# Religious, but non-Islamic, terrorist organizations **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 16, 2014, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913 "2014-06-16T16:35:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/21 "2014-06-17T01:08:54Z")
[Aum Shinrikyo](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aum_Shinrikyo) is most definitely a religious and was certainly once a terrorist organisation. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/22 "2014-06-17T01:58:00Z")
I think the problems here are that, first of all, “terrorist” is a terribly loaded term (as we’ve already seen in this thread) and whether we label a particular group “terrorist” or not may depend more on _our_ position/ideology/values than on theirs. Secondly, again as we have already seen in this thread, the mere fact that members of a particular group are identified by religion, and they embrace their religious identity, doesn’t mean that they adopt whatever tactics they adopt because of their religion. Right now, there is signficant conflict/tension between the Islamic world and the Christian/postchristian/secular west. And the dynamics of that conflict mean that militants on the Islamic side have more reason to adopt terrorist tactics than militants on the other side. (And _our_ position is such that we’re more likely to label the tactics they adopt as “terrorist”). None of this means, though, that they adopt the tactics they adopt _because they’re Muslims_. The wars of religion in Europe were pretty terrifying, but it would be anachronistic to label anything that went on there as “terrorism” (though, if the same things were done today, some of them would undoubtedly be called “terrorist”). Terror as a named political strategy dates from the French Revolution, and of course also from that time we in the West have not generally identified ourselves religiously in our political conflicts. Croats and Serbs may be of different Christian denominations, and this, together with the use of the Latin and Cyrillic alphabets, may be the most obvious distinctions between them, but the war in former Yugoslavia was not analysed in those terms, by the participants or anyone else. But in some other parts of the world there is still a strong tradition of different communities identifying themselves by religion or denomination, and this is particularly strong in the Middle East. Where terrorism is deployed in that context, its easy to link it with religion, because the participants in the conflict explicitly identify themselves religiously. But this isn’t just an Islamic thing; it’s predominantly Islamic, because of the demographics of the region, but you have Christian-identified groups in Lebanon, a Jewish-identified state in Israel, etc. But I don’t think that the resort to terrorism by, say, Al-Qaeda tells us any more about Islam than the tactics of the Israeli state necessarily tell us about Judaism. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/23 "2014-06-17T04:07:50Z")
Buddhist organizations (and mobs) have been carrying out a lot [of](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Burma_anti-Muslim_riots) [violence](http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/unspeakable-violence-against-muslims-in-burma/2014/04/03/fce8b3de-b466-11e3-b899-20667de76985_story.html) against Muslims in Myanmar. ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/24 "2014-06-17T04:25:26Z")
India has seen somewhat recent Hindu on Christian terrorism, such as [this incident](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/india/3229253/India-asked-to-investigate-Hindu-massacre-of-Christians.html). As jovan pointed out, Aum Shinrikyo is a religion that sarin gassed a bunch of Japanese subway users. Without getting into GD territory, many of Israel’s enemies consider their security forces Jewish terrorist organizations. Scientologists don’t typically resort to violence, but they do use a lot of coercion, blackmail, and legal threats against their religious enemies (read: every sane person). There’s been semi-recent [Buddhist violence on other religious groups](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhism_and_violence) in Asia. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/25 "2014-06-17T12:59:44Z")
> [@Batistuta](#): > > In its origins ETA was somewhat linked to the Catholic church in the Basque Country, although of course it can’t be classed as a ‘religious organisation’. > > Mahatma Gandhi was killed by an extremist Hindu organisation, and I know that Indira Gandhi was killed by Sikhs but I’m not sure how big the religious aspect was to her assassination. Indira Gandhi was killed in retaliation for launching a raid on the Sikh Golden Temple to root out some militants who were holed up in the complex. The militants themselves were led by a secessionist preacher named Bhindranwale, who had said things like ‘anyone who disrespects [our Holy Book] needs to be killed’, so it seems fair to say the actual crisis was religiously inspired. The raid itself killed a lot of people and sparked a lot of outrage among critics of Indira, so I’m not sure how much religion specifically played a role in the motivations of her assassins. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/26 "2014-06-17T13:46:20Z")
Kind of surprised we got this far without a mention of [Christian Identity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Identity) and the [Patriot movement](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_movement). They (or those espousing largely similar beliefs) have carried out (mostly low level) domestic terrorism since the early eighties (though they’ve been a bit quieter since [the millennium thing](http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps3578/www.fbi.gov/library/megiddo/megiddo.pdf) sputtered.) ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/27 "2014-06-17T13:48:31Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Kind of surprised we got this far without a mention of [Christian Identity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Identity) and the [Patriot movement](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_movement). They (or those espousing largely similar beliefs) have carried out (mostly low level) domestic terrorism since the early eighties (though they’ve been a bit quieter since [the millennium thing](http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps3578/www.fbi.gov/library/megiddo/megiddo.pdf) sputtered.) Well, kind of: > [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > [The Covenant, The Sword, and the Arm of the Lord](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Covenant,_The_Sword,_and_the_Arm_of_the_Lord): > [@](#): > > The Covenant, the Sword, and the Arm of the Lord (initialized CSA) was a far right political organization dedicated to Christian Identity and survivalism that was active in the United States in the 1970s and 1980s. CSA developed from a Baptist congregation called the Zarephath-Horeb Community Church, founded in 1971 in the small community of Elijah in southern Missouri. Over time, Zarephath-Horeb evolved into an extremist paramilitary organization rechristened CSA, which the Federal Bureau of Investigations (FBI) identified in 1985 as the second-most dangerous domestic terrorist organization at the time.