# Re women trading sex for dinner was dining out more valuable in the 50's and 60's than today? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 26, 2016, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285 "2016-03-26T22:49:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2016, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/21 "2016-03-29T02:27:56Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Here’s a 1955 menu from what looks to be [a pretty fancy restaurant in L.A.](http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0225/8107/products/tail_dinner_1024x1024.jpeg?v=1440025297) It looks like the complete dinners ranged from $2.75 to $4.50. Add coffee, maybe dessert and a cocktail and I guess the bill could be about $6.00 per person. > > Note that minimum wage (which is probably what a shop clerk or receptionist would make) was $.75 per hour in 1955. So a meal in a fancy restaurant could literally cost a day’s pay for a young woman. > > I’m not judging whether that obligated a woman to sleep with her date, but at least it lets you compare numbers. > > On the other hand, [a hamburger at McDonald’s cost 15 cents](http://holykaw.alltop.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/40618855-media_httpfarm3static_ydesr.jpg), so I hope no one would sell out for that. Has anybody here yet asked “What’s a quickie?” ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/22 "2016-03-30T12:58:06Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Has anybody here yet asked “What’s a quickie?” $5, same as in town. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/23 "2016-03-30T14:14:28Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Note that minimum wage (which is probably what a shop clerk or receptionist would make) was $.75 per hour in 1955. So a meal in a fancy restaurant could literally cost a day’s pay for a young woman. > > I’m not judging whether that obligated a woman to sleep with her date… You’re not? I am. It didn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/24 "2016-03-30T19:29:22Z")
In modern day Tokyo, (a select group of) high school girls and young women will effectively prostitute themselves out ([enjo kosai](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enjo_k%C5%8Dsai)) and the reason that they give is to be able to afford small luxuries; name brands, small vacations, etc. And I think that if you looked into the question further, you would find that the reason it’s worth it to them, is because they have no expectations of a good future. They have a brief amount of time, in the late teens, early twenties, to try and live life up before they’re going to end up stuck in a house, mopping floors, folding laundry, and changing diapers every day for the last 5-6 decades of their life. If they want to ever have a chance to be the prettiest girl in town, with the flashiest clothing; if they ever want to visit Hawaii or Paris; or whatever else, that brief period of freedom and youth is their only chance, but it requires money, and women just don’t have any financial prospects in Japan (nor in the US, back in the 50s and 60s). From the sounds of it, it seems like the women in the US were probably considering the night out at a nice restaurant, and hanging around with a smart, well-off guy was the fun part (including the sex). They weren’t angling for money to buy fancy clothes and entice younger men. They were probably a bit more discriminating in which partners they’d take a meal from, instead. But I’d venture to guess that the angle is the same, they were just trying to live it up, while they’re young and free. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/25 "2016-03-30T19:45:47Z")
The same phenomenon is present in the US (“sugar babies”) and doesn’t seem to have much to do with future prospects. I knew a sugar baby who was about to graduate at the top of her med school class; she had been in Playboy (as one of those “girls of someplace” spreads, not a centerfold) and it inspired her to find other ways to have men pay for things. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/26 "2016-03-30T20:20:53Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The same phenomenon is present in the US (“sugar babies”) and doesn’t seem to have much to do with future prospects. I knew a sugar baby who was about to graduate at the top of her med school class; she had been in Playboy (as one of those “girls of someplace” spreads, not a centerfold) and it inspired her to find other ways to have men pay for things. I think that the impulse is different there, even if the end result is similar. I’ve met a number of gamers, and they’d gladly spend the rest of their life at home, online, able to purchase ever single game that comes out. In the internet age, you can have a complete, 24/7 social life and have a lot of entertaining experiences from the comfort of your home. In Europe, at least, you can find a number of people who are taking advantage of government welfare programs to stay online and never work. I suspect that sugar babies are largely in the same group. They’ve discovered, and are narcissistic/psychopathic enough to not care about taking advantage of their daddies, that they can avoid stress, work, effort, and tedium and instead just stay home, playing video games, making cosplay outfits, and otherwise goofing off, just by virtue of being pretty. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/27 "2016-03-30T20:45:01Z")
Meh. Having sex with someone you find unattractive seems like pretty hard work to me. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/28 "2016-03-30T21:28:03Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Meh. Having sex with someone you find unattractive seems like pretty hard work to me. You’re assuming that they don’t have enough suitors to pick and choose a good looking one. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/29 "2016-03-30T21:42:11Z")
Well, yeah - because then it’s just called _dating_. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 30, 2016, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285/30 "2016-03-30T23:55:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Well, yeah - because then it’s just called _dating_. Possibly yes, possibly no. If the girl has a number of guys providing for her, then I think it’s reasonable to say that it’s not really dating. If she picks one guy, but either picks him because he enjoys the prospect of financially support her or on condition that he’ll financially support her, you can call that “dating between like-minded folks” or you could call it “lighthearted prostitution”, depending on how your personal views of psychology, propriety, and your knowledge of the individuals and their intentions all guide you to view the situation. I don’t know that there’s a factual answer. Is a trophy wife a proper spouse or a dedicated escort? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/re-women-trading-sex-for-dinner-was-dining-out-more-valuable-in-the-50s-and-60s-than-today/750285.md?page=1)