# Replacing pseudoephedrine **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 1, 2006, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625 "2006-03-01T16:30:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/1 "2006-03-01T16:30:20Z")
Sudafed can be used to make meth, which is bad. There is talk of replacing the pseudoepinephrine ingredient, which is necessary for meth, with phenylephrine. My understanding is that it performs just as well as pseudoepinephrine, and cannot be used to maufacture meth. Is this true? Are there other problems with phenylephrine? ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/2 "2006-03-01T17:45:29Z")
> [@Inner Stickler](#): > > There is talk of replacing the pseudoepinephrine ingredient Sorry, don’t know the answer to your question, but it’s pseudoephedrine. There is such a thing as pseudoepinephrine but pseudoephedrine is what’s in Sudafed and is what’s used for meth. ---
**Author:** ![cher3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/da6949/32.png) [@cher3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cher3)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/3 "2006-03-01T17:58:32Z")
I don’t know if it can be used to make meth, but replacement of pseudoephedrine has gone considerably beyond “talk” here in California. I was in Target this weekend and there wasn’t a single product of that type that contained anything other than phenylephrine. I don’t know how similar they are. I guess I’ll find out when I have my next sinus headache. ---
**Author:** ![Honey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/honey/32/5074_2.png) [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/4 "2006-03-01T18:09:03Z")
> [@cher3](#): > > I don’t know if it can be used to make meth, but replacement of pseudoephedrine has gone considerably beyond “talk” here in California. I was in Target this weekend and there wasn’t a single product of that type that contained anything other than phenylephrine. I don’t know how similar they are. I guess I’ll find out when I have my next sinus headache. Here in NY, it’s been replaced in NyQuil. The basic/store brand of NyQuil hasn’t been altered though. ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/5 "2006-03-01T18:27:38Z")
Phenylephrine is in the brand Sudafed PE™. It seems to be too new to find anything other that sales sites for it. :dubious: The active ingredient in Sudafed™ is Pseudoephedrine Hydrochloride. ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/6 "2006-03-01T18:35:55Z")
I did find this [news article](http://www.semissourian.com/story.html%24rec=153973) about it. > [@](#): > > Only pharmacies would be able to sell such drugs, and customers would have to show identification and sign for them. Restricting the pills would make virtually inaccessible the key ingredient for making methamphetamine. > > Liquid and gel-cap forms of Sudafed would not be restricted because law enforcement officers believe it is not as easy to extract pseudoephedrine from those forms of cold medications. > > Pfizer has no plans to pull regular Sudafed pills off the market, but is offering Sudafed PE as another choice. ---
**Author:** ![cher3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/da6949/32.png) [@cher3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cher3)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/7 "2006-03-01T18:38:04Z")
**picunurse** , that’s what they were selling at Target last Saturday. There was no regular Sudafed on the shelves and even the “take this card to the Pharmacy” cards were for Sudafed PE. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/8 "2006-03-01T18:48:44Z")
I had a pit thread about restrictions of Sudafed awhile back. IIRC, QtM suggested that phenylephrine was not as effective…hopefully he’ll pop in to verify that or fix my ailing memory. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/9 "2006-03-01T18:50:03Z")
Phenylephrine does not work NEARLY as well as pseudoepinephrine for me, (last time I tried it, my sinuses didn’t even drain halfway, my ears were still plugged and I couldn’t really hear) and I have to take the stuff every day to keep my sinuses drained, as a preventative measure against sinus/ear infections. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/10 "2006-03-01T18:55:05Z")
A quick WiKi > **[Pseudoephedrine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sudafed)** > > Pseudoephedrine (PSE) is a sympathomimetic drug of the phenethylamine and amphetamine chemical classes. It may be used as a nasal/sinus decongestant, as a stimulant, or as a wakefulness-promoting agent in higher doses. > It was first characterized in 1889, by the German chemists Ladenburg and Oelschlägel, who used a sample that had been isolated from Ephedra vulgaris by the Merck pharmaceutical corporation of Darmstadt, Germany. The salts pseudoephedrine hydrochloride and pseudoephedrine sulfate ... > [@](#): > > According to the L. Hendeles of the University of Florida, “Phenylpropanolamine, pseudoephedrine, and phenylephrine are the most common decongestants. Although all are sympathomimetic amines, their efficacy varies. In particular, phenylephrine is subject to first-pass metabolism and therefore is not bioavailable in currently recommended doses.”[1] and from a cite linked from wikipedia > **[Selecting a decongestant - PubMed](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7507590/?dopt=Citation)** > > Antihistamines and decongestants often are used interchangeably and in combination for a variety of upper respiratory illnesses ranging from allergic rhinitis to the common cold; yet, these two classes of drugs have distinct therapeutic actions. When... > [@](#): > > In addition, phenylpropanolamine and pseudoephedrine, but not phenylephrine, are effective decongestants. ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/11 "2006-03-01T20:00:14Z")
