Okay this is rather tortured thinking but if this proposal fails won’t the pubbies just start saying: “We even tried to give authority to the president! A president that we disapprove of but we knew something need to be done. Obama was so ineffective that he didn’t take our extremely generous offer and now he’s single handedly stampeded the economy off a cliff!”
Well, Boehner for one does not seem to be quite a master of political manipulation. His stature and role has shrunk to the level of temp stenographer. The recent “success” of the GOP seems less like shrewd manipulation and more like riding a wave of blunt force stupidity.
Would they even have standing?
Well, that’s the problem with obvious traps.
The GOPbags can frame it as “Obummer borrows more from the Chinese!” and the Democrats can frame it as “Hey AARPer, if not for Obama doing this you’d have to downgrade to dry cat food”.
Seeing as how Ryan’s plan showed the GOP intentions, and seeing as how they allowed the Teabaggers to force this to run so close to the brink (such that it’s actually getting Serious Media Attention), I think the Democrats are a lot more likely to spin this in their favor than the GOPers are.
Of course, for either one it’s the public’s short attention span that makes this completely unpredictable.
Maybe Obama has finally seen the bipartisanship pony for what it is and has realized:
-Joe
And … if he does veto it, they can go back to their constituents say “Well, we gave him the power to do it and he didn’t so don’t blame us!” Either way, the republicans get to weasel out of taking the blame for not getting anything done.
Except for the rather important point that the Republicans are much better at spinning than the Democrats. The Dems never do this properly; even when handed high caliber ammunition they usually manage to drop it into the storm drains while trying to load their guns.*
The Democrats should be able to make good political use of this concession by the Republicans. I just see no evidence that they’re actually capable of doing so.
*This metaphor needs work, I know.
Oh, definitely. There’s no doubt that the Democrats could breathe life back into someone’s dying granny and by the end of the day the populace would still be convinced that in the fine tradition of Bill Clinton they were just trying to grope a geriatric.
On the other hand, things like the midwestern protests show that the most egregious stuff gets picked up on by the general population eventually. And this one is getting pretty bad.
-Joe
First of all, of course McConnell’s proposal is constitutional. There are numerous laws which relate to constitutional powers of Congress for which the Congress has decided that it would rather that someone else do the work. For example, the Art I Sec 8 power to regulate the value of money has pretty much been delegated for the Federal Reserve for the better part of a century now – but if that’s the way Congress wants its power to be exercised, then, goody for them. If Congress authorizes the President to issue more debt each time he dances the hokey-pokey on TV, then as long as there’s a valid law that authorizes such, that’s the way Congress wants the debt handled.
Second, I see this as a wonderful example of the Tea Party madness coming home to roost. The White House has so successfully put Republicans in a box on the debt, that they are euphemistically “advancing simultaneously in all directions,” or more succinctly, are completely disorganized and being routed. The only points Republicans seem to agree on is that tax increases that kick in only in future years are unacceptable, they can only barely manage support for a deficit reduction package that is half the size of what the White House has proposed, they are scared to vote on entitlements (even though they’ve already voted to end Medicare), and they can’t even put together a deficit reduction package that includes numbers that add up.
Meanwhile, Republicans disagree on whether defaulting on the debt is a good or bad thing, whether defense should take any kind of cut, who exactly is leading the negotiations with the White House, and they have no clue whatsoever on what to do next.
Thirdly, I’m starting to gain interest in wagers on whether Boehner will be Speaker come January 1. He is trying to lead, but literally no Republican is following him.
Saying things ain’t the same as leading. How Captain Pumpkin got into the big chair I can’t even figure out - he obviously isn’t any good at this.
The question is whether or not Cantor can sleaze his way into the spot or if someone less one-tracked will manage it.
-Joe
I’ll wager that his departure will be tearful.
Which headline?
Boehner Discharged
Boehner’s Salty Departure
-Joe
Now, now.
This talk of salty discharges is risking another admonition about proper language!
Yes, so as to avoid running afoul of the new Marley line of acceptable discourse (wherever that might lie), how about this instead:
Lachrymose Late Leader Laments Lacking Loyalty.
Or:
Lachrymose Late Leader Laments Lacking Loyal Lemmings.
Did the rules change? Or do we have a GOP Congress"person" on the SDMB now?
-Joe
I could not believe what I heard. Total abdication of Congressional responsibility for the debt ceiling. Way to go Repubs–you have really shown a bright light on your incompetence to govern.
No, the rules have not changed. I’m trying to keep this conversation GD-worthy. Please take any further questions or comments to ATMB.
Since it is unlikely the Tea Party will support any sort of tax increase, this seems to have been the only feasible option. Of course they were between a rock and a hard place, so either way they were f*****.
Debt ceiling votes are always political, they aren’t fiscal.
It’s all grandstanding, from both sides.
I’m really not seeing a downside for anyone. The debt ceiling is never news unless somebody is threatening to block an increase.