# Recommend some indie and foreign films for me, please **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 8, 2010, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428 "2010-10-08T00:14:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/41 "2010-10-08T18:49:23Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > While I really liked that movie (_Goodbye, Lenin!_), I wonder how much an American not familiar with Germany can get out of it. When the mother is lying in bed and hears the gong of the Tagesschau from her upstairs neighbour, you need to know the background about “Westfernsehen” (Watching west TV) during the DDR, and the reputation of the Tagesschau in the West, to understand the significance. I’ve read many comments from Americans dissing the movie as “a son lying to his mother, big deal” because they didn’t know anything about the background and so didn’t understand most of the clues. While I am relatively familiar with the Cold War dynamics and how Germany was basically used as a hockey puck between NATO and the Warsaw Pact, I didn’t know much culturally about East Germany, and I didn’t have any problem following the plot and influences by context. No doubt some of the nuances may be missed by non-German viewers, but the film is really less about the history of the reunification than the effect of splitting the country and culture along ideological lines, and the duality of deception (the son is deceiving his mother to keep her alive, while her own ultimate deception is revealed). Much of the humor comes from how rapidly the East Germans are assimilated into Western culture (Adverts for IKEA and Coca-Cola pop up almost immediately, and West Germans driving BMWs flooding into the East for cheap housing) and is understood as the universal appeal of material culture regardless of ideology. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/42 "2010-10-08T18:49:28Z")
Not horror movies, not big deep thoughts, but maybe quirky to see how a German director Reindl put to screen the vision of the US Wild West in the 19th century as dreamed by German author Karl May, filmed in … the rocky Yugoslavia! (Because communist countries were cheap), influenced by US westerns popular at that time. Made in the 60s, it starts with [Winnetou](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057687/) and continues. Lex Barker is his friend Old Shatterhand, and even Stewart Granger is one of them as Old Firehand. Pierre Brice got a Phyrric victory with his participance as Winnetou: he was a young French actor trying to become a second Belmondo. Instead, he became famous and iconic as noble Indian Winnetou in Germany, mobbed and beloved by fans, giving him steady work for years … while almost unknown in his native France, and unable to become a success at other roles. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/43 "2010-10-08T18:51:00Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > While I really liked that movie, I wonder how much an American not familiar with Germany can get out of it. When the mother is lying in bed and hears the gong of the Tagesschau from her upstairs neighbour, you need to know the background about “Westfernsehen” (Watching west TV) during the DDR, and the reputation of the Tagesschau in the West, to understand the significance. I’ve read many comments from Americans dissing the movie as “a son lying to his mother, big deal” because they didn’t know anything about the background and so didn’t understand most of the clues. Hmm, well I didn’t pick up on that either, but still loved the film. I think there’s enough obvious stuff in it that the subtle cultural references don’t seem to matter. I think it’s a great film regardless; maybe it would be even greater if I truly “got” it. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/44 "2010-10-08T18:52:16Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > While I am relatively familiar with the Cold War dynamics and how Germany was basically used as a hockey puck between NATO and the Warsaw Pact, I didn’t know much culturally about East Germany, and I didn’t have any problem following the plot and influences by context. No doubt some of the nuances may be missed by non-German viewers, but the film is really less about the history of the reunification than the effect of splitting the country and culture along ideological lines, and the duality of deception (the son is deceiving his mother to keep her alive, while her own ultimate deception is revealed). Much of the humor comes from how rapidly the East Germans are assimilated into Western culture (Adverts for IKEA and Coca-Cola pop up almost immediately, and West Germans driving BMWs flooding into the East for cheap housing) and is understood as the universal appeal of material culture regardless of ideology. > > Stranger Um, no actually. The bittersweet ending is a lament on how the materialism in real life conquered the rest, and how the DDR was not only the repressive Stasi country, but also a place of holidays for children and caring about each other. The criticism that the West is materialistic and cold and without ideals was and is true, and the wish to take the best of both cultures, instead of letting the West steamroller over the East because it “won” was voiced by many saner heads. ---
