# Relatively few black people can swim - What?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 22, 2004, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487 "2004-04-22T19:20:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/21 "2004-04-23T00:07:14Z")
> [@citrus x paradisi](#): > > Even if whites and blacks were on the same economic level in your area, which I doubt, they haven’t always been-- meaning that swimming could easily be part of a white family’s tradition moreso than a black family. I don’t think it’s anything to do with finance, we’ve got a publically owned pool which the last time I went (about 1975…) cost next to nothing to use. You could be right about family tradition though… ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/22 "2004-04-23T00:37:43Z")
More Blacks Drown in the US each year than other races. Though in 1994 slightly more Asians died from drowning. But in 1990 over TWICE as many blacks drowned than whites. [http://www.lapublichealth.org/ivpp/reports/inj9094/drngraphs.pdf](http://www.lapublichealth.org/ivpp/reports/inj9094/drngraphs.pdf) In 1993, though the overall deaths of blacks from drowning was twice that of white. Yet, in the 1-4 age group, twice as many whites drowned than blacks. This seems to go along with the theory that more white people have local residential or private swimming pools. This is either socio-economic (whites having more money to afford pools) or it’s cultural (whites traditional like to swim more, thus fancy a pool in their back yard)/ > **[Drowning-CDC-4-99.PDF](https://www.menshealthnetwork.org/library/Drowning-CDC-4-99.PDF)** I’m not an idiot, I found tons of statistics like this. But, I understand these alone really don’t prove anything. Hell… the fact that twice as many blacks die from drowning every year could actually suggest that there are twice as many blacks swimming on any given day. But these stats, along with countless statements made by black people seems to suggest a strong disinterest in swimming! Statements like "_“Traditionally,” explains Mixon, "black folks haven’t been exposed to boating, even those who live near bodies of water. A lot of black folks don’t know how to swim and some have a fear of deep water. Safety is a major concern. BBS is an event where people can relax, unwind, and get comfortable….The opportunity to see other black men and women swimming, snorkeling, sailing, and scuba diving is very reassuring. It makes folks think ‘if they can do it, I can too.’_ [http://www.sailnet.com/collections/cruising/index.cfm?articleID=ddcksn0470%20%20&coll\_cat=Underway&Coll\_name=Getting%20Underway](http://www.sailnet.com/collections/cruising/index.cfm?articleID=ddcksn0470%20%20&coll_cat=Underway&Coll_name=Getting%20Underway) Not to mention the statements brought up in the OP. Funny how it is not uncommon to hear “I am black. Ya’ll know we can’t swim”. Yet I have never heard a white person blaim his inability to swim on being white. Don’t give me that crap about just because I’ve noticed far less black people enjoy swimming or even have the skill or desire to swim must mean I am racist! You know what? I’ve also noticed that the majority or people living in inner-city projects are black. And the majority of people living in rural trailor parks are white. And statistically there are more mexicans picking strawberries in Polk County, FL than other races… Does recognizing these facts make me a racist??? ---
**Author:** ![SCSimmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@SCSimmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCSimmons)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/23 "2004-04-23T00:44:53Z")
Just a (probably irrelevant) data point, but … one of my sister’s black classmates in high school was a very competitive swimmer. He missed the qualifying time for the tryouts for the '92 U.S. Olympic team by less than 1/10th of a second. So, _some_ blacks can swim. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/24 "2004-04-23T00:46:31Z")
Oh, BTW, that post is in direct reply to **Starguard** ’s insulting, inane, and uninformative comment. All I said was that there is obvious truth to the fact that less black people in the US swim than white. People have theories, but no one that I’ve seen has any proof to exactly why that is. But I specifically said I do NOT believe it has something to do with physiology or a genetic disposition to not have a natural ability to float. I am still in awe over your comment. . . ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/25 "2004-04-23T00:48:22Z")
> [@SCSimmons](#): > > So, _some_ blacks can swim. 🙂 Exactly!! Obviously they _can_. I think we’re all wondering why more _don’t_. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/26 "2004-04-23T00:58:22Z")
