# Relative asks for money all the time...but she tithes every month **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 3, 2013, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007 "2013-11-03T22:55:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2013, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/41 "2013-11-04T16:01:22Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Hmm, I am not a Catholic but I thought you were supposed to tithe a percentage of your income. Someone living off government benefits shouldn’t feel obligatedto tithe. She is a little on the nutty side obviously. Catholics don’t have a strict tradition of tithing. I would be surprised to learn she is Catholic. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2013, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/42 "2013-11-04T16:48:07Z")
> [@glee](#): > > Here’s where her tithes are going: > > In November 2003, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch published a four-part special report detailing Meyer’s “$10 million corporate jet, her husband’s $107,000 silver-gray Mercedes sedan, her $2 million home and houses worth another $2 million for her four children,” a $20 million headquarters, furnished with “$5.7 million worth of furniture, artwork, glassware, and the latest equipment and machinery,” including a “$30,000 malachite round table, a $23,000 marble-topped antique commode, a $14,000 custom office bookcase, a $7,000 Stations of the Cross in Dresden porcelain, a $6,300 eagle sculpture on a pedestal, another eagle made of silver bought for $5,000, and numerous paintings purchased for $1,000 to $4,000 each,” among many other expensive items – all paid for by the ministry. The articles prompted Wall Watchers (a Christian nonprofit watchdog group) to call on the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) to investigate Meyer and her family. > > I suggest you tell her that instead of giving her the money, you’re going to tithe too. :smack:😃 Until I read this, I had forgotten about the employee who killed his family. > **[Joyce Meyer's Ex-Bodyguard Convicted of Murder](https://www.christianpost.com/news/joyce-meyers-ex-bodyguard-convicted-of-murder-50138/)** > > Christopher Coleman, the former security chief for televangelist Joyce Meyer, was found guilty this week of murdering his family Jurors also determined that he is eligible for the death penalty I still kind of like seeing her interviewed. Go figure. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/43 "2013-11-04T16:54:15Z")
Cut her off. Maybe “Oh What a Friend We Have In Jesus” is in her Hymnal. Chapter 7. ---
**Author:** ![WilyQuixote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@WilyQuixote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WilyQuixote)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/44 "2013-11-04T17:00:33Z")
> [@Sigma](#): > > **brazil84,** > > She doesn’t even go to a church. She most likely gives 10% of her money to Joyce Meyers Ministries. If she was active in a local church, my response would be different. I ahd to Google Joyce Meyer Ministries. What I found suggests that your close relative needs the money much more than JM Minsitries. I second cutting her off. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2013, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/45 "2013-11-04T17:11:31Z")
> [@don\_t\_ask](#): > > Tell her that you have worked out a better solution. You will simply pay her tithes for her and she can manage her money herself. Don’t pay the tithes. Problem solved. Lol, good point. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/46 "2013-11-05T00:15:54Z")
If she’s borrowing from you, she clearly doesn’t have an income. 10% of $0 is $0. She should be tithing $0. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/47 "2013-11-05T00:26:58Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > Oh, now that is NOT the same as giving 10% to her church. Not at all.\ That’s what I was thinking, looking at the title of this thread again - giving money to a scam artist isn’t tithing, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/48 "2013-11-05T02:51:39Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > . . . I doubt even the church she’s giving the money to would be comfortable with that arrangement if they knew about it. I’ve heard of some prosperity churches that tell you that if you loose your job or otherwise have a reduction in income, that’s the time to start double tithing. > [@Namkcalb](#): > > . . . Why doesn’t such a religious woman go to church? There’s piety, there’s sharing, and there’s hopeful wishing for magic. If you’re hopefully wishing for magic income and you go to a regular church, you might find that the people there discourage that. It can be deflating. To keep the magic going, you might want to avoid a regular church. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/49 "2013-11-05T08:30:11Z")
