# Red Rover, Red Rover, send Rand Rover over **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 25, 2009, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739 "2009-03-25T15:22:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/321 "2009-03-27T03:51:48Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Who knows or cares whether Rover is compassionless? He is not who he presents himself to be here. That facade is too important to him. If he were who he says that he is, that wouldn’t be important. Respect wouldn’t be important. He’s insecure, immature, and desperate. Even if he had been an attorney, he would have been _so_ in violation of Ethics Codes just from what he has written here, that he would be out on his patootie. > > Would you really want this man for an attorney? Neither would anyone else. Do you think his attitude doesn’t show in his day-to-day dealings with the people he associates with? Of course it does. He’s either the silent angry type or the obnoxious angry type. Either way, he’s not the guy you want to share a cubicle with at the insurance company. > > But he is the guy you can point to when you get banned and say, “How come I got banned for being a jerk and he didn’t?” I’ve been wondering where you were. Welcome to the party, knock yourself out. I’m going to bed. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/322 "2009-03-27T03:53:24Z")
> [@Carol\_Stream](#): > > I have, and your point is what? I suppose that if you do not get it from that, then nothing I can say now will make it any more clear to you. On second thought, if you’re back on your shtick about how most Pit threads belong in MPSIMS, then my post was irrelevant, and never mind. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_Stream](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@Carol\_Stream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_Stream)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/323 "2009-03-27T03:55:21Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > I suppose that if you do not get it from that, then nothing I can say now will make it any more clear to you. > > On second thought, if you’re back on your shtick about how most Pit threads belong in MPSIMS, then my post was irrelevant, and never mind. No, post it reaaally slowly, using small words. Promise I’ll try to understand you. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/324 "2009-03-27T03:55:48Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Sure there are differences, but for the purpose I’m concerned about they are all the same–they are ways that a lessee becomes dispossessed of the property. You’re a lawyer? ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/325 "2009-03-27T03:56:50Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > You’re a lawyer? Your point? ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/326 "2009-03-27T03:58:33Z")
> [@Carol\_Stream](#): > > No, post it reaaally slowly, using small words. Promise I’ll try to understand you. Piss off, **Carol** , I’ve not been that way with you. Unless you’re a sock of somebody I _have_ been that way with. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/327 "2009-03-27T04:00:49Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > Your point? You’re either not a lawyer, or you’re an incompetent one. Differences are what keep lawyers able to send their kids to Harvard and Yale. ---
**Author:** ![Rand\_Rover](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/db5fbb/32.png) [@Rand\_Rover](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rand_Rover)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/328 "2009-03-27T04:02:52Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > You’re either not a lawyer, or you’re an incompetent one. Differences are what keep lawyers able to send their kids to Harvard and Yale. It’s not the case that I don’t understand the differences or can’t spot them, I just contend that for present purposes the differences don’t matter. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_Stream](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@Carol\_Stream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_Stream)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/329 "2009-03-27T04:03:00Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Piss off, **Carol** , I’ve not been that way with you. Unless you’re a sock of somebody I _have_ been that way with. **Frank** , I honestly didn’t understand your post #322. Can you clarify what you mean? I wasn’t trying to “be that way” with you. 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/330 "2009-03-27T04:06:18Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Well, that is sort of my point. Not to hijack **RR** ’s Pitting, but there are any number of the Usual Suspects who would frantically, not to say fanatically, disagree that I was not a troll. The accusation is SOP for anyone with a minority opinion who gives as good as s/he gets. For what it’s worth, **Shodan** , I disagree with almost every political position you hold, you phrase your posts in GD to slime liberals whenever you can, and you engage in _tu quoque_ing far, far too much, but I don’t think you’re a troll. I doubt **Rand Rover** is a troll either, though he might be. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/331 "2009-03-27T04:06:57Z")
> [@Carol\_Stream](#): > > **Frank** , I honestly didn’t understand your post #322. Can you clarify what you mean? > > I wasn’t trying to “be that way” with you. 😕 Never mind, forget it, I’m tired and wired tonight and I apologize for snapping at you. ---
**Author:** ![Carol\_Stream](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c2a13f/32.png) [@Carol\_Stream](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carol_Stream)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/332 "2009-03-27T04:09:01Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > Never mind, forget it, I’m tired and wired tonight and I apologize for snapping at you. Accepted. No harm, no foul. Good night. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/333 "2009-03-27T05:38:25Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Who knows or cares whether Rover is compassionless? He is not who he presents himself to be here. That facade is too important to him. If he were who he says that he is, that wouldn’t be important. Respect wouldn’t be important. He’s insecure, immature, and desperate. Even if he had been an attorney, he would have been _so_ in violation of Ethics Codes just from what he has written here, that he would be out on his patootie. > > Would you really want this man for an attorney? Neither would anyone else. Do you think his attitude doesn’t show in his day-to-day dealings with the people he associates with? Of course it does. He’s either the silent angry type or the obnoxious angry type. Either way, he’s not the guy you want to share a cubicle with at the insurance company. > > But he is the guy you can point to when you get banned and say, “How come I got banned for being a jerk and he didn’t?” I haven’t seen anything from RR that I would call unethical per the ABA rules. I am utterly unfamiliar with the NY rules, but I will tell you that the NY lawyers I have dealt with were complete and obnoxious far beyond anything RR has done here at the SDMB. FWIW