# Republicans; do you really believe Geo. Bush is in charge? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 24, 2004, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841 "2004-04-24T21:16:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![randwill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@randwill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randwill)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/1 "2004-04-24T21:16:43Z")
I know not all Republicans are stupid, but most must be in heavy denial when it comes to George W. Bush. Did anyone watch that prime time news conference and think: “Now there’s a bright, articulate man I can be proud of?” More likely you thought: “Those hateful ole’ liberal journalists kept asking him mean questions, just trying to make him look bad.” I mean, come on, realistically, party loyalty aside, the guy is boob. You KNOW he is. A God-fearing, Jesus-loving boob, but a boob never-the-less. He refused to really answer most of the direct questions posed to him, instead, launching into the “answers” prepared for him that did not even address the question asked. He twice refused to explain why he wouldn’t testify without Dick Cheeney before the 9/11 commission. (Can you imagine his father refusing to testify before a Congressional committee unless he could bring Dan Quayle along with him?) I mean, they’re not even PRETENDING the guy has a brain in his head anymore. As an American don’t you find all this the least bit embarassing? His approval rating remains steady in polls, so it’s hard for me to understand what’s going on. Has the national intelligence level suddenly dropped? Will people vote for a piece of dried up meatloaf just as long as it proclaims itself a Republican? ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/2 "2004-04-24T23:03:51Z")
> [@randwill](#): > > I know not all Republicans are stupid, but most must be in heavy denial when it comes to George W. Bush. Did anyone watch that prime time news conference and think: “Now there’s a bright, articulate man I can be proud of?” More likely you thought: “Those hateful ole’ liberal journalists kept asking him mean questions, just trying to make him look bad.” I mean, come on, realistically, party loyalty aside, the guy is boob. You KNOW he is. A God-fearing, Jesus-loving boob, but a boob never-the-less. I think there’s a tendency for people to overlook annoying qualities in people if it suits their whims. For example, there are lots of females I socialize with that I couldn’t stand to have around if they were male. The fact that they have a body form that is pleasing to my eye is essentially the only reason I hang around them, because I definitely don’t seek their company for their sparkling personality. Likewise, I think the only reason a lot of people support Bush is because he is Republican. Take a Democratic leader with the same stubborn personality and incompetance at public speaking and the Republicans couldn’t stand him. I think even die hard Republicans instinctively realize this. I don’t see posters like Brutus clammering for more press conferences to hear more pearls of wisdom from our Glorious Well Spoken Leader, now do I? Conservatives are willing to overlook this flaw because they have a boner for Republican ideology, so to speak. The little (R) after his name makes a huge difference. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/3 "2004-04-24T23:14:08Z")
> [@](#): > > I know not all Republicans are stupid, but most must be in heavy denial when it comes to George W. Bush. Did anyone watch that prime time news conference and think: “Now there’s a bright, articulate man I can be proud of?” More likely you thought: “Those hateful ole’ liberal journalists kept asking him mean questions, just trying to make him look bad.” I mean, come on, realistically, party loyalty aside, the guy is boob. You KNOW he is. A God-fearing, Jesus-loving boob, but a boob never-the-less. I think George Bush is someone who doesn’t do well in formal off-the-cuff interviews. Perhaps he has a bit of stage fright, or he’s self-conscious. But a ‘boob’? Not a chance. If you look at the man’s career objectively, or listen to the people who are around him, you certainly won’t get that impression. For example, Bob Woodward, who is not a Republican and spent a whole lot of time watching Bush at work, certainly doesn’t think he’s a boob. In fact, in his new book he describes Bush as being a lot more commanding and in control of what his administration does than most of his critics want to believe. But please, go ahead and continue thinking that the ex fighter pilot with the Harvard MBA is a ‘boob’. That’s one of the reasons Democrats keep getting beat senseless by him. ---