[citation needed] CSA operated a large compound in northern Arkansas called the Farm. In April 1985, law enforcement officers investigating the group for weapons violations and terrorist acts carried out a siege against the compound. After a peaceful resolution, officers arrested and convicted CSA’s top leaders, and the organization soon dissolved ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/28 "2014-06-17T14:45:41Z")
> [@Shoeless](#): > > What about anti-abortion fanatics in the U.S., like the guy who murdered George Tiller? I would consider their actions (Christian) religion based and also terroristic to some degree. > [@LouisMasure](#): > > Really ?! Protesting is terrorism now ? In that case most demonstrations, of any nature, are terrorism as they always are made to show force in order to push a group to change its position. > [@appleciders](#): > > While I think you could realistically call them terrorists, they don’t really ever seem to be acting on behalf of an organized group, but rather are acting on their own. The OP was asking specifically about religious terrorist _organizations_, and I don’t see an organization here. > > I’d also draw a distinction between people who murder doctors who provide abortions and people who bomb or burn abortion clinics. I’m not aware of any abortion clinic arsons or bombings that killed anyone, so I’d put people who do that on par with eco-terrorists who cause property damage but don’t actually physically injure anyone directly, or at least strive not to do so. I challenge anyone to stand outside a women’s health center than provides abortion for one day and not call that terrorism. I’ve seen those protestors harass women, screaming and putting their hands on them, and chasing them down the street like they were dogs. They will not listen to NO. When you tell a couple and their two little daughters going into a clinic “Don’t go in there. They murder babies in there,” you have crossed a line. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/29 "2014-06-17T15:16:46Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > I challenge anyone to stand outside a women’s health center than provides abortion for one day and not call that terrorism. I’ve seen those protestors harass women, screaming and putting their hands on them, and chasing them down the street like they were dogs. They will not listen to NO. Way to generalize, there. I wonder if you would accept the same sorts of generalizations about other political groups. > [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > When you tell a couple and their two little daughters going into a clinic “Don’t go in there. They murder babies in there,” you have crossed a line. So, expressing an opinion is now ‘terrorism’ to you? An opinion that’s actually correct, in this case? I think ‘terrorism’ is already a wildly overused word (in one of these other threads someone else was claiming that the Viet Cong were terrorists, which I think is pretty absurd), we _really_ don’t need to stretch it beyond any logical meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2014, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/30 "2014-06-17T15:22:40Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Well, kind of: Oops. > [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > When you tell a couple and their two little daughters going into a clinic “Don’t go in there. They murder babies in there,” you have crossed a line. “Terrorism” =/= saying horrible things. I find most anti-abortion protestors abhorrent but they’re simply not terrorists. The Tiller people obviously are, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Namkcalb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c89c15/32.png) [@Namkcalb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Namkcalb)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/31 "2014-06-18T00:09:15Z")
Here’s a man bites dog example. The Fundamentalist Baptist [Tripura Liberation Front](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Liberation_Front_of_Tripura) have engaged in a campaign of mass-kidnappings, murders, blackmail and gang-rapes in their quest for a Christian theocracy. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/32 "2014-06-18T14:53:32Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > I disagree, or at least, I think they’re about as religious as Al Qaeda. It’s not an accident that the KKK’s trademark is a burning cross; it’s a symbol of faith, and was often accompanied by hymns and prayers. They accept only Protestant Christians the same way that Al Qaeda accepts only Sunni Muslims. > > I’m not aware of any religious terrorist organization that doesn’t also have significant political demands. Bin Laden’s [Open Letter to America](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/nov/24/theobserver), laying out his reasons for the 9/11 attacks, has at least as many political demands as religious ones. The IRA likewise has primarily political goals, as do the various Protestant organizations that they oppose. The Tamil Tigers are primarily Hindu, and the government that they oppose (and accuse of genocide) is primarily Buddhist. There was a U.S. funded and trained Buddhist terrorist insurgency in Tibet for quite some time after the Chinese invasion. The burning of crosses was a trademark of the second Klan which could be considered a religious organization though it was not overtly so. The crosses were meant to recall the Cross of St Andrew which was the national symbol of Scotland. So the cross was a symbol of ethnic nationalism and not a religious one in the way they were using it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/33 "2014-06-18T15:38:19Z")
