# Republicans: A War On Science and how you are letting them win **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 5, 2012, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856 "2012-10-05T22:39:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/41 "2012-10-07T01:45:59Z")
…and the fact of the matter is that the ARRA increased science funding. I don’t see how you can call the Democrats incompetent when Obama’s first term was the most legislatively productive Congress since WWII. Done in the face of record partisan obstructionism. Steve Benen: We are, after all, talking about a two-year span in which Congress passed and the president signed the Affordable Care Act, the Recovery Act, Wall Street reform, student loan reform, Lily Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, new regulation of the credit card industry, new regulation of the tobacco industry, a national service bill, expanded stem-cell research, the Hate Crimes Prevention Act, the most sweeping land-protection act in 15 years, etc. … Some of these efforts have been years in the making. In the case of health care reform, politicians have been talking about a major overhaul for a full century, but it took this Congress and this president to get it done. I’m tired of this lazy “A plague on both sides” nonsense. Sure the Democrats could be better. But objectively their performance has been more than respectable given their constraints _and heck ignoring their constraints as well_. [http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2010\_10/025991.php](http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2010_10/025991.php) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/42 "2012-10-07T02:16:22Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > What does Todd Akin have in common with Paul Brown? His name is Paul Broun. Broun has the Representative of Georgia’s 10th Congressional district since 2007. He is also, astonishingly, a licensed physician. Astonishing because Broun appears to be the stupidest member of the United States Congress. Broun has publicly compared Barack Obama to Hitler and has publicly stated he believes Obama plans on establishing a Marxist dictatorship in the United States. Broun has publicly stated that he doesn’t know if Obama is an American citizen or a Christian. But he has stated he does know Obama is a socialist. At a 2011 public meeting, one of the audience members asked Broun _“Who is going to shoot Obama?”_ Broun’s response to this question was _“The thing is, I know there’s a lot of frustration with this president.”_ Broun has publicly stated he believes global-warming is a conspiracy invented by scientists. In a 2011 appearance on Fox News, Broun stated, _“What happened at the airport is an elderly lady followed me behind in the screening process, and she was patted down. A little kid was patted down. And this guy in Arabian attire just walks right through.”_ Broun followed this up by saying America needed less political correctness. The incident the OP is referring to is presumably the public speech Broun made this week, where he referred to embryology, evolution, and the Big Bang are being _“lies straight from the Pit of Hell”_. Broun went on to say he believes the Earth is only 9000 years old and was made by God in six days. Broun, a man who has been divorced three times, is a Southern Baptist who has stated he believes that the followers of most other Christian denominations are going to go to Hell. Broun is a graduate of he University of Georgia. Despite this, he has said that the college is too liberal and has called for it to be closed - with the exception of the football team. Broun is a member of the Tea Party Caucus. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/43 "2012-10-07T03:54:25Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Now my father is doing this job. He is a very intelligent man, but he is reviewing proposals for the NSF _because of his business experience_. He is science-friendly and his business experience sometimes involves products that are closely tied to actual scientists, but you could not call him a scientist. On the one hand, I’m proud of him, but on the other hand, I think, “what the hell?” I would much rather see science grants determined by scientists and ONLY scientists, and if the business community wants to help, perhaps they can come in at a later stage. I’m not objecting to the reviewers, or even to the NSF administrators, but to the nitwits in Congress who clearly won’t let funding for real science go throw without a sop to small business. These panels have science and business members. I was actually on the business side since I don’t come from a university. The business side is actually valuable to review the budgets and business plans in the application. So your father is doing a real service. If Congress tells them to fund crap, it might as well be the best quality crap they can find. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/44 "2012-10-07T03:55:49Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Stolen! Mine, I got here first, the rest of you back off! This is exactly why I never post a joke without reading the entire thread. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/45 "2012-10-07T04:21:34Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > I appreciate the kind words about my post. > > I do have to wonder: Where are the Republicans to defend their votes for ignorance while posting - sometimes prolifically - on a board with a mission to eradicate ignorance? > > Where is OMG - A Black Conservative? Where is Bricker? Where is Shodan and his fucking regards? I suspect that **OMG** and **Shodan** are busy looking for cites of a Democratic Party politician endorsing YEC. **Bricker** , probably not so much. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/46 "2012-10-07T04:44:23Z")
