# Resolved: I fucking hate soccer! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 3, 2010, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453 "2010-07-03T19:53:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/141 "2010-07-06T01:21:03Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > Well, maybe, but suppose you were designing a brand new game from scratch, and you find out that, with the rules you’ve implemented, games end up in scoreless ties like 30% of the time, and 0-0, 0-1, and 1-1 ties account for something like 60% of the outcomes.\* Honestly, would you say to yourself, “Perfect! We don’t need to tweak a thing!”? Because it seems to me that most people would say, “Hmm, we’ve made scoring too hard.” And guess what? For many Americans, we _are_ new to the game (the televised version, at least) and so we say to ourselves, “What the hell? They played for 90 minutes and nothing was determined? What bullshit.” > > Or, to put it another way, I think you like low-scoring games because you like soccer, and low-scoring games are part of soccer. I could understand liking low-scoring games if they were rare and thus evidence of some great defensive players, or extreme parity or the like, but the fact that they’re common suggests to me that it’s more a feature of the game itself than the teams. > > So while I dislike soccer (although not as much as **Rystad** , apparently), I don’t think it’s because the players are unskilled (I liken completely missing the goal that has Rystad’s panties in a bunch to missing an extra point in football – it happens, rarely, and certainly has no effect on the skill level of all the players). I dislike soccer because it seems that it’s slanted towards defense (as evidenced by the low scores) which, while fine in moderation, kinda sucks ass as a rule. It’d be like if cornerbacks, linebackers, and safeties were allowed to just flat-out tackle receivers in football, even if they didn’t have the ball, even if the ball was in the air. Scoring would go waaaaaay down, and the game would be much worse. I’m not a soccer historian, so I don’t know if scoring has always been as low as it has, but I do know that I don’t like it the way it is now. You do, but as I said before, I think deep down you like soccer _despite_ the low scores, not _because_ of them. > > And really, the offsides rule? You’ve got a rule that serves to decrease scoring even further? Now you’re just being obstinate against scoring. > > [sub]\* (I don’t know if these are the actual stats in soccer, but you catch my drift, I hope).[/sub] What you say is partly true. However, the thing that has changed the most in the last 50 years is speed. If you watch the 1970 world cup it’s like they’re senior citizens. Great ability, passing, scoring, but defenders let you walk 40 metres before tackling you and you had plenty time to set up your plays. modern defenders are quick and in-your-face. Just get the sissies who dive out of the game!!! ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/142 "2010-07-06T01:23:46Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > And really, the offsides rule? You’ve got a rule that serves to decrease scoring even further? Now you’re just being obstinate against scoring. > > [sub]\* (I don’t know if these are the actual stats in soccer, but you catch my drift, I hope).[/sub] No, it reduces cherry picking. It allows defenses to push up the field and get stretched. It probably increases scoring. ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/143 "2010-07-06T01:38:24Z")
> [@BlackKnight](#): > > Over a quarter _billion_ people are estimated to have watched the last World Cup final. A quarter of New Zealand stayed up or woke up to watch their team play! ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/144 "2010-07-06T02:20:17Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > No, it reduces cherry picking. It allows defenses to push up the field and get stretched. It probably increases scoring. The fact is it’s fucking hard to get a goal in. We like that. ---
**Author:** ![quixotic78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/3ab097/32.png) [@quixotic78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/quixotic78)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/145 "2010-07-06T02:20:17Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > No, it reduces cherry picking. I have no idea what this means in context. I’m just not at all familiar with the way you’re using “cherry picking.” > [@](#): > > It allows defenses to push up the field and get stretched. It probably increases scoring. Well, presumably, defenses are free right now to either push up the field or not. Take away the offsides rule and… they’re still free to either push up the field or not. How on earth does the rule, therefore, have an impact on scoring by this logic? Because from where I’m sitting, the rule does nothing more than take away a wicked bonus for the offensive side. It’s like saying basketball players have to shoot with their eyes closed if they’re inside the three-point arc. Just needlessly making their job harder. > [@Bam Boo Gut](#): > > The fact is it’s fucking hard to get a goal in. We like that. So by your logic, 40 people on a side would be even MORE AWESOMER. Here’s a deal for you: I will officially admit, on behalf of all Americans, that one of the reasons we don’t like soccer is because we’re not very good at it IF, in return, you admit that you like the low scoring primarily because it pisses off us Yanks. ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/146 "2010-07-06T02:52:52Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > You do, but as I said before, I think deep down you like soccer _despite_ the low scores, not _because_ of them. Thing is , I watched the end of the NBA final - one of the teams won by a few points although the scores were high like 76 - 80 or some such. I learned that this was the \*\*seventh \*\*game of this final, in the end there were just a couple of points in it. Lots of points were scored, but in the end after 7 games, it came down to just a few points, so what’s the difference? With football, we’re used to the low scores, if there’s a high score it means the teams were not evenly matched, so not a good game, with one team hammering goals in. I can understand where you’re used to higher scoring games, but in the end it comes down to a few points - just like football. Am I wrong? Sure the rules could be reconstructed so one team beat another by 52 - 54, but it might as well be 2 - 0. ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/147 "2010-07-06T03:11:50Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > Here’s a deal for you: I will officially admit, on behalf of all Americans, that one of the reasons we don’t like soccer is because we’re not very good at it IF, in return, you admit that you like the low scoring primarily because it pisses off us Yanks. Football isn’t about pissing off you guys, sorry. It’s not your primary sport nor that of Ireland or Australia for example but the US performed well - no shame, as did Ireland and the Aussies. England … well … there are other sports not to do well at. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/148 "2010-07-06T03:41:46Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > Well, presumably, defenses are free right now to either push up the field or not. Take away the offsides rule and… they’re still free to either push up the field or not. How on earth does the rule, therefore, have an impact on scoring by this logic? . Yes, they would technically be free to push up all their defenders. Just as teams are now technically free to play their keeper as a striker. Both would be suicide though. You don’t see that leaving a completely unmarked forward one on one with the keeper the entire game is a recipe for disaster?! ---
**Author:** ![martu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@martu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/martu)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/149 "2010-07-06T13:43:14Z")
> [@quixotic78](#): > > Here’s a deal for you: I will officially admit, on behalf of all Americans, that one of the reasons we don’t like soccer is because we’re not very good at it IF, in return, you admit that you like the low scoring primarily because it pisses off us Yanks. I have never quite understood this attitude - defending is an art form that can be as beautiful to watch as scoring from a free flowing, one touch passing move. Many draws are dull but many are as exciting as high scoring matches, the goalkeeper making that fingertip save, a perfectly timed tackle from the left back in the box a split second before the striker shoots and so on. All moments of excitement and drama and what else do you want from your sport? Re the OP - no skill?? You sir never had the good fortune of watching Matthew Le Tissier in his prime. I pity you, I really do….. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/150 "2010-07-06T13:48:29Z")
> [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](#): > > The fact is it’s fucking hard to get a goal in. We like that. Yup. If there were loads of them every game, goals would lose their magic. There’s nothing like watching your team play a tense goalless 89 minutes against top opponents, and then getting an own goal off your most hated defender in the last corner of the game. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/151 "2010-07-06T13:51:59Z")
> [@martu](#): > > Re the OP - no skill?? You sir never had the good fortune of watching Matthew Le Tissier in his prime. I pity you, I really do….. Or [Frank Worthington](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0z_arXZ8nM), I’ll bet. ---
**Author:** ![flodnak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/838e76/32.png) [@flodnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flodnak)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/152 "2010-07-06T14:15:41Z")
Attention, Americans Who Hate Soccer: The rest of the world does not want you to start liking soccer. As humbling as it may sound, the rest of the world doesn’t much care if you like soccer or not. What annoys a lot of sports fans in the rest of the world, however, is when people who do not like soccer either a) assert that those people who do like soccer - and there are more of them than fans of any other sport - only like it because they are stupid or otherwise somehow inferior to you; or b) insist that the game would be So Much Better! if only changes were made that would fundamentally alter the game. I mean, I hate golf and I don’t understand how anybody can watch it, but I don’t go around asserting that it would be much more entertaining if they were allowed to throw the ball from the tee instead of having to hit it with those club thingies. ---
**Author:** ![Fuji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Fuji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuji)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/153 "2010-07-06T14:22:32Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Or [Frank Worthington](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0z_arXZ8nM), I’ll bet. Now, _that_ was impressive. Thanks for the link. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/154 "2010-07-06T14:30:13Z")
> [@Cort](#): > > Without googling? I’ve no idea. But I’m keen to learn. Is it like the Chewbacca defence? It involves opening up a boutique. ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/155 "2010-07-06T14:40:09Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I was watching this American football game once, where this guy had the ball held for him by another guy. To help! Can’t do it on your own? HAHAHA. Then, he kicked the stationary ball, towards a goal with nobody in it. And he missed by a mile. A professional, with another professional helping him and you can’t hit it? Unbelievable! He was a former soccer player, obviously. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/156 "2010-07-06T14:47:23Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > Or [Frank Worthington](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W0z_arXZ8nM), I’ll bet. [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/2D8IW_3_6D8/hqdefault.jpg "George Best Disallowed Goal v England's Gordon Banks at Windsor Park (15 May 1971)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2D8IW_3_6D8) George Best the cheeky sod. ---
**Author:** ![wintertime](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c68b51/32.png) [@wintertime](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wintertime)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/157 "2010-07-06T14:54:08Z")
And one that wasn’t disallowed: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/73kaY3_rQR4/hqdefault.jpg "Carsten Jancker 1998") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73kaY3_rQR4) 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8c91f0/32.png) [@Bam\_Boo\_Gut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bam_Boo_Gut)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/158 "2010-07-06T15:06:24Z")
Excellent **wintertime** what a laugh. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/159 "2010-07-06T15:42:43Z")
> [@flodnak](#): > > Attention, Americans Who Hate Soccer: The rest of the world does not want you to start liking soccer. As humbling as it may sound, the rest of the world doesn’t much care if you like soccer or not. What annoys a lot of sports fans in the rest of the world, however, is when people who do not like soccer either a) assert that those people who do like soccer - and there are more of them than fans of any other sport - only like it because they are stupid or otherwise somehow inferior to you; or b) insist that the game would be So Much Better! if only changes were made that would fundamentally alter the game. > > I mean, I hate golf and I don’t understand how anybody can watch it, but I don’t go around asserting that it would be much more entertaining if they were allowed to throw the ball from the tee instead of having to hit it with those club thingies. And have you noticed that there are practically no holes-in-one? How about if the holes were made the size of large buckets? Who’s with me? ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2010, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453/160 "2010-07-06T15:45:24Z")
> [@BlackKnight](#): > > Over a quarter _billion_ people are estimated to have watched the last World Cup final. This is more than twice as much as the last “Super Bowl”. Soccer is the world’s most-watched sport. _CSI Miami_ is the world’s most-watched television show. Shit is shit. Please stop making the mistake that popular = good. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-i-fucking-hate-soccer/545453.md?page=9)