# Replacing Hot Water Heater. Experiences? Suggestions? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 26, 2017, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833 "2017-02-26T16:03:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/21 "2017-02-27T03:01:14Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > Slight tangent: I am highly considering adding a hot water circulating pump at the same time (we are in CA and looking to save water). Any opinions on those? Good idea. Just make sure you get one with a timer that you can set so it goes off at night. And make sure any hot water plumbing lines in the crawl space or attic are insulated. You will save water, but expend a bit more on gas. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/22 "2017-02-27T04:05:07Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Just because you need a permit doesn’t mean you can’t DIY. You just have to pass the inspection for code compliance. The inspector will not even know who did the installation. I know from experience that if there isn’t a St. Louis County licensed plumber’s name on the job, is not going to pass. This was 25 years ago and I suspect it’s not different now. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/23 "2017-02-27T04:07:18Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > Good info in this thread. We are going to replace our 18 year old water heater soon. There are no problems with it, but it’s age is prompting me. It is on a pedestal in our garage so no issues with replacing it with the same thing. Copper lines - so will look into what **MikeG** says. > > Slight tangent: I am highly considering adding a hot water circulating pump at the same time (we are in CA and looking to save water). Any opinions on those? I have one installed in my master bath controlled with a button. It only runs when the button is activated. Shuts off when the hot water gets to the pump. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/24 "2017-02-27T04:20:37Z")
> [@GaryM](#): > > I know from experience that if there isn’t a St. Louis County licensed plumber’s name on the job, is not going to pass. This was 25 years ago and I suspect it’s not different now. I’m not sure where the OP lives, but note that even in the [city of St Louis](https://www.stlouis-mo.gov/government/departments/public-safety/building/permits/plumbing-permits.cfm), you can DIY. My experience is in CA. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/25 "2017-02-27T04:47:07Z")
New gas hot water heaters require better venting then the old ones. There’s a sensor that keeps them from lighting the burner. I had to get the vent in my closet door enlarged. ---
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/26 "2017-02-27T09:33:52Z")
We’re renting, so can’t speak to the cost. But we adore our on-demand tankless water heater. It takes a little longer for the water to heat up than a traditional water heater, but it will pump out hot water all day long. It’s an incredible luxury to never run out of hot water. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/27 "2017-02-27T17:36:59Z")
> [@Rachellelogram](#): > > We’re renting, so can’t speak to the cost. But we adore our on-demand tankless water heater. It takes a little longer for the water to heat up than a traditional water heater, but it will pump out hot water all day long. It’s an incredible luxury to never run out of hot water. Unexpected drawback: at our office, which is modern but a tad funky around the edges because the owner is a contractor who does all his own work (when he has time) and is from an old town family, so things like inspections are pretty cursory… the water went off. Someone called it in. Apparently he just flipped the valve or whatever, because he never looked in the shared second-floor bathroom after doing so. Someone had left the hot water tap open, and so immediately hot water began gushing out. Since it’s apparently a tankless system, the hot water never ran out. The hot water ran for something like 24 hours. The upstairs hall was… foggy on Monday morning. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/28 "2017-02-27T19:23:10Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Just because you need a permit doesn’t mean you can’t DIY. You just have to pass the inspection for code compliance. The inspector will not even know who did the installation. This is not necessarily true in a lot of jurisdictions. In many places, any appliance that uses gas must be installed by a licensed plumber/gasfitter and inspected, and homeowner permitting is not allowed. Around here, many stores won’t even deliver a gas appliance until you give them a license number for whoever will install it. (But I have a feeling that may be more of a racket to get you to use their installers than an actual legal requirement.) ---
**Author:** ![ethelbert](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/958977/32.png) [@ethelbert](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ethelbert)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2017, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/29 "2017-02-27T22:37:05Z")
OP here. It turns out I had a lot less choice than I thought I had. I originally wanted to buy a Rheem with a 12 year warranty (it is self cleaning and has a larger anode). The installer said it would not fit without dismantling the furnace (he had the Rheem, so he wasn’t trying to steer me away). He showed me all the measurements and I had to agree. The only way I could have had a similar 12 year water heater was to downgrade from 40 to 30 gallons (I am not sure this was strictly true, but it was true from the limited options this installer had). I looked around myself and could not find one that would fit. MikeG points out above that newer water heaters are wider because of new regulations. I guess the 12 year ones are wider still. What I ended up with was the updated model of the one I had (A.O. Smith). It is basically at the bottom of their line, but all the better ones would not fit. It also appeared that the venting for the old heater was only 3" while the code is 4". That cost me a few bucks. They are installing it right now. I will let you know how that goes. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2017, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/30 "2017-02-28T14:52:32Z")