The crosses were burned because they were in Birth of a Nation (because they were in _The Clansman_.) It was only an allusion to Scottish history by accident, really. The Klan, and the Second Era Klan in particular, has always been a Protestant organization espousing a worldview based on specific Christian beliefs (though of course those beliefs may not be consistent with other Christian teaching.) ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2014, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/34 "2014-06-18T17:49:32Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > I challenge anyone to stand outside a women’s health center than provides abortion for one day and not call that terrorism. I’ve seen those protestors harass women, screaming and putting their hands on them, and chasing them down the street like they were dogs. They will not listen to NO. > > When you tell a couple and their two little daughters going into a clinic “Don’t go in there. They murder babies in there,” you have crossed a line. You can tell people whatever you want, and it’s free speech, not a crime. The mere act of touching, in a way that seems threatening or could be taken as such (i.e. by screaming and angry looking people) is assault and a crime. Blocking your way is a minor crime. The uttering of threats is a crime IIRC IANAL I think it has to be specific - “you’ll burn in hell!” is not a threat, “We’ll kill you like you killed your baby!” is a threat. Protestors committing crimes are, in a way, terrorists - certainly they are intimidating some of the general public, which seems to be a reasonable definition of terrorism. If the overall actions of the protestors seem to be more about intimidation than information, I would certainly classify that as a form of terrorism. Simply expressing a point of view is not. Most of the protests I’ve seen, in front of hospitals, were generally of the peaceful sort- simply offensive for the message and placards… but then I didn’t stop to see what they did, and at least in a hospital, the majority of traffic in and out is not for abortions so they wouldn’t know who to target. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/35 "2014-06-19T14:42:33Z")
Stand outside a women’s health center that provides abortions. They are trying to terrorize women into not having abortions. They totally ignore the word NO. On Saturdays, there have to be people to escort the women into the center. How terrorizing is that? ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/36 "2014-06-19T16:01:22Z")
Terrorist organizations tend to arise among people who believe (rightly or wrongly) their way of life is threatened or under attack and a conventional defense seems futile. Follow the dots. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/37 "2014-06-19T17:45:47Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Stand outside a women’s health center that provides abortions. They are trying to terrorize women into not having abortions. They totally ignore the word NO. On Saturdays, there have to be people to escort the women into the center. How terrorizing is that? Hmmm… Most abortions in Canada (from cursory reading of daily news) happen in hospitals, along with every procedure in the book. Since health care is government provided, under the “equal” clause it should be available to everyone. The “medical necessity” issue died with the end (unconstitutionality) of laws restricting abortion, so like any procedure it is available almost everywhere paid for by the government. Animated protests are pretty futile, you’d be ticking off everyone needing medical care or visiting a patient. The few protests I see driving by the hospitals from time to time are sad old men and post-menopausal women, a few families than dragged along their kids (sad), quietly parading the sidewalk. Rarely more than a dozen people at these sort of protests, rarely last more than a week, usually an outing by one of the local fundamentalist churches. Maybe it’s different at more central hospitals. What happens in the USA often amazes me. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/38 "2014-06-19T18:12:47Z")
Most late-term abortions are performed in hospitals. I would be surprised if most abortions _generally_ were performed in hospitals. Until some point (around the end of the first trimester?) abortions are chemically induced and require no invasive procedures at all, so an outpatient clinic is the logical place to have them. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/39 "2014-06-19T18:33:23Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Most late-term abortions are performed in hospitals. I would be surprised if most abortions _generally_ were performed in hospitals. Until some point (around the end of the first trimester?) abortions are chemically induced and require no invasive procedures at all, so an outpatient clinic is the logical place to have them. I think the problem in Canada is a side effect of the last gasp of the anti-abortion crowd. Dr. Henry Morgentaler went on a crusade to bring abortion on demand to Canada by opening clinics in several provinces. The reactionary crowd countered with “this procedure can only be performed in hospitals” regulations, where it was limited because a committee of doctors decided whether the health of the patient warranted the procedure. Then the supreme court here said the law was unconstitutional, since the decisions of the committees (and availability or procedures) had little to do with patient need and more to do with hospital administrations’ prejudices. Members of parliament were unable to compromise on an acceptable law, so there has not been one restricting abortion since then. So procedures are provided n hospitals, and if the province offers abortions for any reason whatever, their regulations mean the availability has to be fair and open to all women. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2014, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913/40 "2014-06-19T19:49:18Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > The burning of crosses was a trademark of the second Klan which could be considered a religious organization though it was not overtly so. The crosses were meant to recall the Cross of St Andrew which was the national symbol of Scotland. So the cross was a symbol of ethnic nationalism and not a religious one in the way they were using it. The [crosses as burned by the KKK](http://filipspagnoli.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/cross-burning-at-nighttime-ku-klux-klan-kkk-rally.jpg) bear no resemblance to a [St Andrews cross](http://www.ravenswoodleather.com/index.php?p=product&id=508) (which is in any case, itself a religious symbol). Anyway, are you really trying to imply that the KKK was an organization specifically for people of Scottish descent? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-but-non-islamic-terrorist-organizations/690913.md?page=3)