# Redfury and Der Trilhs: Cunts **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 4, 2006, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184 "2006-10-04T00:53:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2006, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/81 "2006-10-05T21:50:57Z")
Re the first quoted segment. The poster was deliberately talking about those who have taken up arms against US forces and those who are engaged in sectarian violence targeting civilians. It is relating to a specific situation where insurgents were cornered. If these particular insurgents had been engaged in sectarian violence(targeting mosques, weddings of people from different tribes/sects/etc.) then they were either murderers or attempted murderers. If they had simply struck out against US forces they were combatants. In either case I do not think it is appropriate to call them “innocents” because they were actively engaged in acts of warfare during the time period and situation the comment applied to. Are they justified in taking up arms against the US? I believe so, this was an invastion of their country after all. Does this let them keep their “innocent” status even when engaged in a firefight with US troops? Not in my estimation. Also note that “[not] spend[ing] a lot of time worrying about” is not the same as “cheering/wishing/hoping for the deaths of”. The second quote is also directed towards eliminating the insurgents, although it does show a careless disregard for innocents who would obviously be collateral damage. The poster was called on this statment within a single post and the thread had run out of steam so it was probably under a mod, and the community at large’s, radar. The poster in question was also a known asshole who was famous for prioritizing military lives over civilian lives(as is somewhat undestandable because he was military himself). It is important to note, however, that there is nothing like “and we’d get all those other Arabs at the same time” in that quote or the full post. Nothing about cheering the deaths of those who would be collateral casualties, in fact no mention of them at all(which is chilling enough on it’s own, and earned immediate rebuttal from a member of the community). I’m not seeing how either of these shows “cheering on the butchering of thousands of innocents”. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2006, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/82 "2006-10-05T22:05:18Z")
[QUOTE=jjimm] What I want to know is, are they _terrible_ cunts? [/QUOTE] Shut it Monty. Besides, everyone knows the worlds finest use of the word cunt in the pursuit of comedy belongs to Derek & Clive. I’ll tell you, the other day some bloke came up to me and… ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2006, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/83 "2006-10-05T22:44:01Z")
I didn’t say anything! ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2006, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/84 "2006-10-05T23:52:21Z")
[QUOTE=Dob] I just dont get how support of troops in Iraq = cheering the death of iraqis’. So lets say I supported the US’s role in WWII, did that mean that I cheered the death of the japanese, or german civilians? Or because WWII was a “just” war, those innocent cilivians deserved to be killed? Or if not deserved, could be glossed over? [/quote] I think GWB is an idiot, and I hate that our troops are over there and I will vote for every politician i see who will get us out. But until that great day, I will support the troops and their efforts. Im with ya Ryan… fuck em both. [/QUOTE] You go on to state that you “support the troops” and follow that inmediatedly by denigrating the reasons they are there and the imbecil who sent them there. Does not compute. Because the only way you can possibly support them at present time is by hoping they do the killing as opposed to being killed. Or can you think of another way? My position, in case it wasn’t clear enough from the start, is not that I “hate” the US or its soldiers, nor can I bring myself to wish death upon them _as a group_, but rather that they _shouldn’t be there at all_. Given that fact, how on earth should I be expected to “support” them? Bring them home and they’ll – again – have my full support. ## Iraq for the Iraqis to do as they wish. Period. Steve, Being a “know asshole” is no excuse for wishing foro wholesale slaughter. That he – as the poster prior to him – were rebuffed does not in any way negate what I originally said, Namely that there are a number of people here with a complete and total disregard for foreign lives. Working the hamster a [bit more](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6998109&postcount=35): > [@](#): > > In the process we killed something like nineteen militans (so it wasn’t like this attack was a complete failure, no one seems to be addressing that.)\* > > \ > > And of course, obviously, U.S. decisionmakers always weigh American lives as more important than foreign lives, and rightfully so. \*[The drone, the CIA and a botched attempt to kill bin Laden’s deputy](http://observer.guardian.co.uk/world/story/0,16937,1686918,00.html) No proof of any such “militants” killed" Here’s a posters response to the OP’s suggestion of [nuking a city in Iraq](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7762517&postcount=1): > [@](#): > > I can’t help thinking of Vietnam here - there was a story of how the VC used to deceive the US into shelling villages. > > However, the region does have a history of exterminating - and that’s what it would be - one city to ensure compliance by others. > > For a nuclear strike to have any hope of working, it would have to be a complete surprise, otherwise the insurgents would simply disappear. The West and Japan would be horrified; the rest of the world would affect