**Author:** ![Gilliver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/5fc32e/32.png) [@Gilliver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gilliver)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2010, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/45 "2010-10-08T19:10:05Z")
I haven’t seen this one mentioned, although I could have missed it. Once. [Once (2007) - IMDb](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0907657/) It is an Irish film, very low budget. I loved it and the music from the movie is great. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/46 "2010-10-09T04:42:31Z")
Continuing on in the alphabet from where I left off: Foreign: _The Road Warrior_ (1981, Australia, dir. George Miller) _Seven Beauties_ (1976, Italy, dir. Lina Wertmuller) _The Tree of Wooden Clogs_ (1978, Italy, dir. Ermanno Olmi) _The Year of Living Dangerously_ (1983, Australia, dir. Peter Weir) American independent: _Salvador_ (1986, U.S., dir. Oliver Stone) _Slacker_ (1991, U.S., dir. Richard Linklater) _They Live_ (1988, U.S., dir. John Carpenter) Again, I’m really not sure what was independently produced. I think all I’m doing is picking ones that were relatively low-budget and relatively unknown. ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/47 "2010-10-09T04:54:00Z")
[Jesus of Montréal](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097635/) [The Decline of the American Empire](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090985/) [Le Confessional](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112714/) [Atanarjuat](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0285441/) [Tampopo](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0092048/) [Russian Ark](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0318034/) ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/48 "2010-10-09T07:33:52Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > > [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > > > **France** > > > > _Les Pacte Des Loupes (The Brotherhood Of The Wolf)_ > > This got an awful lot of hype when it came out, but I was very underwhelmed when I saw it a bit later on TV. Correction: I was very disappointed. Not only did it have handsome Marc Dacasos, they had stressed it was not a Hollywood production, but a lot of money put to good use. Instead, it had a stupid script and money wasted on special effects. We can have that from Hollywood any day of the year, no difference. I still think it’s a good, enjoyable movie. Not everything with subtitles has to be pretentious arty wank. > [@](#): > > Well, if you know the Asterix comics, I guess. I have no idea how it looks to an outsider not familiar with them. There are people not familiar with Asterix comics out there? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/49 "2010-10-09T12:59:09Z")
Some excellent choices here, I’ll also add (as the the episodes are feature length and originally had a cinema release) the swedish detective series “Wallander” subtitled and wonderfully atmospheric. If you aren’t driving a volvo and listening to Abba by the end of it I’ll eat my herring. ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/50 "2010-10-09T14:11:49Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > There are people not familiar with Asterix comics out there? 😕 In the US? Tons of people, I imagine. The French movies might not even have been released here. I can’t find the DVDs available on Netflix. ---
**Author:** ![DCnDC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dcndc/32/2842_2.png) [@DCnDC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DCnDC)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/51 "2010-10-09T14:45:45Z")
[Moon](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1182345/) was pretty good. [Nochnoi Dozor](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0403358/) (Night Watch) is an excellent Russian fantasy flick. Kind of like a Russian “Underworld” except it doesn’t suck. The plot can be a bit difficult to follow on the first viewing, but it’s worthy of multiple viewings anyway. The sequel, [Day Watch](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0409904/) isn’t quite as good but still a good watch. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/52 "2010-10-09T16:24:09Z")