**Author:** ![zwaldd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a9adbd/32.png) [@zwaldd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwaldd)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/4 "2004-04-24T23:29:10Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > But please, go ahead and continue thinking that the ex fighter pilot with the Harvard MBA is a ‘boob’. I think it’s telling that one must reach back 30 years to cite accomplishments for a sitting President and former Governer. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/5 "2004-04-24T23:29:29Z")
> [@randwill](#): > > I know not all Republicans are stupid, but most must be in heavy denial when it comes to George W. Bush. Did anyone watch that prime time news conference and think: “Now there’s a bright, articulate man I can be proud of?” More likely you thought: “Those hateful ole’ liberal journalists kept asking him mean questions, just trying to make him look bad.” I mean, come on, realistically, party loyalty aside, the guy is boob. You KNOW he is. A God-fearing, Jesus-loving boob, but a boob never-the-less. > > He refused to really answer most of the direct questions posed to him, instead, launching into the “answers” prepared for him that did not even address the question asked. He twice refused to explain why he wouldn’t testify without Dick Cheeney before the 9/11 commission. (Can you imagine his father refusing to testify before a Congressional committee unless he could bring Dan Quayle along with him?) I mean, they’re not even PRETENDING the guy has a brain in his head anymore. > > As an American don’t you find all this the least bit embarassing? His approval rating remains steady in polls, so it’s hard for me to understand what’s going on. Has the national intelligence level suddenly dropped? Will people vote for a piece of dried up meatloaf just as long as it proclaims itself a Republican? That “boob” has a bachelor’s degree from Yale and a Master’s from Harvard. Remind me, Randwill- where’d YOU go to college? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/6 "2004-04-24T23:36:25Z")
We all know that the Illuminati are actually in charge. Occasionally Karl Rove will lead them in a chorus of “We’d Like To Teach The World To Sing”, but that’s about all the input anyone in the Bush Administration has in the day-to-day control of events. Kind of comforting, really. “The guy is boob”? Has the board intelligence level suddenly dropped, or are prepositions now optional? ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/7 "2004-04-24T23:41:43Z")
Is this a debate or a mis-placed pit thread?? Not really much to say on this subject except…underestimate Bush at your peril. He’s not nearly as stupid or clueless as you are trying to make him out to be. The fact that he doesn’t do well as a public speaker, doesn’t come off as smooth and polished (like a politician), doesn’t have slick answers that delve into the mystery’s of the word ‘it’ or ‘if’, is seen by some as being a positive…i.e. ‘He’s not like those OTHER politicians!’ Hell, I wouldn’t put it past Bush to be PURPOSELY coming off as a bit rough around the edges for just this reason…or even more likely to me as coming off rough to avoid questions he doesn’t really want to answer, and folks like you will just go “He’s just a stupid sock puppet anyway…what COULD he know!” He knows a lot and people keep underestimating him and he’ll be laughing his ass off all the way back into 4 more years in office. And if Kerry takes him as lightly we’ll have another 4 years of the man. Is that what you REALLY want?? -XT ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/8 "2004-04-24T23:44:24Z")
There ARE stupid people at Ivy Leagues. Please don’t confuse having lot of money and the right social connections with intelligence. ---
**Author:** ![Chicago\_Faucet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chicago_faucet/32/13910_2.png) [@Chicago\_Faucet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicago_Faucet)\ **Post date:** [April 24, 2004, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/9 "2004-04-24T23:57:17Z")
Since your OP was not stated anywhere near to initiating a debate, I won’t even put the energy towards trying to meld it into resembling one. _You_ may _KNOW_ that President Bush is a boob, but a majority of Americans don’t feel that way, including this one. _You_ may also feel that he had a dismal showing at the press conference a week or so ago, but the fact is that his poll numbers rose immediately after that, contradicting your assessment. These journalists who asked President Bush to apologize for 9/11, three times by my count, were the same press corps that did not ask President Clinton to apologize for Oklahoma City, Waco, Ruby Ridge, or Columbine. Nor did they ask President Roosevelt to apologize for Pearl Harbor. Now, you are asking us to apologize for actually liking President Bush? > [@](#): > > I know not all Republicans are stupid… Give me a break. Please refer to the thread in The Pit about why President Bush’s poll numbers are up. > [@](#): > > There ARE stupid people at Ivy Leagues. Please don’t confuse having lot of money and the right social connections with intelligence. Monstro, I assume you are talking about the same Administrations at the Educational Institutions, like Duke, that claim that they would never hire a Conservative to their ranks because they have yet to meet an intelligent one. It is Glurge like this that is the reason not many Conservatives hang out in Great Debates anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/10 "2004-04-25T00:18:46Z")