> [@ethelbert](#): > > It is basically at the bottom of their line, but all the better ones would not fit. Any hot water heater is better than none. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2017, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/31 "2017-02-28T19:00:27Z")
Hot water doesn’t need heating. ---
**Author:** ![48Willys](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/db5fbb/32.png) [@48Willys](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/48Willys)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2017, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/32 "2017-02-28T20:38:09Z")
> [@Common\_Tater](#): > > Hot water doesn’t need heating. That depends on your definition of hot water. My cousin’s water heater temperature is set very low so that his kids do not scald themselves. It is not hot enough for either the laundry washing machine, nor the dishwasher to clean their cloths & dishes. IMHO, He is doing a disservice to his kids. They used to think that the hot water anywhere is not going to scald them. Several years ago, they learned different at my house. He wants me to lower my heaters temperature to match his. I do not see an advantage to his thinking. Keep in mind that his kids are 14 & 18 years old. If they can not figure out how to adjust the temperature of the water by mixing in cold water by now, they never will. Compliments of mean uncle 48, they do know how to do this. To recap, my cousins definition of hot water is not mine. To make bad instant coffee at his house, I have to heat the hot water at his house in the microwave. In some cases, you do need to heat “hot” water. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2017, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/33 "2017-02-28T22:46:25Z")
Is there any way the OP can install a solar heater? ---
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2017, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/34 "2017-02-28T22:50:34Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Is there any way the OP can install a solar heater? Turns out, those are obsolete. It’s cheaper to buy a hybrid electric hot water heater and install PV panels on the roof. A hybrid hot water heater uses a heat pump (an air conditioner running in reverse) to heat the water for about 1/3 the electricity of a regular electric heater. The reason this combination is cheaper is simply production volume. PV panels are produced in vast numbers, while solar hot water tubes are produced in smaller quantities. If you total up the costs, it’s cheaper. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/35 "2017-03-01T07:29:27Z")
> [@SamuelA](#): > > Turns out, those are obsolete. Huh. Someone should tell my landlords that - they just installed one for me last week. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/36 "2017-03-01T09:00:29Z")
> [@ethelbert](#): > > One issue with DIY is the placement of the heater. It is in a very tight space (condo, remember?). I am too old to be contorting myself like that, and getting the old one out and the new one in is a two man job. > > Also, my version of DIY generally entails doing it wrong the first time ("Oh, that’s how I should have done it!). I don’t think that’s appropriate when gas is involved. You’ve answered you’re own question. If you aren’t familiar with working with gas appliances you could find yourself making a bad mistake. Wrestling tanks around is a 2 person job and gas connections have to be leak free. Chances are you aren’t going to find a new tank that has the connection at the same height so you will have to make up new fittings or go to flexible tubing. You’ll have to check with building codes as to what you can install. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/37 "2017-03-01T11:45:43Z")
> [@48Willys](#): > > My cousin’s water heater temperature is set very low so that his kids do not scald themselves. It is not hot enough for either the laundry washing machine, nor the dishwasher to clean their cloths & dishes. :dubious: A good-quality laundry detergent will clean clothes perfectly well using cold water. And a dishwasher has its own heating element. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/38 "2017-03-01T12:31:40Z")
I live in California. What is this water that you speak of? 🙂 My 12 year old water heater is dying. Time to swap it out. Thanks for the good info in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/39 "2017-03-01T20:29:19Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > 🙂 My 12 year old water heater is dying. Time to swap it out. Thanks for the good info in this thread. You might consider the Takagi tankless water heaters. They have really, really high ratings on Amazon and are a little over $500. Easier to install and work with than the old style - though you’d need a new flue, probably. These new heaters demand an outside air intake. In California, natural gas rates are probably high enough that you come out ahead with tankless, plus there might still be some local rebates. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2017, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833/40 "2017-03-01T23:20:12Z")
Not to mention that the delta T between the inlet and outlet water will make it worthwhile. I know several people in my area that have tried tankless heaters and the mean inlet water temp (roughly 4C) makes it a tough slog for them to generate sufficient heat. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-hot-water-heater-experiences-suggestions/780833.md?page=3)