# Republicans and demand of obedience of children **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 29, 2012, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220 "2012-09-29T09:51:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Untoward\_Parable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/51bf81/32.png) [@Untoward\_Parable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Untoward_Parable)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 9:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/1 "2012-09-29T09:51:34Z")
I have to say this is probably one of the things that has turned me off to most republican families Ive run into. There seemed to be a militaristic relationship between the parents and children (or at least father to children). I didnt notice the same tone in the houses of democrats. ( obviously these are generalities with muddle room). Am I crazy or is this a thing? And what do u think about it? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/2 "2012-09-29T09:59:37Z")
I think you’re experiencing confirmation bias. I know lots of Republican families that do not share the attributes you describe. I know Democratic households that do. Do we ever get tired on this board of unsupported “Why are Republicans such evil shitheads, honestly I’m just curious?” threads? Is there a number where even the SDMB reaches a saturation point? ---
**Author:** ![AlienVessels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ba8739/32.png) [@AlienVessels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlienVessels)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/3 "2012-09-29T10:22:03Z")
Conservatives tend to be more authoritarian. But whenever you’re tempted to extrapolate from your personal experience to the population in general, it’s always good to try and figure out if there is something odd about your experience, for example, only sampling Republican and Democrat families from one area, or worse, different areas for the two groups. ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 10:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/4 "2012-09-29T10:49:24Z")
[This is George Lakoff’s Moral Politics presentation](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5f9R9MtkpqM)(warning hour long utube video. It might provide you the confirmation you’re looking for and presents an argument for it. While I don’t necessarily agree with him he does present a good argument. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/5 "2012-09-29T11:22:50Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > I think you’re experiencing confirmation bias. I know lots of Republican families that do not share the attributes you describe. I know Democratic households that do. > > Do we ever get tired on this board of unsupported “Why are Republicans such evil shitheads, honestly I’m just curious?” threads? Is there a number where even the SDMB reaches a saturation point? I think the OP is stating the plainly obvious and you’re being overly defensive for some reason. I would have phrased it as Conservative/Liberal instead of Republican/Democrat, but that’s just semantics. _Of course_ conservative parents are going to usually tend to be more strict than liberal parents. That just rates a big “DUH” in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![gracer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8e7dd6/32.png) [@gracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gracer)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/6 "2012-09-29T11:55:48Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > I think the OP is stating the plainly obvious and you’re being overly defensive for some reason. I would have phrased it as Conservative/Liberal instead of Republican/Democrat, but that’s just semantics. > > _Of course_ conservative parents are going to usually tend to be more strict than liberal parents. That just rates a big “DUH” in my opinion. Well yes, I would say that if you translated into “conservative” it pretty comes with the definition of the word. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/7 "2012-09-29T12:14:59Z")
For those of you who would like to know more about George Lakoff’s theories about the correspondence between the conservative/liberal distinction and the strict father/nurturant parent model, you can read the Wikipedia entry instead of watching the video that boytyperanma links to: > **[Moral Politics (book)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_Politics)** > > Moral Politics: How Liberals and Conservatives Think is a 1996 book by cognitive linguist George Lakoff. It argues that conservatives and liberals hold two different conceptual models of morality. Conservatives have a strict father model in which people are made good through self-discipline and hard work, everyone is taken care of by taking care of themselves. Liberals have a nurturant parent model in which everyone is taken care of by helping each other. > The first edition of the book was publ... It’s a more subtle analogy than you might think. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/8 "2012-09-29T13:00:20Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > Do we ever get tired on this board of unsupported “Why are Republicans such evil shitheads, honestly I’m just curious?” threads? Is there a number where even the SDMB reaches a saturation point? Nope. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/9 "2012-09-29T13:14:35Z")
