# Republicans: Explain this to me **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 7, 2003, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080 "2003-10-07T16:07:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/41 "2003-10-07T21:06:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Count Trari de Reeson \* > Because when asked about it Clinton said “I did not have sex with that woman” When Arnold was asked he said, yeah I did that and I’m sorry. Not that I’m in favor of witch-hunts, but I don’t think Arnold can claim any moral high-ground here. Didn’t Arnold initially deny the allegations out of hand, and only later offer the vague admission that he did some of those things, but not all of them? His position seems to be “I’m not admitting anything specific, but if I did anything wrong, I’m sorry.” Hardly owning up to anything. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/42 "2003-10-07T21:12:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by quietman1920 \* > Frankly, the Democrats needs to learn to Waffle On A Dime like the Republicans first. Its amazing how fast every single Republican I know changed their story from “Disgusted at the Adultery” and “Monica’s Cigar” to “Lied Under Oath”. Does the GOP have all your email addresses to tell you what to change your story to for the following day? Its the only explanation for the lock-step story changes. I guess the Democrats really Do need to get better organized… Let me be the first Republican you know, then, to break the mold: before Mr. Clinton lied under oath, I was not in favor of removing him from office – except, of course, by the normal process that we go through every four years. I wasn’t a huge fan of the adultery, but I certainly did not believe it had a bearing on whether or not he should be impeached. After he lied under oath, I wanted him removed from office. And in spite of that, I thought that the campaign to get him on something - anything - was inappropriate. I hope that in the future, **quietman** , you’ll remember what I said, and say that _most_ Reopublicans believed thus-and-so, as opposed to _all_, since now you know one that didn’t. - Rick ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/43 "2003-10-07T21:19:20Z")
The only reason Schwarzenhumper has been honest is because he’s running for office in the Post-Clinton era. When Clinton was President, those kinds of issues were still considered, to a great extent, irrelevant to politics, and nobody’s business. Not to the extent they were before what’s his name with Donna Rice, but still, that taboo had not been as thoroughly shattered as it was after Ken Starr was through. In that context, how many prominent men do you think took it as the expected status quo to refuse to acknowledge such invasive inquiries? Before Clinton, the standard defense when caught in an extramarital sexual escapade was to deny, deny, deny; Arnold is only fessing up because times have changed. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/44 "2003-10-07T21:19:41Z")
**SPOOFE splutters** > [@](#): > > … And honesty. Don’t forget that. Schwarzy’s had no end of it so far. Can’t say as I understand what you’re trying to say here. Arnold’s had no end of honesty? What does that even mean? **and then loses his shit completely, saying** > [@](#): > > Jesus Christ, boy, go read a fucking book! Are you telling me that your entire library of knowledge on these candidates is what they themselves have said on TV? Christ, go to IMDB and read Schwarzy’s biography, if you’re gonna be so fucking lazy about it. Can you suggest which of Arnold’s many published works I should start with, to learn about his plans for handling the governorship of California? I’m sure his bibliography is staggering, so any assistance in this matter would be appreciated. But to be fair, you did suggest that I peruse his [IMDB biography](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000216/bio): > [@](#): > > Growing up in a small, isolated village in Austria, he turned to bodybuilding as his ticket to a better life. After conquering the world as the greatest bodybuilder who ever lived, he went to America to make his name in motion pictures. Hampered by his impossible name and thick accent, success eluded him for many years. It wasn’t until he found the tailor- made role of Conan that he truly came into his own as a performer. A succession of over-the-top action films made him an international box office star. By alternating violent action films with lighter, comedic fare, he has solidified his position as one of the most popular–if not the most popular–movie stars in the world. Wow. That is _deeply_ informative of his political philosophy and his plans for the 5th- or 6th- largest economy on the planet. I don’t know how I can ever thank you for putting me onto the vast wellspring of insight and information into he who is the governator. Oh, and it also says he’s 6’2". I thought he was taller. ---
**Author:** ![Conflict\_of\_Interest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Conflict\_of\_Interest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Conflict_of_Interest)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/45 "2003-10-07T21:20:02Z")
Am I the only one to find it ironic that Davis had Clinton and Jackson on the stage with him while he was putting Arnold down for his sexual misconduct? ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/46 "2003-10-07T21:29:09Z")
