# Resolved: Rules changes in all four major U.S. sports that completely fix their flaws **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Tags:** baseball-mlb, basketball-nba, hockey-nhl, football-nfl\ **Created:** [October 14, 2023, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578 "2023-10-14T20:14:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/81 "2023-10-16T15:47:07Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But in baseball, there is no mechanism for the defending team to score a run. There is no mechanism for the defending team in football to score or get possession in victory formation, either. All that charging the line will do is get someone injured. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/82 "2023-10-16T15:48:26Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > There is no mechanism for the defending team in football to score or get possession in victory formation, either. But there **is** a mechanism. That it is almost impossible is what makes the rules lawyering work, but sometimes bizarre stuff happens. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/83 "2023-10-16T15:54:42Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > A simpler change would be to adopt the Canadian Football rules on kicking. No opposing player is allowed within 5 yards of the kick returner until the returner touches the ball. On kickoffs, this would pretty much never happen anyway. The ball is kicked off from the kicking team’s 35, the returner catches it at or around his own goal line, and at the moment he catches it, the coverage players on the kicking team are still 20 yards or more away from him. (The “five yards” rule is relevant for _punts_, but that’s a different type of play.) Here’s a link to an “all 22” video (a wide angle view) of a Super Bowl; I have it cued up to the opening kickoff, at the moment when the kick is fielded The returner catches the ball about 3 yards deep in the end zone; at that moment, the nearest opponents have only reached the 25 yard line. [https://youtu.be/t6j9son0DWw?t=27](https://youtu.be/t6j9son0DWw?t=27) Also, the injury issue on kickoffs isn’t just hits on the returner; it’s hits between coverage players (on the kicking team) who have been running flat-out for 40 to 50 yards, colliding with blockers. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/84 "2023-10-16T15:55:59Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Not all scorers think, interpret, and assign alike, so you are introducing what I feel is an unacceptable variable. As it is, the scorer’s decision to assign either a hit or an error to a given at bat proves my point. I’ve seen dropped balls ruled hits instead of errors when, in fact, my brother made tougher catches when he played in the Babe Ruth League. > > We need standardization, not interpretation. Accepting the fact that different umpires have different strike zones is absurd when balls and strikes can now be called correctly by computers. Agree totally. There’s no reason human beings should be calling balls and strikes, when computers are capable of doing the job precisely, correctly, and without any prejudice regarding particular players. And in general, opening up new areas for judgment calls on the part of umpires or scorekeepers is a really bad idea. Things should be moving in the opposite direction where possible. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/85 "2023-10-16T16:01:39Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But there **is** a mechanism. If you want to play that way, it’s fine, but it’s the defense that’s going to get beat up. OLs love running plays because they get to just hammer the guy in front of them. So, let them hammer away while the QB takes a knee, the OL won’t complain, not once. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/86 "2023-10-16T16:04:15Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > That it is almost impossible is what makes the rules lawyering work, but sometimes bizarre stuff happens. Before the Victory Formation, teams just ran handoffs into the line to kill the clock. But Miracle at the Meadowlands (1977) changed that, and the Victory Formation was born. It’s specificially designed to be as foolproof as possible, and no turnover has ever occured from the play. Several types of defense have been designed to disrupt the VF, and they’ve only resulted in offsides penalties, fights, and no change to the game situation. The one place it might be acceptable would be in a situation like in Superbowl XLIX (Patriots-Seahawks) where after the interception the Pats had the ball on the 1 yard line and needed to kill the clock. With little margin to move backwards and cause a safety, the Seahawks could stack the line and realistically try to tackle Brady in the endzone. As a result, the Pats really didn’t use the standard VF, it was more likely a QB sneak-type call. Seattle ended up going offsides and the point was moot. Since the next play was from the 6 yard line after the penalty, the VF at that point was going to succeed. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/87 "2023-10-16T16:28:12Z")
Yes, that’s why I said it has become accepted. But back when it was first introduced, they could have ruled it as an illegal play as it demonstrated poor sportsmanship, and amended the rules to ban it. But they decided not to do that, and so a new play was created. My point has always been, if it’s within the rules, and no one with the power to ban it has banned it, it’s “playing the game”, whether you personally like it or not. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/88 "2023-10-16T17:17:29Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > as it demonstrated poor sportsmanship I’m not sure how taking a knee in VF is poor sportsmanship. Is it poor sportsmanship when a basketball team passes the ball around the perimeter to run down the clock? Is it poor sportsmanship when a soccer team does essentially the same thing? For that matter, was it poor sportsmanship a couple of weeks ago when Patrick Mahomes went to the ground instead of scoring a late touchdown with a 3 point lead, so the Chiefs could then run out the clock? In all cases, the ultimate goal is to win the game. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/89 "2023-10-16T17:28:48Z")