So - am I to assume we’re only talking about US blacks in this thread? The reason I ask is that in another thread, just like this one, I posted loads of links to black swimmers, including full photo spreads of the Jamacian swim team and my posts were poo-poo because the folks wern’t American. I think the fact that blacks in other countries not only swim, but actively form swim teams suggest to me that it’s a cultural difference in the US. Similar to the lack of black hockey players - I have no doubt that black people have just as many inate skills at hockey as white folks do (see Jerome Iginla) - they just tend to have less interest in that particular sport, for whatever reason. (Culture and access, I’m guessing.) ---
**Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/27 "2004-04-23T01:09:38Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > …Similar to the lack of black hockey players - I have no doubt that black people have just as many inate skills at hockey as white folks do (see Jerome Iginla) - they just tend to have less interest in that particular sport, for whatever reason. (Culture and access, I’m guessing.) True enough, who’d have thought ten years ago that a non-white golfer would be any good… ---
**Author:** ![syncrolecyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f08c70/32.png) [@syncrolecyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/syncrolecyne)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/28 "2004-04-23T01:15:49Z")
When I was in high school, the swimming championships tended to go to the same two or three schools that were relatively affluent. The individual swimmers came from many backgrounds, so I don’t think it had a thing to do with race, just the fact that these kids were more likely to have grown up with a pool of their own. ---
**Author:** ![citrus\_x\_paradisi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6f9a4e/32.png) [@citrus\_x\_paradisi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/citrus_x_paradisi)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/29 "2004-04-23T01:31:03Z")
I think tradition really does play a big role in this. I mean, people can pick up sports like basketball or baseball or suchlike during their lifetime, but it really takes parental pressure to get a child interested in swimming. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/30 "2004-04-23T01:33:17Z")
> [@Thinks2Much](#): > > I promise to share my title if you call me by the right sex- I would be a little golden girl, thank you. Shall I also write a terribly generalizing post in the wrong forum that you conservatives automatically assume anyone who actually provided some facts and not an opinion is automatically a man? 😛 (just teasing) There was a little girl Who had a little curl RIGHT in the middle of her forehead And when she was good, she was very, very good! But when she was bad, she was horrid! ---
**Author:** ![Kilvert\_s\_Pagan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@Kilvert\_s\_Pagan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kilvert_s_Pagan)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/31 "2004-04-23T01:48:34Z")
> [@Bear\_Nenno](#): > > But I specifically said I do NOT believe it has something to do with physiology or a genetic disposition to not have a natural ability to float. At the risk of being stripped of my liberal credentials, I do think it’s possible that physiological differences may play a part in this. Other influences, as noted by others in this thread, obviously may also play a part in this. If one can concede the point that (in the US) African Americans have proven to be athletically superior in pursuits such as sprinting, basketball, most “talent” positions in the NFL, etc., and that this over-representation cannot by explained by opportunities in childhood which African Americans enjoy _ **more** _ than do whites, then I think it’s reasonable to also recognize that the same physical difference which causes this superiority (perhaps higher muscle density?) could also make it harder to float. Even though this conclusion makes me squirm. ---
**Author:** ![Bear\_Nenno](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bear_nenno/32/3358_2.png) [@Bear\_Nenno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bear_Nenno)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/32 "2004-04-23T02:13:06Z")
**tpayne** , I’ll agree that it could be possible. But I won’t believe it without proof. I think the most likely physiological reasoning _would_ be “denser” bones. But one thing comes to mind that rules this out, at least in my opinion: I am pretty sure that when forensics experts are investigating some human remains they’ve found, they are unable to determine the race of the victim by examining a femur. If blacks had denser bones, then experts wouldn’t be so stumped. Also, and most importantly, if there WAS a physiological difference, it would affect all blacks. Obviously not all black people sink. (If any) And because it seems this phenomenon only exists in the United States, suggests it is indeed socio-economic or cultural or something along those lines. Honestly, if there is a factual answer here somewhere, I believe it’s that: -All normal healthy black people have the ability to swim -A vast majority of blacks in the U.S. do not know how to