# Reggie White is Not a Great Man - Shame on the Packers and the NFL **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 18, 2005, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271 "2005-09-18T22:54:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2005, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/201 "2005-09-21T23:57:25Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Eh…not enough to get worked up about. I find it annoying and manipulative in the same way I find it annoying and manipulative when they play that stupid Leo Greenwood song at ballgames. I thought it had already been settled that Greenwood’s song was awful in every way that a song can be awful. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/202 "2005-09-22T00:01:42Z")
> [@unophobia](#): > > Okay, back to Minister Reggie White. Yes, his views on gays, among others, is a towing-the-line clunker, and may earn derision from those who disagree. But those were his beliefs. So what? White supremacy is a belief, too. Just saying, “Those were his beliefs!” doesn’t excuse anything. He chose those beliefs, and should be held responsible for that choice. But, like **Diogenes** , I don’t really care that this doesn’t get mentioned in the half-time show, which focuses on his genuinely humanitarian efforts. The halftime show can celebrate the good that he did. We can use other venues (like this one) to discuss the evil. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/203 "2005-09-22T13:35:54Z")
BTW, **Twin** , I’m still posting. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/204 "2005-09-22T14:42:01Z")
> [@Homebrew](#): > > BTW, **Twin** , I’m still posting. ROFLMAO, LOL and all that 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/205 "2005-09-22T16:04:31Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Yeah it’s insulting… (cut for brevity’s sake) Steve your post is several pages late, you’ve basically said the exact same thing Marley did, I’m not going to continue to read identical statements and reply to them with the precise same response. I’ll respond to you saying I was judging though, no, I’m not judging. I’m simply conveying the message I personally view as truth and the message _our_ church holds as truth. Homosexual acts ARE SIN. If you do not believe that, then it is impossible for you to be a Catholic in good faith. Do you participate in homosexual acts? If you have, and haven’t been to confession, then you’re not exactly a shining example of Catholicism. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/206 "2005-09-22T16:10:34Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > I’m simply conveying the message I personally view as truth and the message _our_ church holds as truth. Homosexual acts ARE SIN. I’m of the feeling that the church couldn’t defend that opinion any better than **Twin** can - no offense, **Twin** , you stated everything clearly, it’s just not very conclusive. It’s not my church, but if it was I’d consider that a big problem. > [@](#): > > If you do not believe that, then it is impossible for you to be a Catholic in good faith. I’m guessing a Catholic will be along to say that that’s incorrect, and possibly insulting. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/207 "2005-09-22T16:12:46Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I agree with this in general, and avoid doing it myself as much as possible. (Also, my boyfriend’s a Christian, and I don’t want to end up sleeping on the couch.) On the other hand, “turn the other cheek” is a fine idea in principle, but often very difficult to put into practice. I can’t really blame **Otto** or **Homebrew** for reacting to insults with further insults, even if I think there are more effective ways of getting your point across. Some Christians may have a persecution complex inherited from the Judaic experience, but a lot of gays have a persecution complex inherited from _actually being persecuted._ I tend to be more respectful of the latter than the former, and grant them more latitude. > > It’s also worth pointing out that “your religion is just a bunch of faerie tales,” is insulting to the precise degree as “your sexuality is a sin.” To the extent that it alienates believers who might otherwise be on our side, it is an unfortunate thing to say. But it might also make folks like **Martin Hyde** recognize exactly why so many people take exception to his beliefs, and are unwilling to accept, “it’s part of my belief system” as any sort of an excuse for them. I’m an atheist, and yeah, it is part of my “belief” system that most of the Bible is nothing more than faerie tales. I’m more than happy to keep that to myself, if **Martin Hyde** will keep his “gay sex is sinful” crap to himself. But if we’re going to be expressing what we think without regard to how it makes other people feel, as **Martin** was doing earlier in this thread, than “you believe in sky fairies” are as fair play as “you’re an abomination.” > > That said, “Fuck Jesus and fuck you,” was pretty far over the line. I’ve already said that most of the time I will keep these beliefs to myself. Not because I’m ashamed of them, or because I don’t fully believe in them. But because many people get upset when they hear them. I know why they’re getting upset. People don’t like to hear that their lifestyle is perfect. It’s not just homosexuals that get mad when you talk about Christianity. It’s pretty much ALL NON-CHRISTIAN SINNERS. Even the most steadfast atheist will get pissed off when some “uppity” Christian starts talking about sin. I don’t know why that is, but