horror. If the US were to tough it out - “We will achieve our aims by any means at our disposal” or similar - [I think the US would take a popularity hit for 6 months or so but it would be seen with a new respect](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=7768457&postcount=34). > > Longer term it will signal the end of the concept of the civilian. I’m not sure that term is relevant in asymmetric warfare right now, but that’s for a different thread. Nice. Here’s a moderate response to an [interesting thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6434515&postcount=1) on this very topic: > [@](#): > > [Which puts me into a particular quandary](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6434741&postcount=30). It is bad form to wish that a fellow Doper have his teeth knocked down his throat with a rifle butt. So I can’t wish that. But terrorists - and their sympathizers - deserve to have their teeth knocked down their throats with a rifle butt. But I can’t wish for that, even though you are rooting for the death of my fellow citizens, and my nephew and his buddies. more… > [@](#): > > [Zebra,](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6434859&postcount=45) hard core liberal democrate, who wants the insurgents shot in the head. Or how about some [jingoistic sloganeering](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6434987&postcount=55)? > [@](#): > > Mr. Dibble, the people of the United States of America have been saving lives and liberating people for nearly 100 years now. That noble tradition continues today in Afghanistan and Iraq. Every day, americans are risking their lives to rebuild the infrastructure of those countries and to move them into the 21st century. When we are finished, they will stand as examples for other countries in the region to follow. One more? [Why not](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6435164&postcount=68). > [@](#): > > I doubt it. Remember 9/11/01? Aggressive act of a global bully, my aching ass. Far, far better for us to be over there killing them than for them to be over here killing us. Feel the hatred? Because I surely do. Mind you, we’re talking about a rather tiny minority of posters on the SDMB. Overall, I find this board one of the most open-minded and fair of all the ones I’ve participated – thus the reason I remain here…much to the chagrin of pseudo-intellectual poseurs such as **Excaliber**. Take care. ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2006, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/85 "2006-10-06T16:18:41Z")
[QUOTE=RedFury] Being a “know asshole” is no excuse for wishing foro wholesale slaughter. That he – as the poster prior to him – were rebuffed does not in any way negate what I originally said, Namely that there are a number of people here with a complete and total disregard for foreign lives. … Feel the hatred? Because I surely do. Mind you, we’re talking about a rather tiny minority of posters on the SDMB. Overall, I find this board one of the most open-minded and fair of all the ones I’ve participated – thus the reason I remain here…much to the chagrin of pseudo-intellectual poseurs such as **Excaliber**. [/QUOTE] Disregard for foreign lives I’ve seen plenty of here, and it makes me sad most times, sometimes it makes me mad. But there is a distinction between disregard for foreign lives and “cheering on the butchering of thousands of innocents”. One demonstrates apathy, the other sociopathy. I won’t challenge claims that many on this board demonstrate a lack of concern for the lives of non-US citizens. What I do challenge is that there is a significant amount of celebration over said deaths(excepting when people like Zarqwari and Hussein’s sons are killed, even those are often tempered in many ways). It’s the difference between not being affected by the news of said deaths and exhulting in them. It’s a big difference. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2006, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/86 "2006-10-06T16:36:09Z")
[QUOTE=Mtgman] Disregard for foreign lives I’ve seen plenty of here, and it makes me sad most times, sometimes it makes me mad. But there is a distinction between disregard for foreign lives and “cheering on the butchering of thousands of innocents”. One demonstrates apathy, the other sociopathy. I won’t challenge claims that many on this board demonstrate a lack of concern for the lives of non-US citizens. What I do challenge is that there is a significant amount of celebration over said deaths(excepting when people like Zarqwari and Hussein’s sons are killed, even those are often tempered in many ways). It’s the difference between not being affected by the news of said deaths and exhulting in them. It’s a big difference. Enjoy, Steven [/QUOTE] Fair enough not to quibble with. Thus, taking your cue, I’ll amend my statement to: “disregard/neglect for non-American lives.” ---
**Author:** ![Mtgman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5a626/32.png) [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2006, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/87 "2006-10-06T17:27:55Z")
Works for me, and I’ll try to do my part to make the community less tolerant of said disregard for lives of non-Americans. I can’t make it a bannable offense, but I can call people on it when I see it. Enjoy, Steven ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2006, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184/88 "2006-10-06T20:58:52Z")
[QUOTE=Mtgman] Works for me, and I’ll try to do my part to make the community less tolerant of said disregard for lives of non-Americans. I can’t make it a bannable offense, but I can call people on it when I see it [/QUOTE] Thank you. You’re a good man. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/redfury-and-der-trilhs-cunts/375184.md?page=4)