# Request to all international soccer fans: STOP THAT FUCKING BUZZING! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 12, 2010, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942 "2010-06-12T18:49:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2010, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/301 "2010-06-16T21:18:32Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > They’re probably making an exit soon. Maybe, but if they’re out they can’t lose, and if they can’t lose people won’t stop blowing the horns. Getting knocked out will only worsen the problem because they really won’t care anymore. ---
**Author:** ![Cort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/77aa72/32.png) [@Cort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cort)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2010, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/302 "2010-06-16T21:22:57Z")
The Uruguyans just kicked the shit out of them 3-0. That should shut them up for a bit. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/303 "2010-06-16T21:44:25Z")
> [@Cort](#): > > The Uruguyans just kicked the shit out of them 3-0. That should shut them up for a bit. In their defence, it was never a penalty. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2010, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/304 "2010-06-16T23:45:06Z")
> [@Speak\_to\_me\_Maddie](#): > > I still think Skinner is begging the question. The best soccer team is the team that can win within the rules and inherent limitations of the game. I emphasise that I am not sure Skinner is right. But assuming he is, you miss the point. His point is that his analysis suggests that there is a significant element of luck. If that is right then the team that wins may in a suprising number of cases just be the team that lucks out, rather than the team that has any particular quality that enables it to “win within the rules and inherent limitations of the game”. > [@](#): > > I hate using statistics to analyze quality in sports teams because it takes out the human elements. I feel this way when it is applied to any sport. There are football sports writers who do this sort of thing every season, and every season they turn up wrong in their predictions. If stats told the whole story then there would be no reason to actually play the games. We could just run the numbers, adjusting for chance, and see the results. Sort of like how people let the computer play itself in Madden (or any computer game) for a season. The human element, which isn’t bound by statistics, is why we watch. Heroic play, stupid mistakes, great coaching, unbridled emotion, the man who comes from out of nowhere to become a superstar, and the superstar who falls into pieces, etc. This is silly. If there was no human play there would be nothing for statisticians to analyse. ---
**Author:** ![Drew\_Kit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@Drew\_Kit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drew_Kit)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/305 "2010-06-17T00:06:58Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Somebody’s definitely been tweaking some levels. Give it up to the sound techs. Those guys are some fucking wizards to even even be able to make it THIS tolerable (or at least this much less INtolerable). It doesn’t require wizards, just multiband filters. Here is some software that will do the same if you are watching the matches on a PC. > **[What's all this about the vuvuzela? | Isophonics](http://isophonics.net/content/whats-all-about-vuvuzela)** ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/306 "2010-06-17T00:07:12Z")
Well the anti-vuvuzela viglilantes have won their first victory, [vuvzelas banned from Wimbledon](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/tennis/wimbledon/7834031/Vuvuzelas-banned-from-Wimbledon-by-All-England-Club.html) ---
**Author:** ![lisiate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f05b48/32.png) [@lisiate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lisiate)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/307 "2010-06-17T00:38:06Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you’re waiting for next year’s World Cup, you’re going to be sitting in a stadium somewhere all by yourself. Either that or you’re coming to New Zealand for the [2011 Rugby World Cup](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Rugby_World_Cup) ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/308 "2010-06-17T00:39:12Z")
I’m anti-anti-vuvzelas. I think they should be mandatory at every sporting event. Including The Masters and the International Chess Championships. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/309 "2010-06-17T00:42:09Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > Including The Masters and the International Chess Championships. I wonder–should I follow Tiger Woods around at Pebble Beach this weekend blowing a vuvezla–how long it would be until all my hands were broken? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/310 "2010-06-17T01:03:52Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > In their defence, it was never a penalty. Are you serious? They don’t get much more obvious than that. ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/311 "2010-06-17T01:47:11Z")