Phenylephrine doesn’t work worth beans for me; if they all switch to it I think am doomed to not breathing for however long my stuffiness persists. They’re starting a large study now, but no results: [http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct/gui/show/NCT00276016;jsessionid=82F17235EDAC08AD8ADB486577035B3E?order=8](http://www.clinicaltrials.gov/ct/gui/show/NCT00276016;jsessionid=82F17235EDAC08AD8ADB486577035B3E?order=8) ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/12 "2006-03-01T20:29:40Z")
For years, I was taking Sudafed every 4 hours, like clockwork. I can still get it, but I’d have to wait in line for 15 minutes, show ID, and sign for it. Then the druggist looks at me like I’m a junkie. I switched to the new “feenafed.” Then, on the advice of a coupla Dopers, I bought a Neti Pot. I’ve been using it for about 3 weeks, and I can breathe again, like never before. Once in the morning, and sometimes again later in the evening, and I can go for days without any little red pills at all. It looks sorta like the head of a golf driver with a little tapered spout off one end. I fill it with about 6 oz. of warm water, mix in non-iodized salt from a teensy 125 cc. measure, and pour it through my nose. I tilt my head over to one side so one nostril is directly above the other, then I put the spout in the upper nostril. The water runs in one side and out the open nostril. After blowing my nose, (a lot of stuff comes out) I fill it up again and do the other side. It’s not nearly as icky as it sounds, and it sure beats having your head stopped up all day. I’m so clear and open now, I can exercise while breathing only through my nose. In all my 56 years, I could never do that. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/13 "2006-03-01T20:32:12Z")
So we are suffering because some people make meth? Goddamn. ---
**Author:** ![cruel\_butterfly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5daacb/32.png) [@cruel\_butterfly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cruel_butterfly)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2006, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/14 "2006-03-01T20:40:01Z")
> [@cher3](#): > > **picunurse** , that’s what they were selling at Target last Saturday. There was no regular Sudafed on the shelves and even the “take this card to the Pharmacy” cards were for Sudafed PE. in my local Walmart, there are “take to pharmacy” cards, but only for name brands. If you want to buy the generic equivalent (_with_ pseudoephedrine!), you can take the box right off the shelf. :dubious: :smack: ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/15 "2006-03-02T01:16:39Z")
Anecdotal evidence: the Sudafed PE and all the phenylephrine don’t work for beans for me. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/16 "2006-03-02T02:30:20Z")
You could still buy it, you’d just have a harder time finding it in a store. Besides there are other drugs aside from ephedrine, pseudoephedrine and phenylephrine for decongestion. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/17 "2006-03-02T02:40:34Z")
:smack: **CookingWithGas** , thanks. That explains why my google-fu was even worse than usual.How many people have heard me say pseudoepinephrine?! So, to summarize, phenylephrine doesn’t always work as well for some people and while meth production would go down, congestion and general ire would rise. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![neutron\_star](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/51bf81/32.png) [@neutron\_star](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neutron_star)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/18 "2006-03-02T04:03:25Z")
According to a recent (2/14/06) episode of Frontline, meth production in the U.S. already _is_ down thanks to the current limitations and restrictions. Most of it now comes from Mexico. Pharmacies there have limits too, but none of them seem to actually adhere to them. ---
**Author:** ![Eva\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e495f1/32.png) [@Eva\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eva_Luna)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/19 "2006-03-02T04:03:39Z")
Phenylephrine makes me feel like absolute crap, as I found out [not long ago;](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=358691) it gave me all kinds of heart palpitations and jacked up my blood pressure by 30 points. I went back to the pharmacy as suggested and went through the meth-head prevention routine to get the old formula Sudafed knockoff, which worked just fine. The pharmacist told me my reaction to the new formulation wa’n’t uncommon; apparently it has a tendency to jack up pulse and blood pressure for some people much more than pseudoephedrine does. I sure hope they don’t reformulate everything, or I will need to go to the doctor for prescription decongestants every time my sinuses act up, which would be a PITA and very expensive with our new prescription plan. ---
**Author:** ![Catfood\_Purrito](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Catfood\_Purrito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Catfood_Purrito)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2006, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/replacing-pseudoephedrine/346625/20 "2006-03-02T07:32:12Z")
> [@cher3](#): > > I don’t know if it can be used to make meth, but replacement of pseudoephedrine has gone considerably beyond “talk” here in California. I was in Target this weekend and there wasn’t a single product of that type that contained anything other than phenylephrine. I don’t know how similar they are. I guess I’ll find out when I have my next sinus headache. I’m also in California, and I’ve seen Sudafed with pseudoephedrine available behind the customer service counter at Safeway, I think no earlier than last month, so I’m pretty sure it’s still available here, you just have to look harder for it.