I’ve just gone through a list of great films (based on popular and critical acclaim) that I’ve compiled for my own use. I eliminated any that I mentioned in previous posts on this thread. I eliminated any that were before 1960. These are the foreign ones that were left: _The Battle of Algiers_ (1965, France, dir. Gillo Pontecorvo) _Breathless_ (1960, France, dir. Jean-Luc Godard) _Cinema Paradiso_ (1989, Italy/France, dir. Giuseppe Tornatore) _The Conformist_ (1969, Italy, dir. Bernardo Bertolucci) _Contempt_ (1963, France/Italy, dir. Jean-Luc Godard) _Das Boot_ (1981, West Germany, dir. Wolfgang Petersen) _Fanny and Alexander_ (1983, Sweden, dir. Ingmar Bergman) _8 ½_ (1963, Italy/France, dir. Federico Fellini) _A Hard Day’s Night_ (1964, U.K., dir. Richard Lester) _La Dolce Vita_ (1960, Italy, dir. Federico Fellini) _L’Avventura_ (1960, Italy/France, dir. Michelangelo Antonioni) _Lawrence of Arabia_ (1962, U.K., dir. David Lean) _Once upon a Time in the West_ (1968, U.S./Italy, dir. Sergio Leone) _Persona_ (1966, Sweden, dir. Ingmar Bergman) _The Piano_ (1993, Australia/France, dir. Jane Campion) _Princess Mononoke_ (1997, Japan, dir. Hiyao Miyazaki) _Ran_ (1985, Japan/France, dir. Akira Kurosawa) _Yojimbo_ (1961, Japan, dir. Akira Kurosawa) I eliminated a few of the ones on my list because although they’re usually listed as foreign films, they’re so well known in the U.S. that I can’t believe you wouldn’t know them. I couldn’t find any American independent films on my list unless I’m fairly sloppy about what an independent film is. _Easy Rider_ or even (to really stretch it) _The Terminator_ might have been considered an independent film at the time, since they were relatively low-budget, but they had major Hollywood figures associated with them. ---
**Author:** ![Stauderhorse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Stauderhorse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stauderhorse)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2010, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/53 "2010-10-09T22:55:37Z")
Thanks for all the titles, _Wendell Wagner_. And thanks to everyone else who gave me suggestions; these should keep me occupied for a while. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/54 "2010-10-10T16:22:51Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > > [@constanze](#): > > > > This got an awful lot of hype when it came out, but I was very underwhelmed when I saw it a bit later on TV. Correction: I was very disappointed. Not only did it have handsome Marc Dacasos, they had stressed it was not a Hollywood production, but a lot of money put to good use. Instead, it had a stupid script and money wasted on special effects. We can have that from Hollywood any day of the year, no difference. > > I still think it’s a good, enjoyable movie. Not everything with subtitles has to be pretentious arty wank. ??? I think you took too big a leap over the middle here. I don’t even like pretentious art wank movies; but I don’t like Michael Bay Action movies. And I hate idiot movies (term according to Roger Ebert: where every character acts like an idiot to move the plot forward; not that everybody who watches them is an idiot!). I hate movies where 2.49 $ were spent on the script (or 5 screen writers used), and 1 mill. on the special effects or the actors. In case of “Brotherhood of the Wolf”, I don’t want to reveal the whole plot here, but basically, the script is a terrible mess. There are no reasonable motivations for characters except for reveals, some of the fight scenes at the end are ludicrously implausible the chain-like sword- really?, Mark Dacascos had to play an Indian to give a half-way plausible reason to have an Asian-looking guy in France, but they messed up all his behaviour and introduced the “Black guy dies first” syndrome… It not only fell far flat of what the hype promised, it also fell far flat of a decent normal action movie. In this case, with good actors and good special effects, the pain shows even more than a cheap B-movie. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2010, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/55 "2010-10-10T16:57:35Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > Have you seen already the Oscar-winning movie “[Das Leben der Anderen](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0405094/)” (Lives of others)? > > With the same caveat as before - you need to know some background about the DDR - and it’s a bit depressing (I haven’t watched it myself), but Ulrich Mühe (who died shortly after from stomach ulcers; he was a very sensitive guy) got heaps of praise for his portrayal of a Stasi (secret police) man listening to an artist couple and reflecting on his own life. (Ulrich Mühe lived in the DDR for some time before moving to the West). I think you give too little credit to Americans – or at least to the sort of Americans who tend to see foreign movies. I saw both this and _Goodbye Lenin_ with my wife. We understood and enjoyed both of them. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2010, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/56 "2010-10-11T00:17:47Z")