it’s something I’ve observed quite a lot in my life. Anyways, anytime this issue comes up on the forums I will be more than happy to share my beliefs. And my faith in my God is beyond assail. Calling him a “sky fairie” or whatever rolls off me like so much water. In fact, I enjoy it when people say stuff like that. It’s an excellent test of my faith, because I hear something that assaults the very core of my religion, and I refrain from resorting to personal attacks or anger. It gives me a chance to perfectly exemplify the traits of a good Christian. Anyways, I have no _intention_ to make people feel bad. But sometimes in life you cannot avoid hurting people, despite your best efforts. The _truth_ is painful for many, it was painful for Otto, SteveG and et al in this thread. I wish it wasn’t, but I can’t control that. Don’t say I have no regard to people’s feelings. I’ve expressed nothing but love and compassion for everyone who’s said anything against me in this thread. And I’ve held my tongue on this forum far more often than most of you realize, simply because I don’t like to see so much contention. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/208 "2005-09-22T16:16:23Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m guessing a Catholic will be along to say that that’s incorrect, and possibly insulting. 😉 The Chief Commandment’s of Our Church: I. To assist at Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of obligation II. To fast and abstain on the days appointed III. **To confess our sins at least once a year** IV. To receive Holy Communion during the Easter time V. To contribute to the support of the Church VI. To observe the laws of the Church concerning marriage ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/209 "2005-09-22T16:19:56Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > The Chief Commandment’s of Our Church: > > I. To assist at Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of obligation > II. To fast and abstain on the days appointed > III. **To confess our sins at least once a year** > IV. To receive Holy Communion during the Easter time > V. To contribute to the support of the Church > VI. To observe the laws of the Church concerning marriage Rule number VII: **No Pooftahs!** The seven rules are to assist at Mass on Sundays, fast and abstain on the days appointed, confess our sins once a year, Holy Communion at Easter, support the cohurch, oberve the marriage laws, no pooftahs, and an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope… Shite! Eight! The eight rules are… ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/210 "2005-09-22T16:27:06Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > Steve your post is several pages late, you’ve basically said the exact same thing Marley did, I’m not going to continue to read identical statements and reply to them with the precise same response. > > I’ll respond to you saying I was judging though, no, I’m not judging. I’m simply conveying the message I personally view as truth and the message _our_ church holds as truth. Homosexual acts ARE SIN. If you do not believe that, then it is impossible for you to be a Catholic in good faith. Do you participate in homosexual acts? If you have, and haven’t been to confession, then you’re not exactly a shining example of Catholicism. Gee. That sounds like a judgement. Jesus said “Judge not…” Hmmmm. He also said “Love thy neighbor…” Maybe He shopuld have made his biggest lesson “Live your own life, keep your mouth shut and mind your own business”. He was strangely silent about gays, but had plenty to say about hypocrites and “holier than thou” types. “Give away all that you possess…” Have you given everything away? Funny how those things get swept aside, when they are the core basis of Christianity, as taught by _our_ church. Who are you to decide what makes a good anything? Who are you to decide what is sin, when the highest regarded and extensively trained professional scholars can’t even agree? You don’t get to tell me or anyone else what is good or bad. As far as whay _our_ church teaches, they used to teach that it was a good thing to convert by force, and to burn heretics, witches and midwives. They also used to punish people for saying the earth orbited the sun. Inquisitions were a good thing. Shall I go on? They changed their minds later. _Our_ church has changed their “truth” from time to time. Besides, nobody can tell me especially in the PIT that I can’t call someone when they are condescending, judgemental and insulting. I don’t care what you view as the truth since I have my own. We probably can argue and scream for several pages, but you just aren’t worth the time. You weren’t/aren’t judging? Bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/211 "2005-09-22T16:28:24Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > Steve your post is several pages late, you’ve basically said the exact same thing Marley did, I’m not going to continue to read identical statements and reply to them with the precise same response. That was me, actually, not **Marley**. Glad to know you’re paying attention. > [@](#): > > I’ll respond to you saying I was judging though, no, I’m not judging. I’m simply conveying the message I personally view as truth and the message _our_ church holds as truth. Homosexual acts ARE SIN. Jesus, would you look at what you’re typing? How in the blue blazing fuck is “Homosexuality is a sin,” not a judgement? Do you know what “judgement” means? > [@](#): > > If you do not believe that, then it is impossible for you to be a Catholic in good