> [@Cort](#): > > The Uruguyans just kicked the shit out of them 3-0. That should shut them up for a bit. RSA aren’t the only ones blowing these things, in fact in most of the crowd shots I’ve seen nobody is. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/312 "2010-06-17T04:40:59Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I’m anti-anti-vuvzelas. I think they should be mandatory at every sporting event. Including The Masters and the International Chess Championships. …as well as state funerals. Link to a post about Skinner [here](http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/arxiv/24182/). Link to paper here: it is entitled [Soccer matches as experiments: how often does the ‘best’ team win?](http://arxiv.org/abs/0909.4555). You can think of it this way: low scoring game are analogous to experiments with low sample sizes. When the score is 1-0, it’s difficult to tell which team had a higher underlying probability of scoring: put another way, it’s tough to tell the underlying fitness or skill of each team. Games with 3-0 scores are clearer. Another paper using a similar methodology is here: [Radware Bot Manager Captcha](http://iopscience.iop.org/0295-5075/89/3/38007) They use 20 years of soccer match data to tease out the effects of team quality (constant per season), fitness (which varies throughout the season) and scoring randomness (which is higher for low scoring games). The scoring randomness is so high in soccer, that they couldn’t identify any significant variation in fitness, even with 20 years of data. The authors speculated that individual sports like tennis would have high fitness variation, while high scoring games like basketball would have lower pure randomness. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/313 "2010-06-17T06:57:16Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > My problem with _futbol_\* is that the low scoring makes it unlikely for the best team to win. Gerald Skinner, an astrophysicist at the University of Maryland in College Park [elucidates](http://www.insidescience.org/current_affairs/best_team_not_guaranteed_world_cup_success): Overall, the odds that the best team will win the World Cup is about 28%. > > ## It wasn’t always this way. The first set of rules (1863?) had no crossbar on the goal, though that changed a couple of years later. Anyway, [the average number of goals has dropped from 4-5+ in the 1950s to about 2.3 in the 2006 World Cup](http://wm54.inbox.com/thumbs/2e_130b90_e2d4d8d_oP.png.thumb). The rules need more tweaking. > > - …because nothing says pretension like foreign spelling and italics! I love the sport, but I agree with Skinner. I think the '50s scoring average would be a big improvement. Of course, the tricky part is figuring out how to tweak the rules to increase scoring without fundamentally changing the game. > [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > It’s a shame that it takes a demoralizing penalty from the South African goalkeeper to get people to (mostly) stop blowing those damn horns. Even sadder is how the residents of the _host country_ were seen streaming out of the stadium with 10 minutes left in the game. That’s not sad at all. The cheap plastic horns have turned me anti-South Africa. Nothing makes me happier than knowing they are (likely) eliminated. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/314 "2010-06-17T07:18:36Z")
With most noise makers, all you have to do is shove the device up the offender’s ass. Unfortunately, with vuvuzelas, doing that does not stop the noise, for they just keep tooting away. ---
**Author:** ![Cardinal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardinal/32/4000_2.png) [@Cardinal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardinal)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/315 "2010-06-17T08:49:44Z")
I anticipated the USA-England game partly for the songs from the English crowd. There wasn’t any, and there seems there won’t be anything but that _freaking noise._ Honestly, get a different audio totem. I have no idea how this expresses your plight. I admit your plight, I just hate your drone of an expression. And how exactly does this express your plight? How is this better than songs, which actually have lyrics and possibly a point or two? They might also be enjoyed by those around you (well, assuming you use something like the western major scale; let’s not go nuts and assume I can appreciate something using different notes or even positions for the flats). ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 10:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/316 "2010-06-17T10:26:29Z")
“I’ve never met a nice South African and that’s not fucking surprising man cos they all blow those damn vuvuzelas and that aint cricket…or football, either!” ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/317 "2010-06-17T10:39:42Z")
> [@Measure for Measure](#): > > They use 20 years of soccer match data to tease out the effects of team quality (constant per season) Completely unsustainable assumption. ---
**Author:** ![Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/cc9497/32.png) [@Capt.Ridley\_s\_Shooting\_Party](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capt.Ridley_s_Shooting_Party)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/318 "2010-06-17T10:54:22Z")
Actually, perhaps I misunderstood (I cannot access the paper). Are they assuming that team quality is constant per season, or did their model somehow show that it is, or something else? ---
**Author:** ![Estilicon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Estilicon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Estilicon)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/319 "2010-06-17T12:17:13Z")
Nuke South Africa. Those damm Vuvuzelas just cost us a goal. Is a disgrace. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2010, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942/320 "2010-06-17T12:26:36Z")
You know, for my money, nothing enhances the enjoyment of the beautiful game than 20 years of soccer match data to tease out the effects of team quality (constant per season), fitness (which varies throughout the season) and scoring randomness. It just brings all the excitement right to a head, doesn’t it? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/request-to-all-international-soccer-fans-stop-that-fucking-buzzing/542942.md?page=17)