# Reboot the Pit Rule Decision Process: A Proposal **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [February 27, 2009, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640 "2009-02-27T09:41:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2009, 9:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/1 "2009-02-27T09:41:43Z")
> [@Y'all PLEASE Find A Way To Make This Work!](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/yall-please-find-a-way-to-make-this-work/487320/32): > > Ed is making an honest effort at trying to lessen offensive conduct in The Pit… I see disappointingly little that merits the adjective “honest” in what TPTB have, in my view, unwisely, haphazardly, and ever-more-evidently _ **irreversibly** _ forced upon a distressed, anxious, and highly demoralized majority. It is my opinion that an _honest_ effort would have required openly soliciting public discussion regarding the proposed rule changes _before_ deciding and implementing them. This did not happen, even though various administrators were explicitly asked repeatedly that the membership be shown _at least_ this minimum degree of basic respect and courtesy. It is my opinion that an _honest_ effort would have required actively participating in such interactive discussions in full good faith, answering questions candidly and earnestly, rather than in what I consider to too often be a dismissive, condescending, or facetious manner. This did not happen. It is my opinion that an _honest_ effort would have required thoroughly explaining their justifications for the rule changes by providing multiple links to posts or threads that exemplified the problems the rule changes were meant to alleviate, and then set forth at sufficient length and detail just _how_ the proposed changes would be expected to ameliorate the problem. This did not happen. It is my opinion that an _honest_ effort would have required that the administrators seriously solicit and then implement, on a trial basis, alternative solutions to the stated problems which would begin with the least impactful or drastic alternative and then moving on incrementally to more draconian solutions only if the less severe alternatives fail. **Were The Powers That Be to open their minds and reboot their decision-making process – to begin anew and follow a method similar to the one this post describes – and after that process is complete it turns out that the rules as they stand right now (at least rule 2) are shown to be the best or only solution, then I will gladly cease and desist any and all objections. If greater funding is required to accomplish this, I, for one, will gladly contribute more to the cause.** _ **Who’s with me?** _ ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2009, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/2 "2009-02-27T10:09:15Z")
> [@ambushed](#): > > It is my opinion that an _honest_ effort would have required thoroughly explaining their justifications for the rule changes by providing multiple links to posts or threads that exemplified the problems the rule changes were meant to alleviate, and then set forth at sufficient length and detail just _how_ the proposed changes would be expected to ameliorate the problem. This did not happen. I think that is exactly right. I can guess at the motivation. Using my guesses I can see several options that I think would work. I think my ideas would not please everybody but they would go over better than the new rules. I’m sure others could come up with even better ideas. But it all starts with answering the the first question. Why? And no vague “raising the tone of the board” answers. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2009, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/3 "2009-02-27T17:00:23Z")
It’s not a bad suggestion at all, but I’m afraid it’s too late for that now. Ed’s probably thinking that yeah, he screwed the pooch on this one, but he doesn’t want to back down…or be seen to “give in” to the protests. As an alternative, perhaps there could be a committee of mods/admins and posters…and not just the suckup posters…to jointly review board policy every 6 months or so, and make reccomendations. Yeah, that means **Ed** , **Lynn** and **Gfactor** would have to work with people they hate and want to leave…like me, or other vocal opponents of this ridiculous over-reaction. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/4 "2009-02-27T17:03:36Z")
I will admit that I am curious to know their thinking. I also have to say I liked the Pit exactly as it was, and moreover I really _hate_ it when the community gets all torn apart like this. But I am inclined to read between the lines. This didn’t occur in a vacuum. Ed had better things to do with his time than babysit the board up until the Chicago Reader was acquired by Creative Loafing which then did an economic faceplant of its own. Suddenly there are Barn House and Chicago Online subsections of the board, and not long after that, new Disneyfication of the Pit. C’mon, don’t you figure it’s a serious (& perhaps desperate) attempt to remake the board as more of an “intentional” reflection of their main branding [Straight Dope, Chi Reader, Creative Loafing]? Let’s face it, the Straight Dope Message Board has historically been a community that grew like weeds in a fertile lot, theoretically inspired by and relevant to the Straight Dope column but in practice “about anything” and they let grow there what will. Yeah, that’s exactly how I like it, but I bet that under economic pressure several heads ended up thinking thoughts like “OK we have this board, how can we make this board tie in with a more focused ‘product line’ that we desperately need to sell? How can it help advertise and/or bolster the other stuff that we do?” ---
**Author:** ![ambushed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@ambushed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ambushed)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/5 "2009-03-21T04:45:38Z")
Well, so much for _that_ idea… Thanks to **Loach** , **Oakminster** , and **AHunter3** for not leaving me hanging in the wind all alone. ---
**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/6 "2009-03-21T06:31:49Z")
> [@ambushed](#): > > Well, so much for _that_ idea… If I’m reading the dates right, this thread is 3 weeks to a month old. Empires could have risen and fallen in that time. Why did you decide to bump it? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/7 "2009-03-21T12:38:40Z")
> [@ambushed](#): > > Well, so much for _that_ idea… > > Thanks to **Loach** , **Oakminster** , and **AHunter3** for not leaving me hanging in the wind all alone. And what have you learned about the level of outrage on this issue? ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/8 "2009-03-21T13:47:47Z")
