# Refuted memes that won't stay dead **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** movies\ **Created:** [July 4, 2025, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488 "2025-07-04T15:48:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/81 "2025-07-05T18:41:22Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > The movie **Commando** similar to Star Wars is also made fun of because of just how impossible Arnold standing in the middle of an open field is to hit. Long years ago I saw this one-panel comic strip: captioned “every man has a bullet with his name on it”, it showed the interior of a Old West saloon where scores of bullets have somehow missed this one cowboy, who declares “My name is (cantrememberbutitwasaridiculouslylongandunlikelyname).” I would LOVE to add this to the TV Tropes page but I haven’t been able to find it. Anyone? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/82 "2025-07-05T18:42:52Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I always assumed the stormtropper suits were pressure suits. They are all standing in the landing bay when the Falcon was brought in. At least they make more sense than the fantasy that X-wing suits are pressurized! I don’t think they are - the air is retained in the hangars by force fields of some sort - I’m fairly sure there are scenes with other characters just wearing ordinary uniforms/clothing, are coming and going in the hangars, with the door open and space visible through it. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/83 "2025-07-05T19:24:31Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > The movie **Commando** similar to Star Wars is also made fun of because of just how impossible Arnold standing in the middle of an open field is to hit. So a similar example, that seems closer to what the OP is after, I’d posit the final shootout scene in Unforgiven. It’s sometimes criticized (including on the SDMB) for being bringing the movie down, after the realism of the rest of the movie, by being a cliched unrealistic Hollywood shootout, where the countless bad guys all miss and the good guys all hit. I’d argue its not that, if you watch carefully the "bad guys’ doing the shooting are random posse members with no experience of shooting people (or being shot at), and are wildly blasting away while terrified of being shot, Clint Eastwood is calmly aiming and shooting. The fact he is able to shoot two people once the shoot out starts without being shot himself, is lucky but in a “you make your own luck” kind of way, not Arnie in Commando. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/84 "2025-07-05T19:34:04Z")
In one of the original trilogy Star Wars films you do indeed see Stormtroopers standing OUTSIDE the Death Star hanger where the vacuum of space would be. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/85 "2025-07-05T19:34:28Z")
Bob Hope survives a gun fight with some help [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/2EqhJBAbYSE/maxresdefault.jpg "Alias Jesse James Scene Bob Hope Rhonda Fleming Street Gun Fight Western Movie Clip Old Trading Post") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EqhJBAbYSE) ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/86 "2025-07-05T19:46:17Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > But the film does explain this, Bennet tells the General that all of his men are untrained and that him and Arnold could easily destroy the entire base without a sweat. Even with that comment I’d argue the subsequent events do not realistically represent the advantages a highly trained special forces soldier would have in combat against a large number of poorly trained militia 🙂 I have never been to special forces training but I suspect there is no class on “taking off your shirt and running across a open field shooting at fully automatic” In a vaguely related point I just saw one of those you tube videos where they get real special forces guys to review action movie. He made a point on a John Wick scene where the titular hero trivially disarms an opponent with a knife, that is a complete Hollywood myth. Random dude with a knife against super hardcore hand-to-hand combat trained guy without a knife will not go down the way Hollywood says. If you have no weapon, and you are facing someone with a knife, get the hell out of there and get as much space as possible between you and the knife. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/87 "2025-07-05T19:55:14Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > In reality, bows required a lot of upper body strength to use; _more so_ than a typical sword. Good point. In 3.5 they had this with “strength bows” where you could add your STR to damage. So a person with high Dex but average str could hit fine, but those with muscles would do more damage also. > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > The OP’s TVTropes page links to this video making the case that the Stormtroopers were, in fact, very accurate, as long as they weren’t shooting at our heroes. Just my point. > [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Making an unproven assumption that at that time the troops chasing Luke & Leia, and Hand and Chewie, were deliberately missing, and then “proving” that they were accurate because they _missed_ is spurious logic at best. Again, they had both plot armor **and the Force.** Not counting the stars, the stormtroopers were pretty accurate. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/88 "2025-07-05T19:56:36Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > Random dude with a knife against super hardcore hand-to-hand combat trained guy without a knife will not go down the way Hollywood says. If you have no weapon, and you are facing someone with a knife, get the hell out of there and get as much space as possible between you and the knife. Even if you have a non-ranged weapon, the odds are pretty good that you will get cut. The first thing my edged weapons instructor told me was that in a real knife combat situation, one person will go to the hospital and the other one to the morgue. All of the sparing with chalked dummy knives that we did reinforced that wisdom. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/89 "2025-07-05T19:57:39Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > — where the titular hero trivially disarms an opponent with a knife, that is a complete Hollywood myth. Random dude with a knife against super hardcore hand-to-hand combat trained guy without a knife will not go down the way Hollywood says. If you have no weapon, and you are facing someone with a knife, get the hell out of there and get as much space as possible between you and the knife. Which is why in the multiple gun threads I’ve participated in over the years, I have no patience with people who’ve argued that if you arm yourself an assailant “will just take the gun away from you”. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/90 "2025-07-05T20:43:11Z")
