# Reform the Prime Directive **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 10, 2011, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845 "2011-04-10T05:38:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/21 "2011-04-10T13:04:57Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I also think that having warp tech is a lousy prerequisite for contact, because it assumes all cultures develop the same way. Say you have an ancient, peaceful, fantastically civilized race of artists, poets and philosophers who never advanced beyond Iron Age technology and never really wanted to. Would you deny them the universe just because they aren’t very good engineers? Well right or wrong I don’t think that is a side effect, that is the direct purpose of the Prime Directive/Branagan’s Law. Kind of a noble savages thing that they have achieved their own paradise, and it would be wrong to contaminate it with our notions of progress. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/22 "2011-04-10T13:07:44Z")
> [@wolfman](#): > > Well right or wrong I don’t think that is a side effect, that is the direct purpose of the Prime Directive/Branagan’s Law. Kind of a noble savages thing that they have achieved their own paradise, and it would be wrong to contaminate it with our notions of progress. Shouldn’t that be their choice? ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/23 "2011-04-10T13:20:41Z")
Just add what is already part of it: Star Fleet shall absolutely never interfere in the development of another society, _unless it would be inconvenient not to do so._ ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/24 "2011-04-10T13:23:44Z")
Here’s another question: won’t avoiding contact with other races interfere with the development of \*galactic \*society? ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/25 "2011-04-10T13:42:37Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > I think in general the prime directive is a good idea as is. Non interference with pre-warp civilizations, and non interference with the internal political matters of post warp civilizations. It’s been a while since I’ve seen the two part episode in question. However, from what I can remember if the wrong faction won then the Klingons would have been allied with the Romulans which would have likely led to both parties going to war against the Federation. So non-interference could lead to a whole lot of needless deaths. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/26 "2011-04-10T13:52:08Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Here’s another question: won’t avoiding contact with other races interfere with the development of \*galactic \*society? No. The right to societal development is obviously held to be a negative right - external parties may only be called upon to play a role in your development with their consent, they do not have a moral obligation to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/27 "2011-04-10T14:06:22Z")
I agree - I was just pointing out the absurdity of the concept of “natural development”. After all, if a planet must be kept “pure”, why not a continent, or an island? And conversely, if a “primitive” culture can build boats and contact other cultures on its own planet, why can’t the Federation build spaceships and contact other cultures in its own galaxy? What’s the difference, other than that of scale? ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/28 "2011-04-10T14:15:23Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I also think that having warp tech is a lousy prerequisite for contact, because it assumes all cultures develop the same way. Say you have an ancient, peaceful, fantastically civilized race of artists, poets and philosophers who never advanced beyond Iron Age technology and never really wanted to. Would you deny them the universe just because they aren’t very good engineers? It would certainly explain the lack of non-humanoid cultures in the STU. No going out contacting the Ancient Cephalopod Philosophers who lack the tools and physical ability to make star ships! ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/29 "2011-04-10T14:23:41Z")
And by not contacting them, the Federation denies itself thousands of years of squid music, poetry, art and philosophy. Stupid, stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Shawn1767](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Shawn1767](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shawn1767)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/30 "2011-04-10T16:28:58Z")
My point is that we have to look at the evolution of the universe as a whole. Let’s look at Earth’s history as an example. For more than 4 billion years, it has been allowed to evolve. Some species have died out, some have thrived. It’s neither good nor evil that some died and some lived. It just “is.” I think we need to take some of that into account when dealing on a universal scale. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/31 "2011-04-10T21:35:55Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > Lets say you have been made the Almighty master of the Star Trek universe. Top of your agenda, reform. > > How would you go about it? My own suggestion would be to add a proviso to the whole shall not interfere business and state that the directive may be broken if in is the best interests of the other culture to do so (you know save a dying world) or is in the interests of the ships crew (thus saving us from the travesty that is Voyager). > > Presume the era is circa the end of the Next Generation Series Forgive me for saying so, but both your exceptions are bullshit. Saying the captain may violate the Prime Directive if it’s in the best interest of the other culture is pretty much saying there is no PM. It’s setting Starfleet up as gods. That said, I’d make it clear that the PM doesn’t apply in natural disasters, and that there is No Such Thing As Fate, and any officer, particularly a hirsute Alaskan, who suggetst that they Enterprise allow an entire sapient species perish when it is not only within the ship’s power to save them, but also at a time when the ship is already fucking there, should be either relieved of duty due to being psychologically ill, or beaten to death with the nearest blunt object. As for the benefit of the crew exception: it would be iffier. Janeway violated the PM in the first episode, after all; her error was not using a remote detonator, but I can fanwank that. She’s so inconsistent otherwise that I don’t think you can use anything she does or says as an argument for anything other than antidepressants. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/32 "2011-04-10T21:40:04Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > Didn’t Picard invoke the Prime Directive as justification for Star Fleet not interfering in the Klingon Civil War? If so, change it back to non-interference with pre-warp civilizations at least. Picard was entirely right not to want to get involved in that war, ESPECIALLY on his own authority, unless there were proof of somebody else pulling the strings. It was far too likely to bite them in the ass. That said, I don’t think that was a Prime Directive thing exactly, as the PM is about not tryin gto mold other cultures in the Federation’s image. It was a _Don’t go around starting shit you can’t finish_. Clearly Starfleet Academy history lessons included lessons on Korea & Vietnam. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/33 "2011-04-10T22:34:32Z")
I’d trash the damn thing. In fact, I’d have[a group in my civilization](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Culture#Foreign_policy) whose damn \*job \*was interferring in other civilizations. And we’d be proud of it, too. ---
**Author:** ![robertliguori](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/46a35a/32.png) [@robertliguori](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robertliguori)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/34 "2011-04-11T00:07:18Z")
In my Trek continuity, there is a series detailing the adventures of a Galaxy-class starship whose captain was confronted with one of those natural disaster situations, and decided to fuck the Prime Directive hard, staged an internal mutiny/ purge of everyone who valued the dogma of the Federation over its ideals, and then dropped off the grid and started providing warp technology to every planet they could, and quietly doing what they could to uplift those planets not quite able to handle producing Warp tech on their own yet. The results of this were a lot of naked hypocrisy and “But that doesn’t count!” from Starfleet Command, with every other ship in the sector responding as they saw fit (which was mostly condemning and still hunting the original ship, but dealing fairly with the suddenly-uplifted civilizations they encountered). ---
**Author:** ![Max\_the\_Immortal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Max\_the\_Immortal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_the_Immortal)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/35 "2011-04-11T00:20:55Z")
Trash the whole thing, if only because it makes the setting less interesting. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/36 "2011-04-11T00:49:03Z")
Screw the Prime Directive. It is patronizing, condescending, and just as racist as imperialism. Should we refuse to send medicine to third-world countries, just because they don’t have their own aircraft factories? ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/37 "2011-04-11T01:06:32Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > It’s been a while since I’ve seen the two part episode in question. However, from what I can remember if the wrong faction won then the Klingons would have been allied with the Romulans which would have likely led to both parties going to war against the Federation. So non-interference could lead to a whole lot of needless deaths. Picard never interfered directly. He did the smart thing with the blockade to prevent the romulans from interfering either. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/38 "2011-04-11T02:43:17Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Picard was entirely right not to want to get involved in that war, ESPECIALLY on his own authority, unless there were proof of somebody else pulling the strings. It was far too likely to bite them in the ass. Star Fleet sent a whole fleet out there to prevent the Romulans from interfering, so it’s not like Picard was on his own. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/39 "2011-04-11T04:07:33Z")
Starfleet will never interfere with the development of a non-federation civilization unless there is a buck to be made. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2011, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845/40 "2011-04-11T06:28:14Z")
I never understood why saving a planet from a natural disaster was a violation of the Prime Directive. Especially if it could be done without interfering with the people on that planet. Asteroid about to crash into Centeria Prime? The Enterprise can blast it into pieces and no one on the planet will know anything about it. An entire civilization is dying of a disease? Dr Crusher could put the medicine in their water supply. There are ways to help without interfering with the culture. I understand the need for the Prime Directive. Probably the most difficult problem is when one race of people is exterminating another race. The temptation to step in and stop the killing is very strong. I recall an episode where Kirk finds a primitive planet with muskets. He discovers the Romulans are supplying them. So, Kirk arms the other side with muskets. Creating an arms race. A violation of the Prime Directive, but Kirk thought it was justified. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reform-the-prime-directive/577845.md?page=3)