> [@Chicago Faucet](#): > > _You_ may also feel that he had a dismal showing at the press conference a week or so ago, but the fact is that his poll numbers rose immediately after that, contradicting your assessment. You don’t suppose [this](http://www.usatoday.com/news/politicselections/nation/president/2004-04-19-bush-campaign-spending_x.htm?POE=NEWISVA) had anything to do with his gains in the polls do you, **CF**? Nah, couldn’t be, America just knows a leader when they see one… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![jshore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/b5e925/32.png) [@jshore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jshore)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/11 "2004-04-25T00:21:20Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > “The guy is boob”? Has the board intelligence level suddenly dropped, or are prepositions now optional? Not sure…But apparently distinguishing parts of speech (e.g., prepositions vs. articles) now appears to be optional. 😉 In response to the OP: I have to agree to a certain extent with others who warn you not to underestimate Bush. I agree with you to some extent. He is clearly no intellectual or policy wonk and seems to have a hard time understanding subtle or complex issues, instead seeing things in very black-and-white terms. On the other hand, he seems to have very good political skills and instincts and is said to have excellent one-on-one interpersonal skills (which is apparently why he was treated so kindly by his press corps in the 2000 elections and has continued to be treated pretty much with kid-gloves, at least until recently). Let’s face it, anyone who has successfully managed to inflict this much damage on our country in less than 4 years can’t be a total idiot…at least politically! ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/12 "2004-04-25T00:45:04Z")
> [@zwaldd](#): > > I think it’s telling that one must reach back 30 years to cite accomplishments for a sitting President and former Governer. And the sole positive thing (as opposed to “not being Bush”) that Kerry is running on is being Vietnam veteran… ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/13 "2004-04-25T01:01:45Z")
> [@](#): > > Quote: > Originally Posted by Sam Stone > But please, go ahead and continue thinking that the ex fighter pilot with the Harvard MBA is a ‘boob’. > > I think it’s telling that one must reach back 30 years to cite accomplishments for a sitting President and former Governer. Oh, sorry. I thought we were talking about his intelligence, not his accomplishments. If you want those, here goes… 1. He won the governorship of one of the largest states, beating a popular incumbent governor who underestimated him. 2. He won re-election decisively against opponents who underestimated him. 3. He won the nomination for President, beating such luminaries as John McCain. Pundits at the time said that one of his secret weapons was that people continually underestimated him. 4. He beat Al Gore like a rented mule in two presidential debates. Analysts after the debates said that Bush benefited from ‘low expectations’ because people underestimated his ability. Are you seeing a pattern yet? 1. He became President of the United States. 2. Despite claims that he wasn’t a leader, wasn’t very smart, and that Congress would eat him for lunch, Bush pushed through almost everything on his four-year agenda in the first year in office. 3. After 9/11, his administration has presided over the toppling of two dictatorships, the destruction of 3/4 of the leadership of al-Qaida, and the creation of a new cabinet level homeland security office. ---
**Author:** ![MrFantsyPants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ba0ec/32.png) [@MrFantsyPants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrFantsyPants)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/14 "2004-04-25T01:15:41Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I think George Bush is someone who doesn’t do well in formal off-the-cuff interviews. Perhaps he has a bit of stage fright, or he’s self-conscious. I read a great article a while back from someone who spent some time going through a lot of GWB’s speeches. His conclusion was that when speaking about war, capital punishment, vengeance, etc., he is focused, well-spoken, and in command. When talking about welfare, rights of the child, literacy support, education, etc., he is unfocused, screwes up his sentences, comes across as a “boob”. Perhaps the guy just has a bit of selective ADD? > [@](#): > > That “boob” has a bachelor’s degree from Yale and a Master’s from Harvard. > Remind me, Randwill- where’d YOU go to college? Just