# Real-life "Alexander Dane" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 3, 2016, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068 "2016-02-03T17:01:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Nonsuch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nonsuch/32/2922_2.png) [@Nonsuch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nonsuch)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/21 "2016-02-04T15:17:39Z")
And Derek Jacobi played an Alexander Dane-like character on **Frasier** , to wit: Jackson Hedley, the man the boys first saw play _Hamlet_ and now stuck doing a sad circuit of sci-fi conventions owing to his one-time role on such a series. (The comic twist: Hedley really does suck, and is lucky to even be remembered as part of a crappy sci-fi show.) ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/22 "2016-02-04T15:52:36Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Alec Guinness, to a degree. Not that his early work was forgotten, but at the end of his life, he complained that all everyone wanted to talk to him about was Star Wars. Guiness is a good example of the Alexander Dane thing in that a lot of people mostly knew him for “Star Wars” but it’s worth noting he was nearing the end of his career anyway and he did after all get an Oscar nomination out of it. It did not hurt his legacy or reputation, and he was and is still remembered for his brilliant work in many other films. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/23 "2016-02-04T16:00:25Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Thought of another one: Dean Jones, the guy from the Herbie, the Love Bug movies. Did you know that he originated the part of Bobby (the lead role) in Sondheim’s Company? It’s funny, I \*only \*know him from **Company**. I had no idea he was so well known for those movies. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/24 "2016-02-04T16:49:40Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Guiness is a good example of the Alexander Dane thing in that a lot of people mostly knew him for “Star Wars” but it’s worth noting he was nearing the end of his career anyway and he did after all get an Oscar nomination out of it. It did not hurt his legacy or reputation, and he was and is still remembered for his brilliant work in many other films. In fact, Guinness (who continued to work solidly for the next decade and change after the original _Star Wars_) is pretty much a counterexample to this trope. Although science fiction fans may remember him exclusively as Obi-Wan Kenobi, he had a long history of major roles in significant films such as _Bridge on the River Kwai_, _Lawrence of Arabia_, _Our Man in Havana_, and _Doctor Zhivago_, and after _Star Wars_ he is remembered for his iconic performance as George Smiley in _Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy_ and _Smiley’s People_, Professor Gobble in Lean’s adaptation of _A Passage to India_, and Father Quixote in _Monsignor Quixote_, as well as a substantial body of stage work. Far from damaging either his career or reputation, his portrayal of Kenobi introduced him to a wider audience and resulted in a resurgence of interest in his older work. Numerous other examples presented in this thread follow the same pattern of actors who, while well known for a particular role, went on to do substantial work. The trope referenced by the o.p. (“The Classically Trained Extra”) is someone who is (or believes themselves to be) capable of much better work but held back by association with a relatively trivial role. It is curious that no one has mentioned the obvious source of the trope, which was Leonard Nimoy, who despite obvious talent, a distinctive screen presence, and an established body of work, basically did nothing but TV and voice acting roles (and some limited stage acting) after _Star Trek_. Citing actors who moved onto other roles in producing or directing, or who used a high profile role as a springboard into personal projects is not the same thing. Orson Welles is kind of a special case, insofar as his talent and ability to command the screen was always well recognized, but his constant fighting with studios over creative issues, alcoholism, and general drama overshadowed and limited his career. The same can be said for others like Sam Peckinpah or (later in his career) Richard Burton, who were reputed to be so difficult to work with that almost no one wanted to hire them. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/25 "2016-02-04T17:19:07Z")
As far as Alec Guinness goes, I’ve never seen Star Wars; I know him mostly for his early movies. I’ve seen Kind Hearts and Coronets; The Lavender Hill Mob; The Man in the White Suit; and The Ladykillers. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/26 "2016-02-04T18:14:01Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > It is curious that no one has mentioned the obvious source of the trope, which was Leonard Nimoy, who despite obvious talent, a distinctive screen presence, and an established body of work, basically did nothing but TV and voice acting roles (and some limited stage acting) after _Star Trek_. Of course he also became a successful director. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2016, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/27 "2016-02-04T23:00:05Z")
