# Religion - A place to throw it all away? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 22, 2006, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203 "2006-12-22T08:54:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/1 "2006-12-22T08:54:16Z")
Is religion just a place to throw any rationality. evidence based belief, and the scientific method? Is religion just a compartment where you are willing to throw it all away? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/2 "2006-12-22T08:59:23Z")
Is Great Debates just a dumping ground for [failed rants](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=401175)? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/3 "2006-12-22T09:06:47Z")
[QUOTE=Ammonius Saccus] Is religion just a place to throw any rationality. evidence based belief, and the scientific method? [/QUOTE] No > [@](#): > > Is religion just a compartment where you are willing to throw it all away? Not really. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/4 "2006-12-22T09:08:29Z")
Hey, and more importantly, welcome back Lib! ---
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/5 "2006-12-22T09:08:36Z")
Can you give a rational evidence based defense of specific religious beliefs using the scientific method? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/6 "2006-12-22T09:13:22Z")
[QUOTE=Ammonius Saccus] Can you give a rational evidence based defense of specific religious beliefs using the scientific method? [/QUOTE] Is life really all about that and nothing more? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/7 "2006-12-22T09:15:48Z")
And can you give a rational evidence based defense - using the scientific method - of your decision to get blind drunk? If not, why did you do it? ---
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/8 "2006-12-22T09:18:53Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Is life really all about that and nothing more? [/QUOTE] Can you establish another method for justifying beliefs? ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/9 "2006-12-22T09:19:03Z")
[QUOTE=Liberal] Is Great Debates just a dumping ground for [failed rants](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=401175)? [/QUOTE] **Moderator’s Note:** Let’s keep the Pit out of Great Debates, please. ---
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/10 "2006-12-22T09:20:10Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] And can you give a rational evidence based defense - using the scientific method - of your decision to get blind drunk? If not, why did you do it? [/QUOTE] Why should I? Personal goals are differnt from statements about reality. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/11 "2006-12-22T09:26:09Z")
[QUOTE=Ammonius Saccus] Why should I? Personal goals are differnt from statements about reality. [/QUOTE] I don’t see why I should accept this as true just because you say it, but please elaborate. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/12 "2006-12-22T09:27:51Z")
[QUOTE=Ammonius Saccus] Why should I? Personal goals are differnt from statements about reality. [/QUOTE] Why? Are your personal goals not real? Are you unable to defend your personal goals scientifically? That sounds a tad irrational. ---
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/13 "2006-12-22T09:37:21Z")
[QUOTE=tomndebb] Why? Are your personal goals not real? Are you unable to defend your personal goals scientifically? That sounds a tad irrational. [/QUOTE] My personal goals are by their very nature subjective. It is like being in love. You are either are or you are not. That question is entirely an agent question. It is about my specific viewpoint. The question of whether the waifer is changed into the flesh of God is different. It should be subjected to a non-agent viewpoint. Any viewpoint should show it actually changed into the flesh of God regrdless of desire. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/14 "2006-12-22T09:38:40Z")
[QUOTE=Ammonius Saccus] Any viewpoint should show it actually changed into the flesh of God regrdless of desire. [/QUOTE] Why? ---
**Author:** ![Ammonius\_Saccus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3bc359/32.png) [@Ammonius\_Saccus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ammonius_Saccus)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/15 "2006-12-22T09:43:37Z")
[QUOTE=tomndebb] Why? [/QUOTE] Because that is the claim. It is not a Jamesian view about the pragmatic truth of the change. Catholics hold that it actually changes into the body of God. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/16 "2006-12-22T09:50:24Z")
Aside from seriously misunderstanding what the RCC actually says (as I have pointed out in several threads, most recently in your first rant this evening, since moved to the **Pit** ), you have still failed to explain why any claim must show a particular event. Your statement regarding the claim made is in error, and you have provided no reason WHY anyone who is speaking outside your (limited) frame of reference should establish anything inside your frame of reference. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/17 "2006-12-22T09:58:31Z")
[QUOTE=MEBuckner] **Moderator’s Note:** Let’s keep the Pit out of Great Debates, please. [/QUOTE] Yes, let’s. So why is this still here? What argument did the OP formulate? When in Great Debates did we begin personalizing insults about irrationality into questions with second person pronouns? Then again, why am I bothering to appeal to reason? I’ll stay away from your "Great Debates’. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/18 "2006-12-22T12:18:27Z")
Does religion compel one to take personal offense at any general criticism of religion? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/19 "2006-12-22T12:21:53Z")
Perhaps. Doesn’t membership of any group do that? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2006, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203/20 "2006-12-22T13:20:44Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Perhaps. Doesn’t membership of any group do that? [/QUOTE] Justifiably? Not in my opinion, no. Certainly not enough to motivate someone to post after months of hiatus only to say that they aren’t going to come back any more. Also, if this is the place for witnessing, shouldn’t it also be the place for the other end of the witnessing spectrum? Or are evidence-free expositions on religion only okay if they are in favor of religion? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religion-a-place-to-throw-it-all-away/385203.md?page=2)