The Indiana Jones version of this already had a topic dedicated to it, but the James Bond version is less talked about though I have seen it said online a fair number of times. That in Goldfinger “James Bond doesn’t play an active role in the plot”, seemingly because he’s imprisoned by Goldfinger for most of the plot. This is kind of completely forgetting the entire 3rd Act happens BECAUSE he played an active role in the plot, he convinces Pussy Galore to switch the gas tanks and get the word out to his superiors. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/91 "2025-07-05T21:14:07Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > if you watch carefully the "bad guys’ doing the shooting are random posse members with no experience of shooting people (or being shot at), and are wildly blasting away while terrified of being shot, Clint Eastwood is calmly aiming and shooting. One of my favorite movie disucssions on this subject, from _The Shootist_: - [Gillom Rogers](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000165/?ref_=ttqu_qu): [_Books has just given Gillom a shooting lesson_] But how could you get into so many fights and always come out on top? I nearly tied you shooting. - [John Bernard Books](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000078/?ref_=ttqu_qu): Friend, there’s nobody up there shooting back at you. It isn’t always being fast or even accurate that counts. It’s being willing. I found out early that most men, regardless of cause or need, aren’t willing. They blink an eye or draw a breath before they pull the trigger. I won’t. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/92 "2025-07-05T21:20:28Z")
> [@Asuka](#): > > This is kind of completely forgetting the entire 3rd Act happens BECAUSE he played an active role in the plot, he convinces Pussy Galore to switch the gas tanks and get the word out to his superiors. It’s like the one time in the entire franchise that James Bond actually does his job as an intelligence agent, and successfully convinces someone working for an enemy organization to covertly change sides. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/93 "2025-07-05T21:35:11Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > But I’m pretty dubious about this, even if someone did see what mice prefer in laboratory conditions, in the wild mice (who are close to starving to death at any time) are gonna go for the most energy dense food in the larder. Prior to cheese being routinely kept refrigerated (when this idea originated, presumably) that would be cheese, as long as sugar is kept in a jar. I don’t think mice, even if starving, are able to accurately evaluate the caloric content of various foods. They will eat what smells and tastes best to them. I’ve owned 23 pet rats over the past 15 years and in my experience, rats do like cheese but it’s not their favorite food. I think most rats prefer bread, Cheerios and banana to cheese, although I admit I’ve not done controlled experiments. (Rats are also leery of new food; they will usually only take a small nibble of an unfamiliar food, even if it tastes good, and only eat a lot of it after they’ve tried it and seen that it doesn’t make them sick.) Sometime soon I’ll offer my rats a smorgasbord and see what they take first. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/94 "2025-07-05T21:39:05Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > > [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > > > The bigger question is how did this kid who has only received at most a few weeks of training and a montage culminating in crane kicking > > Daniel learned karate in New Jersey before he ever met Miyagi - Miyaji gave him additional training, not an introduction to karate Speaking as a kid from New Jersey the same age as Daniel was supposed to be and who was into Taekwondo pretty heavy at the time, it was implied and then shown that Daniel didn’t know shit. He took a couple of beginner classes at the Y. He wasn’t training under a master. It was clear to me at the time it came out and ever since what it meant when he said he took classes at the Y. Daniel: I gotta take karate. That’s it. Lucille: You took karate! Daniel: No, not at the Y. At a good school. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/95 "2025-07-05T22:00:57Z")
I stand corrected. I had forgotten that - thanks. So he probably had some superficial karate knowledge, but nothing useful. That also explains why Daniel didn’t recognize his chore motions as similar to karate moves. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/96 "2025-07-05T22:04:46Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > So he probably had some superficial karate knowledge, but nothing useful. That and he’s a bullshitter. Like he tells his neighbor he’s had to use karate a few times. Of course he’s from New Jersey, he has to be an obnoxious loudmouth. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/97 "2025-07-05T22:07:30Z")
That tracks. How long was Miyagi’s training - 6 months? (I don’t remember when the all-Valley tournament is) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/98 "2025-07-05T22:22:55Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > How long was Miyagi’s training - 6 months? (I don’t remember when the all-Valley tournament is) Isn’t the tournament in December, after the skeleton-costume stuff is around Halloween? ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/99 "2025-07-05T22:32:36Z")
Looks like is was December [1984 All Valley Karate Tournament | The Karate Kid Wiki | Fandom](https://thekaratekid.fandom.com/wiki/1984_All_Valley_Karate_Tournament) - so much less than 6 months ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 5, 2025, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488/100 "2025-07-05T22:45:17Z")
One that does not stay dead, because it is actually like Schrödinger’s cat, in the case for the saying about “Drinking the Kool-Aid”, it is actually a dead and alive meme at the same time. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/najBMAItPYU/hqdefault.jpg "Jim Jones Gives a Tour of Jonestown's Food Supply") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=najBMAItPYU&t=23) The video shows Jim Jones himself, showing the storage in his cult compound in Guyana, showing a crate that he opens. Where one can see Flavoraid **AND** Kool-Aid. What it seems to me is that sure: Flavor-Aid was used, but chances are that Kool-Aid was **also** used in the Mass suicide at Jonestown in November 18, 1978. What I think it happened is that one was preferred to be reported about, the other more popular and important sponsor back then, was not mentioned. But the video shows that Kool-Aid was in the Jim Jones compound. There were reports also of Jones and his men doing "dry’ runs of the mass poisoning, with any of those flavor drinks used without poison, so for many of his followers, when it had poison for real, they drank it because for them it was going to be just another test. Even when many good sources declare this meme as dead, it is dubious that it was just Flavor-Aid when that took place. So, I will still say to cultists that yeah, you guys are “drinking the Kool-Aid”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/refuted-memes-that-wont-stay-dead/1020488.md?page=6)