I grew up in a time when the US was considered THE world leader in all things. The US Way of Life (as far as my contemporaries and I were concerned: think 1960’s - 1980’s) was something to aspire to, economically, politically and intellectually. The United States of America brought the rest of us in the backward-world some hope for the future, and I for one was certain of its promise (and not just a little bit envious either). Not any more. What the hell happened? Ideas as described in the OP wouldn’t have a chance in hell here (and I’ll posit the rest of the western world too). Sure, we have nutjobs in the political sphere, but they are rarely\* endorsed by any major parties, and have to rely on running as independent candidates (ie, never seeing a seat in government, state or federal). In fact public expressions of religiosity (whatever brand) are frowned upon in politics here. Nobody who wanted to continue their political career would even consider talking such shit. For all I know, some of our MP’s (members of parliament) _might_ hold similar views to those of Akin and Broun, but it would be suicidal to espouse them in the public arena. [I’ve seen quotes around the place that 49% (or thereabouts) of US citizens believe that the Bible is indeed the word of God. (30% believe it is to be literally interpreted)](http://www.gallup.com/poll/148427/say-bible-literally.aspx) That is some scary shit. And it appears that instead of challenging such beliefs, your political reps are pandering to the lowest common denominator in order to garner a seat? Is that what this is all about?? How can a nation that once prided itself upon it’s inherent curiosity and intellectual rigour have degenerated into the caricature it is today? \*Sometimes they might be given a shot if they are a ‘colourful’ character, but they’d find themselves on their arse if they started flooding parliament with the bullshit that was described in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/47 "2012-10-07T04:57:59Z")
…and this is why the professional class is trending Democratic. Honestly, I think rationalist conservative friends of science need to form an analogue to the Log Cabin Republicans. It’s that or stand alone and be purged if your a politico, be ignored otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/48 "2012-10-07T05:04:45Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > . . . Not any more. What the hell happened? . . . Ronald Reagan. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/49 "2012-10-07T05:08:37Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Ronald Reagan. Sure, blame it on the dead guy. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 5:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/50 "2012-10-07T05:44:07Z")
I also blame Newt Gingrich. It was him and his congress that began to be filled with the crazy, one item that allowed for the current disregard of science in congress was to abolish the OTA: > **[Office of Technology Assessment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Technology_Assessment)** > > The Office of Technology Assessment (OTA) was an office of the United States Congress that operated from 1974 to 1995. OTA's purpose was to provide congressional members and committees with objective and authoritative analysis of the complex scientific and technical issues of the late 20th century, i.e. technology assessment. It was a leader in practicing and encouraging delivery of public services in innovative and inexpensive ways, including early involvement in the distribution of government d... > [@](#): > > The Office of Technology Assessment (OTA) was an office of the United States Congress from 1972 to 1995. OTA’s purpose was to provide Congressional members and committees with objective and authoritative analysis of the complex scientific and technical issues of the late 20th century, i.e. technology assessment. It was a leader in practicing and encouraging delivery of public services in innovative and inexpensive ways, including distribution of government documents through electronic publishing. Its model was widely copied around the world. > [@](#): > > History > > Congress created the Office of Technology Assessment in 1972, Public Law 92-484. It was governed by a twelve-member board, comprising six members of Congress from each party, half from the Senate and half from the House of Representatives. During its twenty-four-year life it produced about 750 studies on a wide range of topics, including acid rain, health care, global climate change, and polygraphs. No wonder it had to go, some Republicans could learn the truth about important scientific facts behind many of the items they had to deal with, for Newt and others it was/is better to have the blind leading us. ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/51 "2012-10-07T09:32:56Z")
It’s worth noting [the coups](http://www.krysstal.com/democracy_whyusa01.html) the US was involved in from the 60s to the 80s. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/52 "2012-10-07T13:51:56Z")
> [@gamerunknown](#): > > It’s worth noting [the coups](http://www.krysstal.com/democracy_whyusa01.html) the US was involved in from the 60s to the 80s. What does this have to do with the topic the rest of us are discussing? ---
**Author:** ![Uber\_the\_Goober](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/58956e/32.png) [@Uber\_the\_Goober](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uber_the_Goober)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/53 "2012-10-07T15:05:31Z")
> [@Locrian](#): > > I’ve posted before that I think that people who claim to be religious should NOT have the right to vote, let alone hold any elected office. > > Thing is, I honestly DO NOT believe ANY politician to really be religious. If they show for Sunday services, it’s only for show. > > And I fully agree that it is a war on science. Wasn’t it Kentucky or Kansas whose students were failing science on standardized tests who eliminated the evolution questions so the kids could pass?? All for the “holy contributions” the pols acquire for their campaign fund. > > And I’ll even admit that if Pussyfoot Mittens denied the support from that guy who inspired Todd Aiken and Broun to spout off religious bullshit that was only hypocritical to their own beliefs, I’d feel a little respect for about three seconds. > > We have got to put and end to religious freedom in this country. Go to the fucking holy land, and when the bomb drops, when the bullet stings, when your feeeeeling saaaad, just simply remember religion is shit and then you won’t feeeeeel soooo baaaaaad! 😃 > > (Had to reformat that stupid film in post today, so it’s stuck in me.) … So you’re going to propose a newly revised constitution for these here United States? Perhaps a stronger enforcement of the separation of church and state would be more effective than trying to force such a large portion of the population to give up religion. Especially when they’re willing to die for it. Are you going to dig all the graves? ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/54 "2012-10-07T15:44:24Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Now my father is doing this job. He is a very intelligent man, but he is reviewing proposals for the NSF _because of his business experience_. He is science-friendly and his business experience sometimes involves products that are closely tied to actual scientists, but you could not call him a scientist. On the one hand, I’m proud of him, but on the other hand, I think, “what the hell?” I would much rather see science grants determined by scientists and ONLY scientists, and if the business community wants to help, perhaps they can come in at a later stage. I don’t know, man: the graduate fellowship I got from my local government involved writing a research proposal in order to obtain it; then and to keep it, periodic reviews of work done and proposals of what was going to be done. Knowing that the documents were going to be read by people from all kinds of backgrounds\* and that most likely none of them would know a lof of chemistry, much less quantum chemistry, meant I had to be careful about writing extra-clearly; my boss’ initial draft was unreadable by anybody who wasn’t in the know; my version still was Ancient Greek to the board, but it was clear enough to get forwarded to a theoretical chemist\*\* for review. The slang problem would have existed if the board had been “all scientists”, too, but knowing that it was people from many backgrounds made the need to leave my particular ivory tower more evident; I think that kind of exercise is very good. - The fellowships are for graduate work in any field; there aren’t per-field cuotas, just a limited budget to spread. \*\* Who wasn’t local. There simply weren’t any in the region. I realize this isn’t an issue when your scale is “the USA”. ---
**Author:** ![Batfish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Batfish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batfish)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/55 "2012-10-07T15:46:20Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > …form an analogue to the Log Cabin Republicans… Because _there’s_ a success story.. ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/56 "2012-10-07T17:08:35Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > I appreciate the kind words about my post. > > I do have to wonder: Where are the Republicans to defend their votes for ignorance while posting - sometimes prolifically - on a board with a mission to eradicate ignorance? > > Where is OMG - A Black Conservative? Where is Bricker? Where is Shodan and his fucking regards? For every creationist Republican, there’s a Democrat who thinks nuclear power plants cause cancer or the CIA invented AIDS to kill black people. So it’s unfair to frame scientific ignorance as a specifically Republican problem. The more interesting question is why scientists have such low credibility among the general public and how this could be changed. I found this paper interesting: [http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract\_id=1549444##](http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1549444##) ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/57 "2012-10-07T17:37:30Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > For every creationist Republican, there’s a Democrat who thinks nuclear power plants cause cancer or the CIA invented AIDS to kill black people. So it’s unfair to frame scientific ignorance as a specifically Republican problem. Sorry, but the fact is that in the case of the nuclear issue those Democrats are not doing it alone, facts is that when things go to a vote against a new nuclear plant or a remote dump that is needed, you get people and politicians voting 70 to 80 percent or more against that, but specially at the local level. Clearly, there is a huge bunch of Republicans that go for NIMBY also on this subject. And on other issues I do not see the Democrats day in and day out attempting to make bills to make reparations to blacks for the AIDS epidemic, by contrast you can count on the Republicans of today to constantly pass bills that deny science: [http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/e2-wire/249429-house-gop-scrubs-climate-concerns-from-epa-bill](http://thehill.com/blogs/e2-wire/e2-wire/249429-house-gop-scrubs-climate-concerns-from-epa-bill) > [@](#): > > The latest House bill aimed at thwarting climate change regulations drops previous language that acknowledged scientific concerns about global warming and evidence of rising temperatures and sea levels. > > The House is slated to vote next week on several bills aimed at battling what Republicans call a White House “war” on coal — a package that includes previously passed legislation to block greenhouse gas rules from the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA). > > But the new version of the greenhouse gas bill from House Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Fred Upton (R-Mich.) omits a “sense of Congress” section that describes scientific concerns about climate change while casting it as an international issue. > > The earlier version, which the House passed in April of 2011, said the United States has a “role to play in resolving global climate change matters on an international basis.” So, unless you can find that level of enforcing ignorance at the legislative level, I do think that it is fair to report that the Republicans are the undisputed champions of enforcing scientific ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/58 "2012-10-07T18:02:02Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > So, unless you can find that level of enforcing ignorance at the legislative level, I do think that it is fair to report that the Republicans are the undisputed champions of enforcing scientific ignorance. Google “Tom Harkin” and NCCAM ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/59 "2012-10-07T18:07:13Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > [I’ve seen quotes around the place that 49% (or thereabouts) of US citizens believe that the Bible is indeed the word of God. (30% believe it is to be literally interpreted)](http://www.gallup.com/poll/148427/say-bible-literally.aspx) That is some scary shit. > > And it appears that instead of challenging such beliefs, your political reps are pandering to the lowest common denominator in order to garner a seat? Is that what this is all about?? > > How can a nation that once prided itself upon it’s inherent curiosity and intellectual rigour have degenerated into the caricature it is today? “Degenerated”? Those percentages would have been lot higher in any poll done 50 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856/60 "2012-10-07T18:07:15Z")
> [@Hyperelastic](#): > > Google “Tom Harkin” and NCCAM And I knew about him already, but he is not at the champion level of Orrin Hatch. Point being, that just as in the Nuclear case, he would not be able to do much if it wasn’t for the “fine” efforts of the Republicans. So, once again, I do not deny that there are a few woo woo democrats, but they are not in the same proportion and doing as much damage as the woo woo Republicans. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-a-war-on-science-and-how-you-are-letting-them-win/636856.md?page=4)