swim (and) -They have no desire to learn (and) -They don’t enjoy water related sports. \ **Author:** ![mascaroni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dc4da7/32.png) [@mascaroni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mascaroni)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/33 "2004-04-23T02:21:27Z") It’s not only in the United States, as I said before I’ve come across the same thing in England. It could be though, that the people who I grew up with came from the West Indies, which would imply a West African origin, the same as the majority of blacks in the US. Ever seen a top class US black/West Indian/Nigerian marathon runner? Ever seen a top class Kenyan 100m sprinter? Race ain’t a case of black and white… ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/34 "2004-04-23T02:30:24Z")
I’ve got a wild ass guess as to one of the factors: Black people are dark. That sounds stupid at first, until you remember that blacks aren’t that heavilly into tanning (for obvious reasons), and sunbathing is usually done next to water. No facts to back it up, just throwing out a possibile factor. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/35 "2004-04-23T03:30:12Z")
I don’t know the answer, but I’ll add that Pat Conroy made the same observation about Daufuskie (Yamacraw) Island in the book “The Water Is Wide” (movie “Conrack”). Despite their living on an island, few of the natives knew how to swim. ---
**Author:** ![Vic\_Ferrari](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/dbc845/32.png) [@Vic\_Ferrari](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vic_Ferrari)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/36 "2004-04-23T03:34:03Z")
Of the hundred or so guys I went through boot camp with there were a handful that couldn’t swim, all were black. I didn’t think much of it at the time, but I later learned that others had the same experience, so there must be _something_ to it. ---
**Author:** ![Abbie\_Carmichael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Abbie\_Carmichael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Abbie_Carmichael)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/37 "2004-04-23T03:43:27Z")
All of my black female friends spend a LOT of money on their hair. Ain’t no way they’re getting in a pool, that’d totally ruin hours of their stylist’s work!!! I’ve seen some amazing braidwork that took multiple visits to finish. FWIW I was in college before I knew that black women only wash their hair occasionally. I had a black suite mate that was amazed that I washed my hair every day: she did hers only once or twice a month. “Girl, my hair would fall out if I washed it every day!” Who knew? ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/38 "2004-04-23T04:05:39Z")
More anecdotal evidence, but I remember my grandmother talking about “The White Pool” and “The Black Pool” during the segregation days (I have no idea whether this is accurate, I’m just throwing it out for consideration/to be shot down). ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/39 "2004-04-23T04:38:15Z")
A couple of off-hand remarks: First: Body-fat percentage is a determining factor in buoyancy. I used to go to school with a number of water polo payers and it never ceased to amaze me that they didn’t float. Well, at least, unless they were swimming. If you get your body fat percentage down into the single digit range you’re not going to float nearly so well. Swear to God. More on this later. Second: This point has been covered in an off-hand fashion before, but elaborating may I say that I’m never going to be good at polo. I’ve never been exposed to it, I’ll never play it. You have to be exposed to something at a young age in order to excel at it. There might be exceptions , but they’re few. That said, I can’t believe how badly most people swim. What the fuck are you people doing in the water? Surviving? Christ, learn how to pull a stroke. Oops. Back to the thought… Third: Hey, whats-your-name, how YOU doin’? Fourth: The best explanation I’ve heard re the African fabulousness in sport is that African DNA also has the largest variation of any specific geographic area. So one would think that African descnedants would have a wider dispersal of fast runners, while at the same a wider disperal of fat people. Lest you jump on me, the author of this book is Black. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2004, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487/40 "2004-04-23T04:54:22Z")
I certainly don’t think it is a biological thing. It is cultural thing. My wife is a Panamanian and she couldn’t swim until I taught her. Every year here I host my birthday party at the pool. Last year the Filipinos were all excited to see one of their number in the pool. (For that matter, a buddy of mine is a waterman on the Eastern Shore of Maryland, and he cannot swim either. I guess he would learn if he fell off the boat.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/relatively-few-black-people-can-swim-what/241487.md?page=3)