What set me off there, **Shodan** , is that O’Reilly’s statement fairly bleeds feigned innocence. O’Reilly claims, “Talking points has never seen a newspaper try to destroy someone as aggressively as the Times is doing.” Were it not for the vagaries of subjectivity, that’s damn near a lie. O’Reilly full-well knows that the conservative press, of which he is an integral part, has a long and famous track record of billionaire-sponsored dirt-digging, character assassination, and smearing, far more virulent than what the LA Times is doing, and against a far more important public official. Among other things, those links show that Richard Mellon Scaife owns the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, which hired Christopher Ruddy, and shows how Scaife encouraged Ruddy to go after Clinton by hyping up the suicide of Vince Foster while simultaneously bribing the American Spectator to dig up other dirt on Clinton. In other words, it’s the exact same shit which O’Reilly is decrying, only _way_ bigger. I know that Bill O’Reilly knows this very well, because O’Reilly also writes for [Newsmax Magazine](http://www.newsmax.com/columnists/OReilly.shtml), which is partially [owned by Scaife](http://conwebwatch.tripod.com/stories/2002/nmstock.html) and which is [edited by Christopher Ruddy](http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2001/6/12/124802.shtml). It’s just total hypocrisy. And it irks the shit out of me to see that bastard get away with statements like that and not get called on it. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/47 "2003-10-07T21:29:17Z")
> [@](#): > > Didn’t Arnold initially deny the allegations out of hand, and only later offer the vague admission that he did some of those things, but not all of them? Well, why should he admit to all of them, considering that a good number of the claims that have come forward recently have proven to be false? ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/48 "2003-10-07T21:35:00Z")
> [@](#): > > SPOOFE splutters Of course. Because if I disagree with you, I must be spluttering. Get over yourself, jackass. > [@](#): > > Can’t say as I understand what you’re trying to say here. Arnold’s had no end of honesty? What does that even mean? ::sigh:: The density of your head must rival neutronium. Read the fucking thread, lazy. Clinton lied about his escapades, Arnold hasn’t. He admitted it. Since the beginning. Since DAY ONE, when he joined in the race, he said that he’s behaved improperly. Since even BEFORE the whole recall fiasco began, he’s been admitting it. Now the Dems are trying desperately to turn this into a scandal, to score some pathetically cheap points against the front-runner. Sad, really. > [@](#): > > Can you suggest which of Arnold’s many published works I should start with, to learn about his plans for handling the governorship of California? We’re not talking about his plans for the governorship, you illiterate cumflake. We’re talking about his capabilities. His history, education, accomplishments, activism, and opinions are documented. I gave you a start already. For everything else, I direct you to Google and invite you to do your own goddamned research before you shoot your mouth off. > [@](#): > > Wow. That is deeply informative of his political philosophy and his plans for the 5th- or 6th- largest economy on the planet. I’ll tell you what, buttfuck, if you can cite where I was talking about his plans for California, I’ll concede the entire issue and eat my underpants. But you can’t. Because we’re not talking about his plans. Or at least I’m not. I don’t know why you suddenly are. You wouldn’t be trying to set up a crimson fish or something, would you? No-o-o-o-o, perish the thought, because Otto is the paragon of rational debate… :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/49 "2003-10-07T21:38:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*Well, why should he admit to all of them, considering that a good number of the claims that have come forward recently have proven to be false? \*\* I didn’t say he has to admit to all of them; I said he was vague about exactly what he is admitting. Saying “I’m sorry IF I did anything wrong” isn’t really an admission of anything. To me it smacks of the attitude that he will only apologize for something when he is backed against the wall and can’t plausibly deny it anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/50 "2003-10-07T21:52:19Z")
