# Religious sect discovered living in underground bunker **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 9, 2012, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947 "2012-08-09T13:05:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/1 "2012-08-09T13:05:37Z")
In Tatarstan, Russia, a breakaway Muslim sect following a a man who styled himself as the new prophet has been [discovered](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-19180554) living in catacomb cells in an eight-level underground structure. Most members never left the building, and the 19 children among them had rarely seen the outside world. The leader deemed himself a prophet after seeing trolley sparks in the 1960s and interpreting them as divine light. Russia being Russia, the sect’s elders have been criminally charged with “arbitrariness.” ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/2 "2012-08-09T16:18:08Z")
Fuck “outside world.” That article said those kids had never seen _ **a doctor.** _ ---
**Author:** ![Palo\_Verde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/65b543/32.png) [@Palo\_Verde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Palo_Verde)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/3 "2012-08-09T16:34:48Z")
Trying to imagine a world in which “arbitrariness” is a crime. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/4 "2012-08-09T16:51:48Z")
“Arbitrariness” is probably just an English translation of an untranslatable Russian term, like “hooliganism.” The latter is a Russian charge similar to disturbing the peace in the US, with the added meaning of “being disrespectful to the ruling authorities.” “Arbitrariness” probably has a similar legal definition that a straight translation of the word misrepresents. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/5 "2012-08-09T16:52:06Z")
I have a hard time picturing how they dug out eight floors of that underground warren. Did the original house sit atop a natural cave, like Wayne Manor? > [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > Trying to imagine a world in which “arbitrariness” is a crime. Read the complaint threads in ATMB. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/6 "2012-08-09T16:55:24Z")
From the description, I’d say “anarchy” is a better translation; though I can see why a journalist might want to avoid such a controversial word. Poor kids. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/7 "2012-08-09T17:00:00Z")
According to the article: “The crime of arbitrariness is defined as “unauthorised commission of actions contrary to the order presented by a law or any other normative legal act” and is punishable by up to five years in prison.” I wonder if there’s a better translation of the actual Russian word. In the US they’d be hit with a great number of individual zoning, regulation, and municipal ordinance violations. Especially since they had no permits. It sounds like “arbitrariness” is a catchall for “yeah, each one of these would be something small by itself, but this wasn’t a mistake and it wasn’t ignorance, these guys just said ‘Fuck the regs’ and went nuts.” Would “passive anarchy” be a possible way of describing the crime? ETA: Sigh. Should have previewed. ---
**Author:** ![Number](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/number/32/242_2.png) [@Number](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Number)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/8 "2012-08-09T22:39:02Z")
> [@Palo\_Verde](#): > > Trying to imagine a world in which “arbitrariness” is a crime. Eh, you know, it is when they feel like it. ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/9 "2012-08-09T23:19:43Z")
I would add “capriciousness”. And perhaps something about an “abandoned and malignant heart”. ---
**Author:** ![Autolycus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/22d042/32.png) [@Autolycus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Autolycus)\ **Post date:** [August 9, 2012, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/10 "2012-08-09T23:54:40Z")
Out of all the religions for one to declare themself to be the new prophet, Islam has to be one the worst choices. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/11 "2012-08-10T03:18:07Z")
This is the worst crazy sect I’ve ever been in. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/12 "2012-08-10T03:55:40Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > This is the worst crazy sect I’ve ever been in. I gave up crazy sects when I got married. ---
**Author:** ![flodnak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/838e76/32.png) [@flodnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flodnak)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/13 "2012-08-10T08:07:10Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > I have a hard time picturing how they dug out eight floors of that underground warren. VERY BAD THOUGHT ALERT: They got some DIY tips from Josef Fritzl. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 8:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/14 "2012-08-10T08:12:00Z")
> [@flodnak](#): > > VERY BAD THOUGHT ALERT: They got some DIY tips from Josef Fritzl. Daaaaaaamn! :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 10, 2012, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/religious-sect-discovered-living-in-underground-bunker/630947/15 "2012-08-10T10:18:25Z")
[A picture of their prophet.](http://www.godisageek.com/wp-content/uploads/Fallout-Vault-Boy1.jpg)