saying it again. A degree doesn’t necessarily have much to do with intelligence. Especially when your dad’s a high ranking politician from a very wealthy family. ---
**Author:** ![randwill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@randwill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randwill)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/15 "2004-04-25T01:17:39Z")
> [@](#): > > “The guy is boob”? Has the board intelligence level suddenly dropped, or are prepositions now optional? Even intelligent people make the occasional typo. Also, most of us intelligent people know that “a” isn’t a preposition. > [@](#): > > Remind me, Randwill- where’d YOU go to college? Remind you? I don’t recall ever telling you. Are you suggesting that my educational credentials have to exceed or equal those of the person whose qualifications I’m questioning? That’s an interesting way to look at things. Which I reject. In any case I suspect the rich and powerful don’t have to meet the same standards in schools, or even show up in the National Guard, to be awarded the certificates the poor and middle class person has to work for. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/16 "2004-04-25T01:22:27Z")
Damn it, **Sam** , hush! I want the ‘loyal opposition’ to keep right on misunderestimating GW. All those dazed slapped-puppy looks on their faces this November will be _priceless_. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/17 "2004-04-25T01:36:29Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Is this a debate or a mis-placed pit thread?? > > Not really much to say on this subject except…underestimate Bush at your peril. He’s not nearly as stupid or clueless as you are trying to make him out to be. The fact that he doesn’t do well as a public speaker, doesn’t come off as smooth and polished (like a politician), doesn’t have slick answers that delve into the mystery’s of the word ‘it’ or ‘if’, is seen by some as being a positive…i.e. ‘He’s not like those OTHER politicians!’ Pretend you have a choice between two versions of George W. Bush. Both versions are identical except for one difference. The first version is an excellent public speaker who can think on his feet, and the second version is the one that we saw at the last press conference. Would you actually prefer the second version? ---
**Author:** ![zwaldd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a9adbd/32.png) [@zwaldd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwaldd)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/18 "2004-04-25T01:46:56Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Are you seeing a pattern yet? 5 out of the 7 are W just getting into office and I believe that had more to do with name recognition than anything else. The ‘pushing through his agenda’ consisted of him signing papers…you think any boob couldn’t have done that? And any boob’s administration could have gotten us shit deep in Iraq, signing orders to go in blazing without the foggiest idea of how to restore order. No, you were right to reach for the fighter pilot and Harvard creds. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/19 "2004-04-25T02:00:57Z")
> [@](#): > > 5 out of the 7 are W just getting into office and I believe that had more to do with name recognition than anything else. Come on, admit it - you’re just guessing, aren’t you? ‘Name Recognition’? Are you serious? John McCain was better known that George W. Bush at the start of the campaign. Until right before the primaries, George W. Bush was only known outside of Texas as one of the sons of a one-term president. > [@](#): > > The ‘pushing through his agenda’ consisted of him signing papers…you think any boob couldn’t have done that? This quote shows an amazing lack of understanding of politics. ‘Just signing papers’, huh? It doesn’t have anything to do with manoevering your opponents, convincing people one-on-one, knowing when to push and when to give, knowing where the roadblocks are and how to thwart them, or any of that stuff, right? It’s just ‘signing papers’. Statements like this, coming from people who accuse George Bush of being a ‘boob’, just make me shake my head. ---
**Author:** ![zwaldd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a9adbd/32.png) [@zwaldd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwaldd)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2004, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841/20 "2004-04-25T02:06:57Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > It doesn’t have anything to do with manoevering your opponents, convincing people one-on-one, knowing when to push and when to give, knowing where the roadblocks are and how to thwart them, or any of that stuff, right? This is the problem with his speaking skills. He’d have to articulate at least a pretense of political savvy to make me believe he’s not just along for the ride. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-do-you-really-believe-geo-bush-is-in-charge/241841.md?page=2)