I will say that as a high school teacher in a politically diverse area, this hasn’t been my experience _at all_. The only correlation I see in child-rearing involves religion–religious parents are more likely to be strict with there kids involving those things that the religion considers sinful. But I’ve known plenty of very liberal parents who still have very specific expectations for how their kids will behave, and plenty of conservative parents who are relaxed about behavior. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/10 "2012-09-29T13:33:20Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > I think the OP is stating the plainly obvious and you’re being overly defensive for some reason. I don’t see at as being plainly obvious at all. I find it preposterous, in fact. I know Republicans who have nothing that could be even remotely described as a “militaristic relationship” with their children. It’s a foolish thing to claim. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/11 "2012-09-29T13:40:33Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > I know Republicans who have nothing that could be even remotely described as a “militaristic relationship” with their children. Obviously the kids are under orders to pretend otherwise. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/12 "2012-09-29T13:49:59Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > I think you’re experiencing confirmation bias. I know lots of Republican families that do not share the attributes you describe. I know Democratic households that do. > > Do we ever get tired on this board of unsupported “Why are Republicans such evil shitheads, honestly I’m just curious?” threads? Is there a number where even the SDMB reaches a saturation point? We do, but people keep posting them anyway. Honestly, I think the opposite end, where there’s just no parenting and kids are free to talk back to parents or throw tantrums with no consequences when they don’t get candy is a more prevalant problem today. Try to punish a kid nowdays and they’ll threaten to report you to CPS. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/13 "2012-09-29T14:03:34Z")
I suggest that those of you who haven’t actually read the Wikipedia entry I linked to and then watch the video that boytyperanma linked to. As I said, Lakoff’s argument is actually fairly subtle. It’s considerably more complicated than just saying, “Conservatives like to beat their children into a pulp,” or “Liberals let their children run around wild doing anything they feel like.” ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/14 "2012-09-29T14:13:27Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > _Of course_ conservative parents are going to usually tend to be more strict than liberal parents. That just rates a big “DUH” in my opinion. I don’t think that is the case at all; I think conservative and liberal parents cover the same range of ‘strictness’, but probably about different things. However, strict is not always authoritarian. I do suspect liberal parents use “Because I said so” argument less often, as that has been my experience.owever, strict is not always authoritarian. Or, what **Manda JO** said. > [@MandaJo](#): > > I will say that as a high school teacher in a politically diverse area, this hasn’t been my experience _at all_. The only correlation I see in child-rearing involves religion–religious parents are more likely to be strict with there kids involving those things that the religion considers sinful. But I’ve known plenty of very liberal parents who still have very specific expectations for how their kids will behave, and plenty of conservative parents who are relaxed about behavior. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/15 "2012-09-29T14:35:34Z")
It’s much more a sociocultural thing than a political thing. But the two are intertwined. If you don’t control for the first, it makes for faulty conclusions about the second. My parents were very old school with their kids. They are also very politically progressive. But they are also black, from working-class backgrounds, and quite religious. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/16 "2012-09-29T14:38:21Z")
> [@Untoward\_Parable](#): > > There seemed to be a militaristic relationship between the parents and children (or at least father to children). My dad was registered as a Republican – and he was a military officer when I was a child. My sister and I were raised to be polite; to say ‘sir’ and ‘ma’am’, and ‘excuse me’, and whatnot. We asked to be excused from the table. We knew not to interrupt. And so on. Now here’s the thing: It went both ways. We were taught to treat our parents with respect, and they treated us with respect. We were expected to treat others with respect, regardless of ‘race colour, or creed’. I’ve mentioned this here before, and I recall comments that that was ‘weird’ and ‘stifling’. But it wasn’t. I think we had a considerable amount of freedom. I was encouraged to explore and experiment and create and to try new things – as long as it was relatively safe and non-destructive. Maybe Navy families are different, or maybe it’s that dad started out as an enlisted man and became an officer later; but ours was not a ‘militaristic’ household. Definitely not _The Great Santini_. I grew up to be a Liberal. But I can still be polite and treat people with respect (when I want to). ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/17 "2012-09-29T15:03:41Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I grew up to be a Liberal. But I can still be polite and treat people with respect (when I want to). Gasp! No, how could that be? ---