In short, Ed took a gamble and it paid off. He made his changes, people huffed and puffed and kept coming anyway. I don’t like the guy one bit but he played it well and got his desired result. Good for him. You have the right to be outraged but don’t expect that to somehow turn into any kind of results. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/9 "2009-03-21T21:47:50Z")
> [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](#): > > If I’m reading the dates right, this thread is 3 weeks to a month old. Empires could have risen and fallen in that time. Why did you decide to bump it? That’s a great question. I have one for you: What would have been the perfect elapsed time for him to have bumped it? When was that Goldilocks-esque period where you would have looked at his bump and said “Oooh, perfect. I guess I have nothing to add”? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/10 "2009-03-21T23:56:32Z")
> [@ambushed](#): > > Well, so much for _that_ idea… > > Thanks to **Loach** , **Oakminster** , and **AHunter3** for not leaving me hanging in the wind all alone. I missed this thread, but if I hadn’t, I would definitely have agreed. It sucks, but again, I can’t see Ed giving in. He never listens to reason, or to anyone who tells him when it’s a bad idea. ---
**Author:** ![Sapo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ec9cab/32.png) [@Sapo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sapo)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2009, 11:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/11 "2009-03-22T11:13:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I missed this thread, but if I hadn’t, I would definitely have agreed. It sucks, but again, I can’t see Ed giving in. He never listens to reason, or to anyone who tells him when it’s a bad idea. Why was it a bad idea from his perspective? What wrong happened to him as a consequence of it? What did he lose? How did he not get what he wanted? ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2009, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/12 "2009-03-22T13:49:52Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > It sucks, but again, I can’t see Ed giving in. He never listens to reason, or to anyone who tells him when it’s a bad idea. [O RLY?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10941087&postcount=18) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2009, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/13 "2009-03-22T20:31:42Z")
Well, far far more people have pointed out the problem with the newer, “friendlier” Pit-but I have yet to see any sign that he actually gives a shit. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2009, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/14 "2009-03-24T19:47:37Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Well, far far more people have pointed out the problem with the newer, “friendlier” Pit-but I have yet to see any sign that he actually gives a shit. :shrug: The sky didn’t fall. ---
**Author:** ![akennett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ee59a6/32.png) [@akennett](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/akennett)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2009, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/15 "2009-03-24T19:58:35Z")
> [@Q.E.D](#): > > [O RLY?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10941087&postcount=18) I read that as nothing but a political move – give them back an inch of the mile we took away and we look like the reasonable ones. That’s about it. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2009, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/16 "2009-03-25T00:28:26Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > :shrug: > > The sky didn’t fall. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2009, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/17 "2009-03-25T02:18:52Z")
> [@bordelond](#): > > :shrug: > > The sky didn’t fall. Although there’s some eye-rolling going on, I have to say in honesty that the SDMB appears to me to be almost no different than it was at any other time in the last 6 months or so. There seems to be the same number of threads, same number of posters, same sorts of questions and answers in GQ, same topics argued in GD, same traffic in Cecil’s forum and in the Staff Reports forum, etc. The _only_ thing which seems to have changed is the Pit seems less active and less rancorous. I guess one can argue whether those observations are accurate or, if they are accurate, if that’s a bad thing. ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2009, 9:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/18 "2009-03-25T09:40:24Z")
> [@Una\_Persson](#): > > Although there’s some eye-rolling going on, I have to say in honesty that the SDMB appears to me to be almost no different than it was at any other time in the last 6 months or so. There seems to be the same number of threads, same number of posters, same sorts of questions and answers in GQ, same topics argued in GD, same traffic in Cecil’s forum and in the Staff Reports forum, etc. The _only_ thing which seems to have changed is the Pit seems less active and less rancorous. I guess one can argue whether those observations are accurate or, if they are accurate, if that’s a bad thing. I have to agree. I’m sure Ed was gambling on this. If so, he got his expected outcome. While there was considerable outrage over the restrictions placed on the Pit, I think that more pain was felt due to the way it was instigated and handled. But he knew that would blow over - as it has. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Arky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/87869e/32.png) [@An\_Arky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Arky)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2009, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/19 "2009-03-25T14:18:10Z")
Blow over, my gluteus maximus! There’s a lot of people who like to read and post here, but simply don’t give a damn about him or his bankrupt overlords. Eventually, this will bear out. ---
**Author:** ![NineToTheSky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5a626/32.png) [@NineToTheSky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NineToTheSky)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2009, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640/20 "2009-03-25T14:22:26Z")
> [@An\_Arky](#): > > Blow over, my gluteus maximus! There’s a lot of people who like to read and post here, but simply don’t give a damn about him or his bankrupt overlords. Eventually, this will bear out. How; in what way? (I’m asking out of ignorance, not because I disagree). Everything seems to be back to normal, with the most disgruntled happily on domebo and Giraffeboards. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reboot-the-pit-rule-decision-process-a-proposal/487640.md?page=2)