SPOOFE says with his usual quiet dignity > [@](#): > > Because if I disagree with you, I must be spluttering. Not at all. People are free to disagree with me. When they do so incoherently, they are spluttering. Then, after throwing out a bizarre comparison of my head to a fictional metal, he continues with his usual elan: > [@](#): > > I’ll tell you what, buttfuck, if you can cite where I was talking about his plans for California, I’ll concede the entire issue and eat my underpants. > > But you can’t. Because we’re not talking about his plans. Or at least I’m not. Start eating. You said > [@](#): > > I actually find it odd that you’re so Ignorant about his capabilities. I have a suspicion that you suffer from the delusional belief that all actors are idiots and incapable of doing “real” work. Now, I’m sure I’m not the only reasonable person to believe that since Arnold is running to be governor of California, the “capabilities” of his one would be interested in would be his capabilities to run the state of California as governor. Perhaps I’m wrong, though. Perhaps the capabilities of the candidate for the governor of California that are of interest are his capabilities in relation to flower arranging or origami. Perhaps his skydiving capabilities are what’s relevant here, or his capabilities as a lion tamer. Or his capabilities of splicing genes into laboratory mice. Call me crazy, though, I’m still gonna have to think that the capabilities under discussion for this person running to be governor of California would be those capabilities of **running the state of California**. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/51 "2003-10-07T22:02:19Z")
> [@](#): > > Not at all. People are free to disagree with me. When they do so incoherently, they are spluttering. Righto, buckaroo. You keep living in that fantasy land. > [@](#): > > Now, I’m sure I’m not the only reasonable person to believe that since Arnold is running to be governor of California, the “capabilities” of his one would be interested in would be his capabilities to run the state of California as governor. “Capabilities” and “plans” are not synonymous, Illiterate. I was responding to the claim that the “best” that California can come up with is “Conan the Barbarian”, a comment that shows a gross Ignorance of Arnold’s off-screen exploits. YOU tried to twist this around into a discussion of Arnold’s specific policies for office, when I said nothing of the sort. So put up or shut up, you pathetic little man… where did I say anything about Arnolds plans, policies, stances, or politics? Cite it, or shut your yapping mouth. > [@](#): > > Call me crazy, though, I’m still gonna have to think that the capabilities under discussion for this person running to be governor of California would be those capabilities of running the state of California. Then you lack the ability to read. The capabilities I referred to are those other than his acting ability, which is what Munch implied with his post. It must be easy, Otto, to debate people when instead of responding to what they actually said, you make up things in your head to respond to. Following your trend, I will now make believe that you just said “I like to like my dog’s vagina”, and continue behaving in this thread as if that is the entire body of your comments. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/52 "2003-10-07T22:07:07Z")
Sorry, Blowero, didn’t mean to blow you off (no pun intended)… > [@](#): > > I didn’t say he has to admit to all of them; I said he was vague about exactly what he is admitting. Saying “I’m sorry IF I did anything wrong” isn’t really an admission of anything. He didn’t say IF. He said “I have done bad things, and I’m sorry.” That sounds like a blanket apology more than anything else. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2003, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/53 "2003-10-07T23:01:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SPOOFE \* > \*\*He didn’t say IF. He said “I have done bad things, and I’m sorry.” That sounds like a blanket apology more than anything else. \*\* not quite blanket. [here](http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/03/schwarzenegger.women/index.html) > [@](#): > > Republican Arnold Schwarzenegger apologized Thursday for behaving “badly,” but also denounced the report as “trash politics.” > [@](#): > > In comments to supporters as he kicked off a four-day bus tour, Schwarzenegger said much of the story was “not true,” but he then went on to apologize. He does not identify which he claims are ‘not true’. So, over all, I think your ‘blanket’ statement isn’t quite accurate. He acknowledged being on rowdy sets and ‘doing things’ in a playful manner and appologizing for offending folks. But the word I’d ‘grope’ for would be ‘minimizing’ vs. any of the words you’ve used to characterize the behavior (if you’ve read any of the specifics) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/54 "2003-10-08T05:40:02Z")
Of course the right is hypocritical, regardless of their bullshit “under oath” distinction. It didn’t bother them when Oliver North lied under oath. Don’t presidents take an oath of office. If a POTUS lies to the country and to congress during a State of the Union Address, is that not lying under oath? Do Republicans really think that lying about an immaterial knob job in deposition for a politically motivated, meritless lawsuit is worse than lying your way into a war and killing people for nothing? The OP forgot another huge double-standard. Why was Clinton villified for avoiding the draft but it was perfectly OK for Shubya to use daddy’s influence to get him into a rich boy division of National Guard? Furthermore, why was it ok for Shrub to desert his division so he could spend the rest of the war face down in a pile of blow, Scarface style? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/55 "2003-10-08T05:58:29Z")