> [@Nonsuch](#): > > And Derek Jacobi played an Alexander Dane-like character on **Frasier** , to wit: Jackson Hedley, the man the boys first saw play _Hamlet_ and now stuck doing a sad circuit of sci-fi conventions owing to his one-time role on such a series. (The comic twist: Hedley really does suck, and is lucky to even be remembered as part of a crappy sci-fi show.) Yeah, I saw that episode (but you beat me to the reference!). > [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > It’s funny, I \*only \*know him from **Company**. I had no idea he was so well known for those movies. And actually, there are probably some people who remember Evans for his Shakespearean work, and have no idea of his TV career. To some extent this thread is a reflection of the reference pool of each of us. > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > It is curious that no one has mentioned the obvious source of the trope, which was Leonard Nimoy, who despite obvious talent, a distinctive screen presence, and an established body of work, basically did nothing but TV and voice acting roles (and some limited stage acting) after _Star Trek_. > Stranger Yeah, the Alexander Dane character always seemed to me to be an exaggeration of Nimoy: Dane is the cast member of “Galaxy Quest” who is the only alien, the only one wearing prosthetics on screen, and the one who is competing with the actor playing the Captain for screen time and good lines. That’s all Nimoy. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_s\_Son](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e19adc/32.png) [@Jim\_s\_Son](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_s_Son)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2016, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/28 "2016-02-05T13:05:33Z")
Marion Davies for the supposed portrayal of her in “Citizen Kane”. Then I’ve seen some of her supposedly good light comedies and wasn’t impressed. But comedy may not age well. Frank Deford once wrote about the “Who’s on First” routine of Abbott and Costello and noted it’s hard to remember how well they did at the box office for a decade. Or the conversation of the Algonquin Round Table of the 1920s doesn’t seem so witty and suphisticated decades later. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2016, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/29 "2016-02-08T19:08:24Z")
Despite the unflattering portrayal of the fictionalized Charles Foster Kane’s mistress and eventual wife in _Citizen Kane_, Marion Davies was a highly successful comedic actress who at one point used her personal fortune to keep Hearst from having to declare bankruptcy. Hearst’s promotion of Davies as a dramatic actress in historical films was misguided and probably led to the sometimes poor reputation she later garnered. Also, unlike the film, Davies remained with Hearst until his death, and rather than ending up as a wrecked alcoholic at a dive lounge, was heavily involved in philanthropic causes, and there is a clinic at UCLA named after her. She never married Hearst because his wife refused to grant him a divorce. There were a number of scandals associated with Davies, including an alleged (and later confirmed) pregnancy, and the death of Thomas Ince after a party on the Hearst yacht, but the decline of her career was largely due to waning interest in the career and Davies reaching an age in which studios would no longer cast her as a lead. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2016, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/30 "2016-02-08T20:59:45Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > …Orson Welles is kind of a special case, insofar as his talent and ability to command the screen was always well recognized, but his constant fighting with studios over creative issues, alcoholism, and general drama overshadowed and limited his career… As did his bulk. I just saw his 1966 B&W film _Chimes at Midnight_, drawn from several Shakespeare plays about Falstaff; Welles directed and starred. He’s good, but he’s also almost distractingly _enormous_. Scroll down to see him here - practically spherical in armor: [Chimes at Midnight - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chimes_at_Midnight). _Time_ magazine’s reviewer said that Welles was “probably the first actor in the history of the theater to appear too fat for the role” of the rotund Falstaff. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2016, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/31 "2016-02-08T21:21:31Z")
OTOH, his size served him well in **Touch of Evil.** ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2016, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068/32 "2016-02-08T21:45:16Z")
Note that a big part of this is that “Alexander Dane” still has a quasi-career of doing cons and commercials. If he’d been in another crappy 80s TV show he’d be utterly forgotten. What galls him is that he could have been a contender, but he’s only remembered for this cheesy science fiction show. But if he’d been on a cheesy cop show or a cheesy sitcom absolutely no one would remember him. Maybe it would have been easier for him to be utterly forgotten than remembered for something he didn’t respect. And Dane is clearly inspired by Nimoy who spent some time in the 70s wishing he could have a career beyond Spock, with some Shakespearean Thespian thrown in. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/real-life-alexander-dane/745068.md?page=1)