# Reasonably petty office situation. How to handle it? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 15, 2012, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767 "2012-10-15T12:49:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/61 "2012-10-16T00:16:03Z")
> [@PunditLisa](#): > > I think so. You can be organized without being inflexible. > > Create a subfolder to your inbox called “Meeting agenda items.” Drag all emails related to the meeting to this inbox. Quick, efficient, and flexible. Yep. Like my “to do list” folder where I can quickly scan for uncheckmarked e-mails rather than shuffle through the thousands in the inbox. ---
**Author:** ![Lasciel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e79b87/32.png) [@Lasciel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lasciel)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/62 "2012-10-16T00:45:50Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Thanks for all the responses so far, I appreciate it. > (snipped by me) > Is there really something inherently wrong with a single, simple process: ensure that all changes to the agenda are sent as an email response to my Monday email. > > Am I really being that unreasonable? Isn’t what I am doing called “being organised”? This is one of those situations where you can be “right” or you can focus on actually getting the job done to the best possible degree in concert with other fallible human beings. Fallible human beings are going to think of things to add to the agenda at other times than Monday morning, and in other places than at their computer desks with their email client open. In a perfect world, they would all have the ability and the mental filing system in place to record those things and then send them to you in a single format in a single time/place. Workspaces are not a perfect world, and I don’t believe you think that co-workers are perfect either. 😃 Give a little by making a process that’s a little flexible to allow people the chance to be human, but at the same time establishes some basic parameters so you don’t have to run around trying to collect thoughts from everyone. “If you have thoughts for the Agenda, please email me at any time before Monday, and put AGENDA into the subject line. Please do not send any Agenda-related information by word-of-mouth, IM, passenger pigeon, or while visiting the loo. The Agenda, my brain, and my Inbox greatly appreciate your cooperation.” Also, create a secondary email (or use a personal or specially created work email) to send emails to your work email address in the future - it makes life much easier. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/63 "2012-10-16T00:49:54Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Is there really something inherently wrong with a single, simple process: ensure that all changes to the agenda are sent as an email response to my Monday email. > > Am I really being that unreasonable? Isn’t what I am doing called “being organised”? Yes, there is something wrong. People have agenda ideas all week long. Giving them only one opportunity to add to the agenda risks missing some ideas. The problem isn’t necessarily with email. It is with only giving people one very time-bound point of entry. It’s okay to have a single process, but it needs to be something that suits everyone’s needs _and makes for quality agendas_. Your system is not well suited for doing that. Email threads are great for some things, but they are pretty bad for gathering feedback from a large group, as it’s easy for things to get lost or buried in long threads, and long threads can quickly get cluttered and confusing. If you are stuck on email, I’d set up an email address just for agenda items, and people could send their ideas in whenever. Once a week you could scan through the folder and bring together all of the ideas. But email is at its core a communication tool, and it makes a poor fit as a project management tool. I would prefer any one of the literally thousands of collaborative tools available to businesses, from Google Docs to Basecamp, where the team can add to the agenda in real time. Indeed, if the purpose of the meeting is to catch up on industry news, it could be a valuable resource to have a real time collaborative space to bring up these trends. It may encourage people to think ahead and start putting these ideas together in their own head so they have more substantial things to contribute at the meeting. ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/64 "2012-10-16T01:08:40Z")
My boss wants me to call people with requests, it might be a set of eight or ten (people and scraps of info). Inevitably they ask me to send an email - they need to forward it here and there and/or they just need it in writing. He does not want me to just send the e which is what I would do myself. So I call the person and add “as per our conversation” at the front of the email I send them while on the phone. I think the OP is being reasonably petty. I would copy them IM and email it to myself and then organize it. When you say you’re being organized, actually you’re trying to organize someone else. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/65 "2012-10-16T01:49:19Z")
> [@moejoe](#): > > Hmm, how about this: Mr. Dude comes to my desk to talk about 73 things he wants me to do and I take notes and agree that I’ll do them. And then, at the end of the conversation I say by the way, Mr. Other Dude needs seven chairs set up for the meeting tomorrow instead of the six he originally requested. Is that really something that needs an email reminder? Honestly I’m not giving him the nuke codes or anything. Again, what do you feel is more important? That you take two seconds to send him a reminder? Or that you feel the smug satisfaction that you offhandedly gave him a task that he promptly forgot as soon as someone more senior gave him a new task? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/66 "2012-10-16T01:51:00Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Am I really being that unreasonable? Isn’t what I am doing called “being organised”? If you’re adding tasks to someone else’s list, that’s not “being organized.” ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/67 "2012-10-16T02:17:00Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > If you’re adding tasks to someone else’s list, that’s not “being organized.” Which is arguably what the person sending an IM is doing by stepping outside established procedure. ---
**Author:** ![moejoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@moejoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/moejoe)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/68 "2012-10-16T02:27:45Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Which is arguably what the person sending an IM is doing by stepping outside established procedure. And what Mr. Dude is doing to me when he asks me to send an email to remind him of something I told him three seconds ago. There’s always someone asking someone to do something, that’s how offices work. But sometimes it’s an appropriate request and sometimes it isn’t. And I’m not just talking about a top down thing because if my boss says send me an email I send an email and don’t think twice about it. Or if I’m assigning a task to someone an email seems like a good idea so the instructions are clear. But if it’s coworkers, or just a piece of information passing from one person to another with no task attached then I think it’s different and the -send me an email- starts to feel like a power thing. