# Rebuilding the Society of Today in the Past **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [October 24, 2004, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871 "2004-10-24T07:20:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 4\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2004, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871/21 "2004-10-26T13:11:04Z")
> [@](#): > > If, along with the people, an entire metropolitan area’s (say NYC’s) worth of books, medical supplies, and food were transported along with them, how long would it take for the population to build their technological level back up to something resembling a First World country of the 20th and 21st centuries? I forgot, they do have books, medical supplies and food, but that’s all. ---
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2004, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871/22 "2004-10-26T14:26:12Z")
**Aesiron** , you may want to read [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=64275) of mine from a few years ago. My OP was essentially the same as yours. ---
**Author:** ![Scarface\_Z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/50afbb/32.png) [@Scarface\_Z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scarface_Z)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2004, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871/23 "2004-10-26T15:32:20Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#): > > Why do you assume that there are no small founderies? A major city has many suprises, my friend. > And if not steel, aluminium. You can build an aluminum smelter/casting facility at home, & run it with no experience. It’s actually quite simple. > > You say that there are no seeds, no equipment.But why? > Even if there is no farm equipment manufacturer in the City, there _will be_ a railyard. Everything caught in mid-shipment will be there. Tractors & seed corn included. > Are there no grain elevators? > No food processing factories? > In a “typical” City? > Heck yes, there will be! > And most cities have a Mayor, a City Council, and cops. > > Many people in the City will have moved there from the countryside, years before. > Some will have farming knowledge, & can act as trainers. why don’t you read the original posting? they are in the distant past, in a foreign land, that has not been touched by humans. they are not in some sort of post apocalyptic city ruins as you seem to be thinking about. where would they get steel? first you need iron, that needs to be mined. good luck fitting in a mining schedule into your hunting and gathering needs. all they have is food, medical, and books supplies. to make steel, you first need to mine iron ore, then you need to melt the iron (you need lumber to build a huge fire hot enough, so there), then you need to add carbon. oh, you also need a container to melt it in, meaning it has to be able to withstand extreme temperatures. i’m thinking either a metal with a higher melting point or something ceramic. not to mention that first you have to cast some blacksmith tools. (maybe you thought they could melt down those spare medical supplies?) all said, small foundries might be feasible, but they would have no metal to work with, at least not until they find the time to mine ore. also, to build a steel boat, weight has to be kept down to a minimum. i find it hard to believe they could create a sheet of steel thin enough for a small boat to stay afloat. they would need to build much larger boats to stay afloat, then you run into a short supply of iron, and you’re screwed. also, all of this talk of ship building and such are not immediate solutions. blacksmithing and mining and wood-working are trades that require years of practice and skill in order to be efficient. traditionally skills have been passed down through the generations, with sons learning directly from their fathers. this is different. you have a society of people trying to learn from books before they die. also, do you think that NYC’s supply of books would be enough? i imagine the wilderness survival guides and “how to” books would disappear pretty quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [October 26, 2004, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871/24 "2004-10-26T22:34:36Z")
> [@Fiver](#): > > **Aesiron** , you may want to read [this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=64275) of mine from a few years ago. My OP was essentially the same as yours. Thanks, **Fiver** … that’s pretty much what I was aiming for but in fewer words. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rebuilding-the-society-of-today-in-the-past/270871.md?page=1)