Incubus)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2011, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147/67 "2011-09-09T02:59:43Z")
> [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](#): > > Okay, I’m not sure why you felt the need to make this post, **Argent Towers** , but here’s what I’ve learned from the dating/seduction/pick-up artistry threads here. Never ask women how to be a better seducer, because they don’t know, and what they think they know is actually counter-productive. They think they want a good man with similar interests as theirs to act as an equal partner, and that may not be untrue, but that’s not what melts them: what they want is, I wouldn’t say authoritarian, but at least a dominant man who’ll lead them into the relationship. God, I feel dirty and misogynistic typing this, since it just sounds like “bitches be crazy, they don’t know what they want, but they want a REAL MAN”, but looking at the definitions of swagger by the women here, it seems to be true. So in a sense “swagger” might just be going around _telling_ women what to do instead of _asking_. (Not forcing them, of course, but acting as if you’re the authority.) > > What’s weird is that this is almost exactly how I act with my ex. Of course, in her case, it’s because she’s so indecisive that I _have_ to take the decisions, if I don’t want to stare at the walls for hours while she decides something. In fact that’s one of the reasons I left her; I wanted someone who was much more active and who’d actually do something unprompted once in a while. But I think that when we’re doing something together I’m clearly the dominant partner. > > Then again, I wonder how much of what is said in these dating and seduction threads is general, and how much is specific to American culture. I agree with much of this, in that I have noted that women are attracted to assertiveness and a take charge attitude. But it takes a very fine touch to accomplish this- either you’re being _too nice_ and end up coming off indecisive and a pushover, or your so domineering you just end up being a bossy jerk. Guys with swag are excellent communicators, not just with women but with men too- they often have a lot of friends and magnetic personalities. I’ve met guys with swag that, while I envied their poise, found it hard to actually hate them for anything in particular. I would say they have good qualities inherent to themselves- they don’t act in an arbitrary way to pick up women- their behavior is natural. In that sense, I can see how people could claim you gotta be ‘born’ with swag. Because if you are trying to act swaggy, you’re not going to fool anyone. If you have to ask what swag is/try to consciously learn it, you’ll get nowhere. Its this rather abstract level of poise and confidence thats a product of other learned behaviors. Finding something you’re passionate in, building a broad network of real life friends from different backgrounds, genuine confidence in yourself and a can-do, ambitious attitude will draw the swag in. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-marriage-is-for-white-people-what-is-the-swag-that-black-men-have-and-white-men-do-not/595147.md?page=3)