faith. Do you participate in homosexual acts? If you have, and haven’t been to confession, then you’re not exactly a shining example of Catholicism. Thanks for sharing your wisdom with us, Your Holiness. > [@](#): > > Anyways, anytime this issue comes up on the forums I will be more than happy to share my beliefs. And my faith in my God is beyond assail. Calling him a “sky fairie” or whatever rolls off me like so much water. In fact, I enjoy it when people say stuff like that. It’s an excellent test of my faith, because I hear something that assaults the very core of my religion, and I refrain from resorting to personal attacks or anger. It gives me a chance to perfectly exemplify the traits of a good Christian. So, is pride a trait of a good Christian these days? > [@](#): > > Anyways, I have no _intention_ to make people feel bad. But sometimes in life you cannot avoid hurting people, despite your best efforts. The _truth_ is painful for many, it was painful for Otto, SteveG and et al in this thread. I wish it wasn’t, but I can’t control that. Don’t say I have no regard to people’s feelings. I’ve expressed nothing but love and compassion for everyone who’s said anything against me in this thread. And I’ve held my tongue on this forum far more often than most of you realize, simply because I don’t like to see so much contention. Funny how few of the people you claim to be expressing love and compassion for can’t seem to _perceive_ that love or compassion. Why do you think that is, **Martin**? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/212 "2005-09-22T16:30:18Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > The Chief Commandment’s of Our Church: > > I. To assist at Mass on all Sundays and Holy Days of obligation > II. To fast and abstain on the days appointed > III. **To confess our sins at least once a year** > IV. To receive Holy Communion during the Easter time > V. To contribute to the support of the Church > VI. To observe the laws of the Church concerning marriage There’s a good reason I didn’t quote the part of your post that mentioned confession. Wanna know what it is? _That’s not what I was talking about_. I was addressing your comments on gay sex and homosexuality being sins. I know Catholics in good faith who disagree, I was trying to let some say so for themselves. Perhaps _you_ don’t think they’re Catholics in good faith, but I’ll let you guys hash that out. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/213 "2005-09-22T17:49:30Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > The _truth_ is painful for many, it was painful for Otto, SteveG and et al in this thread. You wouldn’t know the truth about homosexuality if it bit you on your pompous ass. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/214 "2005-09-22T17:49:41Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > It’s not just homosexuals that get mad when you talk about Christianity. It’s pretty much ALL NON-CHRISTIAN SINNERS. Even the most steadfast atheist will get pissed off when some “uppity” Christian starts talking about sin. I don’t know why that is, but it’s something I’ve observed quite a lot in my life. Maybe it’s because you do it in a condescending, pompous, holier than thou manner. I don’t hate to burst your bubble; but most adults don’t like to be talked down to and that’s how your ideas about “sin” come across. We get pissed when you take a haughty tone and treat us like you’re better because you believe in some hogwash from some old book. Believe it all you want but don’t expect us to bow to your supposed superiority because you follow the rules from some long dead preachers. If you treated people with respect, as equals, in regards to the freedoms of modern democracy, then you’d not meet the destain that you do. But when you come in telling us we’re lesser beings, that we deserve fewer rights and defending someone who thought we should be imprisoned or killed, then you can fuck off and shove that bible right up your ass. I don’t give one flying fuck what some ancient scribbles from some primative goat-herders had to say about my sexuality. Like I told **Twin** before, I invite your supposed God to smite me now if he’s not impotent and imaginary. Since I’m about to hit submit reply, we can see he’s still not got any power. Likewise, there isn’t any Satan waiting to cart my soul off to hell when I die. He’s just as welcome to take me now and save us all the time if he’d like. Otherwise he can kiss my ass, too, because I ain’t bowing before no gods or demons. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/215 "2005-09-22T17:50:31Z")
Here is a bit more about the dogmas and “truths” of _our_ church and what a Good Catholic means/is. Official church “doctrine” says that no pope or bishop shall change moral teachings because these are based on God’s law. However, history shows that the Church HAS changed its teachings over the centuries. Some of those teachings were false and some were **evil**. 1. For over 1800 years, they did not condemn slavery. Now they do. 2. Until the 17th century, popes condemned loans with interest as being usury. Now it’s not such a big evil. 3. The earth used to be flat. Now it is round. Nobody has to worry about falling off and being eaten by dragons anymore. Now that’s a relief. 4. The church used to call and support Crusades - even childrens crusades. Now they are against wars and aggression and killing and looting and all the other "baggage that goes with it. 5. The church used to approve of the “holy work” of the Conquistadores. Converting (oh and also enslaving or wiping out) the godless heathens and “savages” by force. 