**Author:** ![Sahirrnee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sahirrnee/32/13937_2.png) [@Sahirrnee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sahirrnee)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/18 "2012-09-29T16:12:46Z")
> [@Untoward\_Parable](#): > > I have to say this is probably one of the things that has turned me off to most republican families Ive run into. There seemed to be a militaristic relationship between the parents and children (or at least father to children). I didnt notice the same tone in the houses of democrats. ( obviously these are generalities with muddle room). > > Am I crazy or is this a thing? And what do u think about it? I think UR seeing what U want to see. I think people who say Republicans behave a certain way and that Liberals behave a certain way are no different then people who say blacks behave a certain way or Catholics behave a certain way. I guess I am one of the lucky few to have been exposed to so many different types of people that I don’t make judgements about anybody until I really get to know the person. I’ve eaten dinner in the Governor’s Mansion, I know people who called the last president ‘George’, I used to ride my horse with a man who owned a bank. I even know a for real rocket scientist and people whose summer homes cost in the millions. I also know people who live paycheck to paycheck, have spend most of their lives on welfare, immigrants both legal and illegal, homeless people, drug addicts, alcoholics, people who have been in and out of jail, at least one murderer, and people who would happily slit your throat for the right price. I’m friends with black people, white people, Asians, and dated a Native American. I’ve hung out with people from all over the world, Muslims, Christians, Jews, Atheists, Wiccans, pagans, Hindus and Buddhists and even a few Satanists. I have tall friends, short friends, fat friends, skinny friends, old friends and young friends. I’ve hung out with models and musicians, escorts and strippers. I know ultra-conservatives, bleeding heart liberals, and everything in between. Damn! If I had the money, the time and space I could throw one hell of a party! I feel sorry for all y’all who can’t see another persons point of view and have nothing better to do than point your fingers at each other, those of you who have never stepped outside your comfort zone to see how the other side lives, or thinks, or feels. You want to sit back and act all superior and pass judgement on people that you haven’t even taken the time to get to know. I’m not talking to just the liberals, I’d say the same thing to the conservatives. One thing I know for sure, stupidity and assholiness don’t discriminate. FWIW I’m registered Independent, because in all honesty I don’t want to be lumped in with the people on either side. From my observation on the sidelines, y’all are more alike than you’d ever want to admit. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/19 "2012-09-29T16:39:35Z")
> [@sahirrnee](#): > > I think UR seeing what U want to see. > > I think people who say Republicans behave a certain way and that Liberals behave a certain way are no different then people who say blacks behave a certain way or Catholics behave a certain way. There is a big difference. One group, “blacks”\*, are defined by their genetic heritage. There is no reason to believe all such people will behave a certain way. Another group, Catholics, are typically strongly influenced by the subculture in which they were raised. As the subculture is religious, one can expect some common behaviors in smaller subgroups, but none that are universal in the group. Republicans are defined by common political beliefs; these beliefs are - okay, can be - completely independent of genetic heritage or the subcultural of one’s upbringing. Furthermore, these beliefs are publicly claimed as adults. Believing a person’s actions are colored by common beliefs adopted as an adult is very different from believing they are the result of genetic heritage. Wrong, perhaps, but different. - I am assuming you refer to people of significant African descent in the last few hundred or so years. If I am wrong, well, this post is completely immaterial. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2012, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220/20 "2012-09-29T16:43:01Z")
> [@Stratocaster](#): > > I think you’re experiencing confirmation bias. I know lots of Republican families that do not share the attributes you describe. I know Democratic households that do. I agree. The OP might be seeing families that have strict discipline. But in how many of those families does he really know the political affiliation of the parents? And what about the political affiliation of the other families where he isn’t seeing signs of strict discipline? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-and-demand-of-obedience-of-children/636220.md?page=2)