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/69 "2012-10-16T03:44:01Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > I think the OP is being unreasonable. You’ve been asked to add the change. It’s now your job to remember to do it. It’s not rocket surgery. Melanie has given you the information you need. I don’t think it’s reasonable for you to ask for it in a different format at a different time. Nah, Melanie is playing pissy little power games, the type it’s really hard to deal with. If the OP complains Melanie doesn’t send an email, the boss or teams thinks OP is being petty; if Melanie complains her item doesn’t get on the agenda, she will somehow - and I don’t know how - manage to not look petty. (I would recommend documenting every interaction with Melanie.) ---
**Author:** ![Taomist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Taomist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Taomist)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/70 "2012-10-16T04:39:40Z")
You may have to just remind and insist that the timed emails are what’s required. I worked for a company in Virginia that covered 15 floors; everyone had IM, 'cause otherwise every team would spend their days in the elevator, shuttling between floors to talk to people. And it became very apparant, very quickly, that anything important or that needed to be documented NEEDED to be in email, it just NEEDED to be. And after a short time of people insisting on this, it wasn’t taken personally anymore when someone said “Hey, shoot this to me in an email.” The Inbox is King! This is true in many places, and nobody should be outraged by being asked to use it. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/71 "2012-10-16T09:19:38Z")
I’m sorry, but most of you do sound petty and unreasonible. “OMG, I’m so put out because Soandso is making me send that extra email! They sent me the info I need using the wrong medium! Oh the horror!” This is a perfect example of why people think Corporate America is full of petty beurocratic morons. Presumably you have this weekly team meeting to fulfill some legitimate business purpose? Asigning roles and tasks to the team, managing projects, make business decisions, whatever? Putting together an agenda for the meeting should be a 15 minute process of polling the attendees so that time can be allotted for their topics during the meeting. And yet somehow the focus has shifted to the creation of the agenda, as if that were in and of itself a significant project. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/72 "2012-10-16T09:33:25Z")
Make sure to leave that item off the agenda. Won’t be a problem next time. Of course there is tons of preparation work that had to be done ahead of time to let people know not to pull that kind of bullshit with you. If you’d taken the pre-emptive action already this wouldn’t have happenned. But if you put that item on the agenda without a Monday reminder this problem will continue and get worse. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/73 "2012-10-16T09:43:48Z")
Obviously there is a line somewhere between “who cares about the origin of this one request, you know about it and just deal with it” and “don’t put up with lazy coworkers who create work for you.” But the advice from a couple people - to make sure that this request by IM is ignored, is a totally childish and unprofessional suggestion. Plotting ways to make coworkers pay for using the wrong kind of electrons instead of applying a few moments worth of effort to fix what seems like a one-off problem? That kind of behavior just isn’t suitable for grown adults. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/74 "2012-10-16T10:46:42Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Is there really something inherently wrong with a single, simple process: ensure that all changes to the agenda are sent as an email response to my Monday email. There’s nothing inherently wrong with your process. The issue is with the idea that nobody is allowed to contact you on Thursday or Friday regarding the agenda. In business, people are going to occasionally contact you out of the blue with a request. If you are competent, you can handle such a thing. Being organized is not just about having a process to follow, it’s having a process that can handle one off requests, without them being lost. If the agenda is a document, when someone asks you to add something… add it. Don’t sit on it for 4 days and wait for all the input to come in, just add it. Then it’s part of your Monday email, no harm no foul, you don’t have to remember it, it’s already done. That’s organized. BTW, It is generally fair to request an email for organizational purposes. It is generally not fair to request communication at a specific time that suits your purposes. If someone has an idea, they should not have to wait for you to be “ready” to get the information. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/75 "2012-10-16T13:51:45Z")
> [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Is there really something inherently wrong with a single, simple process: ensure that all changes to the agenda are sent as an email response to my Monday email. > > Am I really being that unreasonable? Isn’t what I am doing called “being organised”? What the hell kind of an “office” job do you do that preparing an agenda on a rotational basis is such a big deal to you? Being organized means being able to get input from different sources and getting them all together for the agenda. It does not mean having others do your work for you. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/76 "2012-10-16T16:26:40Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Can’t you leave her item off the email agenda and when she calls you on it later be all “Oops, I forgot, sorry - that’s why I need that stuff in email!” Yep. If she gives you any flak, say, “Well, I asked you for a reminder…” That “This i\*s \*the reminder” is pretty blamed rude. One doesn’t remind one of what is immediately at hand. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/77 "2012-10-16T16:30:55Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Yep. If she gives you any flak, say, “Well, I asked you for a reminder…” > > That “This i\*s \*the reminder” is pretty blamed rude. One doesn’t remind one of what is immediately at hand. It’s pretty blamed rude to ask for a reminder of what someone at work has just told you that relates to your work, when you are sitting at your desk. Create your own reminder. ---
**Author:** ![Saraya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@Saraya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saraya)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/78 "2012-10-16T17:56:04Z")
Whatever you do, don’t ‘message’ her back; do a normal person thing and get up and see them. The more you do that, the more you shun them into using such useless methods as instant messaging less and less and hopefully in the future they won’t be so quick as to fire back needless comments (people tend to be less confrontational in person). ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/79 "2012-10-16T18:53:17Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > It’s pretty blamed rude to ask for a reminder of what someone at work has just told you that relates to your work, when you are sitting at your desk. Create your own reminder. This is the problem response. > [@KellyCriterion](#): > > Melanie’s response: “This IS the reminder!, _smiley face_”. That’s a bad attitude to have in the work place. Everyone has responsibilities here, but if Melanie wants to make sure her item is on the agenda she shouldn’t have responded that way, and followed up on Monday. Trying to shift the responsibility for something like that is not a good sign. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767/80 "2012-10-16T19:04:46Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Trying to shift the responsibility for something like that is not a good sign. It’s the OP who is guilty of trying to shift responsibility to someone else. When you get a task at work, you do it. You don’t ask for the person giving you the task to remind you to do it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reasonably-petty-office-situation-how-to-handle-it/637767.md?page=5)