6. The church used to sponsor inquisitions. 7. The pope wrote letters of commendation to that shining paragon of Christian valor and gentleness, Prince Vlad Dracul the Impaler. Holy shit for real. Look it up. So much for peace, love and the sanctity of life right there. 8. The sun and the universe used to revolve around the earth. Now it doesn’t work that way. The church used to prosecute people for daring top say “is not”. Galileo and others were formally charged for speaking the truth. 9. In 1832, Pope Gregory XVI wrote an encyclical condemning freedom of conscience as an “absurd and erroneous teaching or rather madness”. 10. Pope Leo XIII condemned “the modern liberties” and opposed the equality and participation of citizens in civic and political life. The people, he wrote, “are the untutored multitude” that must “be controlled by the authority of law”. Interesting. He was endorsing the old system of nobles keeping the peasant rabble under their thumb (in the name of God ofcourse). _In short, America is evil. So is France, England and any other country that decided to try freedom and justice and any form of representative government. Self determinsation is The Big Bad. Congress and Parliament are the paths to hell_ WTF Items 1, 2, 4, 5,6, 7, 9 and 10 are MORAL issues. Why the big 180, if The Church knows all and tells all? How does good become evil, or evil become good? How does blind obedience get these butchers off the hook? How does opposition condemn those who (it turned out) were right? Vatican II reversed Items 9 and 10, in violation of the law that said no laws can be reversed by anyone. ??? How does that work? In short, there are NO immutable laws - not even the laws of the church. Looking at the above examples, it seems a Good Christian could be one who wages war, kills, tortures, destroys, and ensalves. The Vatican II guys went to hell for changing them I guess. After all these were laws and policies and are immutable. I wonder. The things I listed are the opposite of what Jesus taught, but they made for “good Catholics”. Yeah, right. I have a feeling these things were not changed or corrected by blindly obeying “good Catholics”. They were changed from within by the “bad Catholics” who had the guts or the stubbornness to call bullshit on them. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/216 "2005-09-22T18:07:01Z")
Before someone like **Seige** , **Polycarp** or **Sol Grundy** gets upset with me over my belittling of the faith above, let me point out that I don’t despise your Gods, which share little in common with the fundamentalists’. Certainly I don’t believe they exist; but I don’t hate them. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/217 "2005-09-22T18:11:13Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > There’s a good reason I didn’t quote the part of your post that mentioned confession. Wanna know what it is? > > _That’s not what I was talking about_. I was addressing your comments on gay sex and homosexuality being sins. I know Catholics in good faith who disagree, I was trying to let some say so for themselves. Perhaps _you_ don’t think they’re Catholics in good faith, but I’ll let you guys hash that out. They can disagree, but they’d be wrong about Catholic doctrine. In 1976 the Catholic Church clearly stated that ONE homosexuality is a state beyond a person’s choice. Therefor HOMOSEXUALITY IS NOT A SIN (and I’ve never said it was a sin) however homogenital acts ARE sin. Because they are in violation of long standing church doctrine concerning human sexual actions (no premarital or extramarital sex, no sex without the possibility of procreation.) ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/218 "2005-09-22T18:28:14Z")
> [@Homebrew](#): > > But when you come in telling us we’re lesser beings, **that we deserve fewer rights** and defending someone who thought we should be imprisoned or killed, then you can fuck off and shove that bible right up your ass. Credit where credit is due: > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > However I don’t dislike homosexuals as people, I don’t treat them differently than I do anyone else, I don’t believe they should be treated differently under the law, **I think they should have the same rights that anyone else has under the law (marriage, adoption etc)**, I would never advocate violence or “hate” against homosexuals. (Emphasis mine in both quotes) We can criticize him for having stupid ideas, but at least he’s not trying to turn his stupid ideas into law. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/219 "2005-09-22T18:35:18Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Credit where credit is due: > > We can criticize him for having stupid ideas, but at least he’s not trying to turn his stupid ideas into law. Ironic then that he’s arguing so much that a good Catholic can’t disagree with the church when the church’s position is that "“Marriage exists solely between a man and woman … Marriage is holy, while homosexual acts go against the natural moral law.” If I missed his one paragraph clause in “support” of equal rights it’s because his volumous declarations that the church is right about everything contradicts that position. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 22, 2005, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271/220 "2005-09-22T18:39:52Z")
Hey, I never said he was being _logical_! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/reggie-white-is-not-a-great-man-shame-on-the-packers-and-the-nfl/322271.md?page=12)