For me it was all about the lying under oath. I even voted Clinton in 1996 before it really broke, and if he had just told the truth I wouldn’t hate the bastard so much. He was simply incapable of telling the truth, even about a little thing like pot. And his lawyerly weaseling on the definition of “is”. He was just a smarmy guy, and I couldn’t stand him anymore. Arnie was up front. Right away he apologized. He’s fessed up to everything so far, and if he continues to, he’ll be seen as a stand up guy, unlike Davis. California could do much worse, in my opinion. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Armageddon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/858c86/32.png) [@Mister\_Armageddon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Armageddon)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/56 "2003-10-08T05:58:40Z")
You know, I think the Clinton/Schwartzenegger comparison doesn’t add up, for one simple reason: at worst, Clinton was accused of adultery and lying to cover it up. Schwartzenegger, on the other hand, has been accused of sexually assaulting these women. Which is, to put it mildly, a lot worse. And I’m fairly sure that if any Democratic candidate for public office had been accused of half the shit that Schwartzenegger has been, the right wing machine would have eaten him alive weeks ago. But of course the hypocritical pieces of shit remain silent on the issue, while raking the LA Times over the coals for doing exactly what they would have done if the roles were reversed. Oh, and I hope California enjoys the next three years, because if they’re stupid enough to elect this neanderthal they deserve whatever they get. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/57 "2003-10-08T06:04:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by GregE625 \* > \*\*The legions of Republicans trumpeted that Clinton was unfit for office because he LIED UNDER OATH!!! > \*\* Look, Republicans were frothing with statements about Clinton’s lack of fitness for public office LONG BEFORE he lied under oath about an affair with Lewinsky. A whole witch-hunt industry was created to find a way to get rid of Clinton, long, LONG before the lie. The accusations were enough, no matter how incredible the source. The accusations against the new shit-for-brains governor of the shit-for-brains State of California are far more extensive and come from far more credible and widely diverse sources than was ever the case with Clinton. Many have witnessed buttmunchinator’s inappropriate and demeaning behavior. He has publically bragged about such behvior. Yet the supposedly “family values” Republicans think it’s fine. Cleary, they have no standards that are worth shit. And even more clearly, California voters are a load of idiots. Their stupidity in this election is staggering. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/58 "2003-10-08T07:04:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by wring \* > \*\*not quite blanket. [here](http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/10/03/schwarzenegger.women/index.html) > > He does not identify which he claims are ‘not true’. > > So, over all, I think your ‘blanket’ statement isn’t quite accurate. He acknowledged being on rowdy sets and ‘doing things’ in a playful manner and appologizing for offending folks. But the word I’d ‘grope’ for would be ‘minimizing’ vs. any of the words you’ve used to characterize the behavior (if you’ve read any of the specifics) \*\* Exactly. What behavior is he apologizing for? He won’t say. But he _does_ say much of the story is not true. How awfully convenient; he hasn’t admitted any specific wrongdoing, but should anything come out in the future, he’s covered his ass and can say he “already apologized”. Sorry, SPOOFE, but he hasn’t stepped up to the plate any more than Clinton did. He has simply tried to evade the accusations, just as Bill did. ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/59 "2003-10-08T08:19:05Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Revtim \* > \*\*No doubt the old “he’ll surround himself with the best advisors” chestnut will get rolled out. \*\* I believe we have a winner: [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=216081](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=216081) > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Morrigoon_ > Third, look at his team. He’s basically the front man for a team of people with far more experience than he. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2003, 11:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080/60 "2003-10-08T11:28:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Binarydrone \* > \*\*For the same reason that when Clinton attacked Iraq he was “wagging the dog”, but when Bush 2.0 did he was making the world safe for democracy. Basically, people are pudding heads. \*\* Clinton was associated with “Wagging the Dog” after ordering the launching of cruise missile into Sudan and Afghanistan as Monica Lewinski was to testify before the grand jury August 20th, after the Blue Dress DNA evidence was brought to the light August 19th. Clinton had admitted to the affair a few days before on national TV. Get your scandals straight. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/republicans-explain-this-to-me/206080.md?page=4)