> [@Yllaria](#): > > I’ve heard of some prosperity churches that tell you that if you loose your job or otherwise have a reduction in income, that’s the time to start double tithing. Yep - I’ve heard that one too - Kenneth Copeland I think. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/50 "2013-11-05T14:35:00Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > I am going to dissent a little. Giving money to someone doesn’t give you the right to decide how they spend it. you have every right not to give a gift based on knowing how it’s likely to be spent. The OP’s cousin has every right to tithe, and the OP has every right not to fund it. > [@glee](#): > > Here’s where her tithes are going: > > In November 2003, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch published a four-part special report detailing Meyer’s “$10 million corporate jet, her husband’s $107,000 silver-gray Mercedes sedan, her $2 million home and houses worth another $2 million for her four children,” a $20 million headquarters, furnished with “$5.7 million worth of furniture, artwork, glassware, and the latest equipment and machinery,” including a “$30,000 malachite round table, a $23,000 marble-topped antique commode, a $14,000 custom office bookcase, a $7,000 Stations of the Cross in Dresden porcelain, a $6,300 eagle sculpture on a pedestal, another eagle made of silver bought for $5,000, and numerous paintings purchased for $1,000 to $4,000 each,” among many other expensive items – all paid for by the ministry. The articles prompted Wall Watchers (a Christian nonprofit watchdog group) to call on the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) to investigate Meyer and her family. The IRS found that 87% of donations went towards outreach programs to spread religious doctrine, and allowed them to keep their tax-exempt status. So, at most 13% of her tithes are going to the excesses mentioned above. The rest is going to spreading what I consider to be mythology, but my opinion on that is irrelevant. It certainly does irk me that people get rich doing this kind of “charity” work. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/51 "2013-11-05T15:55:38Z")
Are you lending or giving money to her? If you’re lending my up-front policy is that I won’t lend any more until I’m paid back. If you’re giving money to her I’d just tell her if she has enough money to tithe then you shouldn’t need to give her money. I’d suggest she adjust her tithing, and you shouldn’t feel bad about it. ---
**Author:** ![Sahirrnee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sahirrnee/32/13937_2.png) [@Sahirrnee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sahirrnee)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/52 "2013-11-05T16:11:51Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > you have every right not to give a gift based on knowing how it’s likely to be spent. > > The OP’s cousin has every right to tithe, and the OP has every right not to fund it. > > The IRS found that 87% of donations went towards outreach programs to spread religious doctrine, and allowed them to keep their tax-exempt status. So, at most 13% of her tithes are going to the excesses mentioned above. > > The rest is going to spreading what I consider to be mythology, but my opinion on that is irrelevant. It certainly does irk me that people get rich doing this kind of “charity” work. If I didn’t have a conscience I’d love to get rich this way. Once after reading about all these TV evangelists I said I had missed my calling. My sister said you don’t even believe in God. I said I don’t have to, all I have to do is convince the people who do that God wants me to have their money. Those people know exactly what they are doing. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/53 "2013-11-05T16:56:24Z")
> [@Sahirrnee](#): > > Those people know exactly what they are doing. Don’t blame them for their blessings! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/54 "2013-11-05T20:33:30Z")
Sigma, you totally did the right thing. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007/55 "2013-11-06T00:16:49Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > The IRS found that 87% of donations went towards outreach programs to spread religious doctrine, and allowed them to keep their tax-exempt status. So, at most 13% of her tithes are going to the excesses mentioned above. Unless you know exactly how the IRS works this out, I think this is naive. Do you know how the IRS decides what is personal spending and what is spending on spreading religious doctrine? Does the IRS have rules setting maximum limits on how lavish the headquarters of a religious organisation can be before it is considered not part of spreading religious doctrine? Or on how high salaries those who work at the top of such organisations can be before they are no longer part of spreading religious doctrine? Or on how much the organisation can spend on transporting its messiahs around? I think you will find that the corporate jet counts as spreading religious doctrine. The gold taps in the personal apartments in the new church are part of spreading religious doctrine. The monumental salaries probably paid to Meyer and her family are part of spreading religious doctrine. All the work of Meyer’s church is likely to count as “spreading religious doctrine” as far as the IRS is concerned. That means that most likely pretty much everything that the church spends is covered. And given that Meyer’s church is likely to revolve almost entirely around Meyer, and Meyer’s life is inextricably wound up with her church, I expect pretty much everything she uses, lives in etc counts as “spreading religious doctrine”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relative-asks-for-money-all-the-time-but-she-tithes-every-month/673007.md?page=2)