he seems educated and intelligent in my opinion. But that does not stop him from generally making a fool of himself on a regular basis. But reducing foolishness requires broad experience and compassion. Is it really a surprise? He is trying to espouse what he thinks is a philosophy that will better humankind. Good for him. ---
**Author:** ![groo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecd19e/32.png) [@groo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/groo)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/334 "2009-03-27T05:48:40Z")
> [@Giraffe](#): > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10970200&postcount=16](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10970200&postcount=16) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10638904&postcount=15](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10638904&postcount=15) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10928575&postcount=5](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10928575&postcount=5) > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10893410&postcount=3](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10893410&postcount=3) There’s fear in there. See, if he can convince himself that bad things only happen to bad/stupid/lazy people, that there’s never any element of chance, then he doesn’t need to be afraid of The Dark Things that he can’t control. Anything that’s good in his life must have been because of his hard work and intelligence; anything bad that happened was because he hadn’t become perfect yet. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/335 "2009-03-27T08:11:29Z")
> [@groo](#): > > There’s fear in there. See, if he can convince himself that bad things only happen to bad/stupid/lazy people, that there’s never any element of chance, then he doesn’t need to be afraid of The Dark Things that he can’t control. Anything that’s good in his life must have been because of his hard work and intelligence; anything bad that happened was because he hadn’t become perfect yet. If that is the case, then boy is he in for a rude surprise at the end. We are all truly equal in the end. ---
**Author:** ![eleanorigby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@eleanorigby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eleanorigby)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/336 "2009-03-27T12:14:56Z")
> [@Rand\_Rover](#): > > This is ridiculous. Let’s say a survey is done. A situation is presented to 1000 people, and they are asked whether the situation should elicit empathy or sympathy. 51% of them say yes. Are you telling me that the other 49% necessarily have something wrong with their brains? > > What if 75% say yes? Do the other 25% necessarily have something wrong with their brains? > > What if 99% say yes? No, but I am not going to bother anymore. You have expressed that you have no sympathy or compassion for the woman in the article re her home loss, but you would have sympathy for some others whose situations in principle do not differ from hers. To most people, that makes you a dick; I contend that you probably are a dick, but that something might be wrong with your brain. You deny any mental illness; I correct you that I didn’t not claim that for you. You contend that being without compassion is the same as not liking chocolate. It is not. I tried to demonstrate to you that conventional human behavior supports expressing compassion(we’ll start slow and not have you actually feel it for a while), but you are one of the stalwart and courageous, following Ms Rand’s teaching that being a dick is much better than being a person. I pointed out (again) that there may well be something wrong with your brain\*. You disagree. We have reached an impasse. Since I don’t make a habit of talking to walls, not even ones made out of Rearden Metal, I am moving on. \*IANAD, I am not diagnosing etc. How else to explain your lack of basic humanity over time? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/337 "2009-03-27T12:26:22Z")
This is tangentially related to this thread, but I wish the _other_ Rand thread was still active. Steve Benen at the Washington Monthly passes the following along as his quote of the day: > **[Ephemera 2009 (7)](http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2009/03/ephemera-2009-7.html)** > > \-- Better Off Ted handily fills my entertainment requirements for 22 minutes. Good geek comedy. -- (Sawyer thinks) \>\> (Jack reacts). Some... > [@](#): > > There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. ---
**Author:** ![Caffeine.addict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f475e1/32.png) [@Caffeine.addict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caffeine.addict)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/338 "2009-03-27T12:43:07Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > Even if he had been an attorney, he would have been _so_ in violation of Ethics Codes just from what he has written here, that he would be out on his patootie. > > Would you really want this man for an attorney? Neither would anyone else. Do you think his attitude doesn’t show in his day-to-day dealings with the people he associates with? Of course it does. He’s either the silent angry type or the obnoxious angry type. Either way, he’s not the guy you want to share a cubicle with at the insurance company. ??😕 I admit that I haven’t followed this thread all that closely, but I’ve seen Rand Rover in quite a few other threads, and I haven’t seen him do or say anything that would touch on his fitness to practice law. He seems to have a personal philosophy that most people fight repugnant and which I don’t agree with, but then again, who cares. One of the roles that an attorney takes is that of counselor. He or she is there to advise the client as to the most prudent course of action. While hand holding is nice, it shouldn’t get in the way of telling the client what their options are and what the best course of action is. My personal view is that at times, you want an attorney who won’t sugarcoat things to the point where they are meaningless. You want someone who will say, your case is crap, and here is why, so you don’t waste time and money litigating a dog. Often times, you need to be blunt with someone so that it really sinks in. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 12:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/339 "2009-03-27T12:52:29Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > This is tangentially related to this thread, but I wish the _other_ Rand thread was still active. Steve Benen at the Washington Monthly passes the following along as his quote of the day: > > [Kung Fu Monkey: Ephemera 2009 (7)](http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2009/03/ephemera-2009-7.html) Psst. [Post 136.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10973201&postcount=136) ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2009, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739/340 "2009-03-27T13:36:09Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Psst. [Post 136.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10973201&postcount=136) Oh, poop. Sorry. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/red-rover-red-rover-send-rand-rover-over/490739.md?page=18)