I have to recommend a movie I just watched (DVR’d off the HDNET Movies channel): _ **Shall We Dansu?** _ (or _Shall We Dance?_) - the original Japanese movie. This is a very charming movie, with terrific, subtle performances from some of the actors (especially the leading man), and some not-so-subtle but very funny performances from some of the other actors. I saw the American remake a few years ago (with Richard Gere and Jennifer Lopez) and thought it was enjoyable. I didn’t know at the time that it was a remake. Having now seen the original, the American version (which actually follows the original very closely) pales in comparison. It’s about a man who is bored in his life and finds diversion in taking ballroom dance lessons. He keeps it a secret from his family, though, for various reasons. It is a joy to watch his gradual transformation throughout the story, as he steers himself out of the rut he’s been living in. Pretty inspirational. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2010, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/57 "2010-10-11T01:26:34Z")
> [@constanze](#): > > > [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > > > I still think it’s a good, enjoyable movie. Not everything with subtitles has to be pretentious arty wank. > > ??? I think you took too big a leap over the middle here. I don’t even like pretentious art wank movies; but I don’t like Michael Bay Action movies. And I hate idiot movies (term according to Roger Ebert: where every character acts like an idiot to move the plot forward; not that everybody who watches them is an idiot!). > I hate movies where 2.49 $ were spent on the script (or 5 screen writers used), and 1 mill. on the special effects or the actors. > > In case of “Brotherhood of the Wolf”, I don’t want to reveal the whole plot here, but basically, the script is a terrible mess. There are no reasonable motivations for characters except for reveals, some of the fight scenes at the end are ludicrously implausible the chain-like sword- really?, Mark Dacascos had to play an Indian to give a half-way plausible reason to have an Asian-looking guy in France, but they messed up all his behaviour and introduced the “Black guy dies first” syndrome… It not only fell far flat of what the hype promised, it also fell far flat of a decent normal action movie. In this case, with good actors and good special effects, the pain shows even more than a cheap B-movie. I’lll have to disagree with you since I really like the film, find it very enjoyable, and have used it on several occasions to introduce “I-don’t-watch-movies-with-subtitles” friends to foreign movies. They’ve all thoroughly enjoyed it too. ---
**Author:** ![maladroit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f475e1/32.png) [@maladroit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/maladroit)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/58 "2010-10-11T19:51:46Z")
Spanish director Pedro [Almodovar](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000264/), German director Wim [Wenders](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000694/), Swedish actor Michael [Nyquist](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000694/). I haven’t seen everything from their filmographies, but everything I’ve seen is top-notch. ---
**Author:** ![B.Serum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/b.serum/32/14266_2.png) [@B.Serum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/B.Serum)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2010, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/59 "2010-10-11T20:28:34Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > [City of God](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0317248/) > > [The City of Lost Children](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0112682/) > > [Run Lola Run](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0130827/) > > [Amelie](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0211915/) > > All of these are great but different. It was the best I could do without some more information on what you really like. What he said. ---
**Author:** ![constanze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f9ae1b/32.png) [@constanze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/constanze)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2010, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428/60 "2010-10-13T15:58:15Z")
Do movies that were big hits in their respective countries count? [Der Schuh des Manitou](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0248408/) (Manitou’s shoe) - a parody of the Reinl-Winnetou-Western (so it helps if you have watches at least one of those before) [(T)raumschiff Surprise Periode 1](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0349047/) (space ship surprise, period 1)- a parody of Star Wars and Star Trek were both big hits. The team of Bully Herbig was on a long-running comedy show before. [Der bewegte Mann](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0109255/)(Man being moved) is an elder comedy with Till Schweiger as a Casanova-type of guy who gets kicked out by his girl-friend and the only place to stay he can find is a group with gays. [Kondom des Grauens](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0116791/) (condom of horror) is based on a gay comic about a condom with teeth that bites penisses off, with a gay inspector investigating! But as comedy, not horror. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/recommend-some-indie-and-foreign-films-for-me-please/556428.md?page=4)