> [@Railer13](#): > > I’m not sure how taking a knee in VF is poor sportsmanship. Well, that was the feeling of [at least some people at the time](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarterback_kneel#History): > Even after the stadium game clock became official, this tradition endured for a time as many coaches in this era considered kneeling cowardly or even unsportsmanlike Attitudes have changed since then, largely because we care a lot more about player safety these days, but at the time, there would have been at least some support for banning such plays. ---
**Author:** ![R.P.McMurphy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/7993a0/32.png) [@R.P.McMurphy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/R.P.McMurphy)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/90 "2023-10-16T19:04:20Z")
In the NHL and the NBA the game should be a standard 4 on 4 players. The players have gotten too big and too fast for the dimensions that were established decades ago. Open up the game. In all levels of hockey the hard cup elbow protector should be outlawed. It causes too many injuries to the player being hit, especially head injuries. The NFL should use in games the safety helmets that they use in practice. ---
**Author:** ![slicedalone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slicedalone/32/12515_2.png) [@slicedalone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slicedalone)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/91 "2023-10-16T19:11:50Z")
How 'bout: A kind of MLB in which the defense gets to decide to end innings, though they still have to get 27 outs in 9 innings. That is, you load up the bases with one out, and the other team gets to say, “OK, inning over!”, knowing that in some later inning they will have to get five outs. Good for pitching changes too. They simply warm up another pitcher while they bat, and have him start the next inning. In fact, you could make it a part of the rule that only one pitcher may pitch in a given inning. If you want to change pitchers, the inning is over. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/92 "2023-10-16T19:18:59Z")
Man, I would game the shit out of that rule. Declare all innings at an end just before the other team scores a run, while the other team still plays normally for at least a few innings. Get a few runs during those innings, and then force the other team to try to beat that score all in one, super-long inning, after they’re already tired from the previous innings. The TV guys would hate me, messing up their commercial schedule like that! ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/93 "2023-10-16T19:24:37Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > then force the other team to try to beat that score all in one, super-long inning, after they’re already tired from the previous innings. Trust me, your pitcher will tire before the batters. ---
**Author:** ![slicedalone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slicedalone/32/12515_2.png) [@slicedalone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slicedalone)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/94 "2023-10-16T19:24:40Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > messing up their commercial schedule like that! Well, no, they’d still get 18 half-innings at more or less unpredictable intervals. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/95 "2023-10-16T19:28:41Z")
Soccer offsides. IMO too often an offside situation occurs due to the defensive players failures. Is there a way to address that? ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/96 "2023-10-16T19:31:43Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > Declare all innings at an end just before the other team scores a run, while the other team still plays normally for at least a few innings. Why do you think the other team will play normally at all and not game the shit out of it too? > [@Horatius](#): > > force the other team to try to beat that score all in one, super-long inning, after they’re already tired from the previous innings. Baseball is not a tiring sport except for the pitcher and the catcher. After all, teams used to routinely play double headers without much difficulty. If you give the other team a superlong inning, your pitcher is going to be really tired towards the end. You can’t sub him out because that would end the inning and you still have to give the other team lots of outs. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/97 "2023-10-16T19:32:11Z")
Meh, lob a few softballs, and count on the fielders to get them out. I’m looking to disrupt systems here, folks! ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/98 "2023-10-16T19:33:19Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > Why do you think the other team will play normally at all and not game the shit out of it too? I didn’t say this would be a season-long strategy, but for one game, it would certainly get me talked about! ---
**Author:** ![slicedalone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slicedalone/32/12515_2.png) [@slicedalone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slicedalone)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/99 "2023-10-16T19:43:56Z")
Funny thing is, you could try this strategy in a table game, Stratomatic or APBA or something, easily, I think it would be fun to see which strategies work and which ones backfire. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578/100 "2023-10-16T22:09:35Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But in baseball, there is no mechanism for the defending team to score a run. You can’t catch a flyball and then sprint around the bases, or something. And that’s the problem with the baseball. It needs the equivalent of an onside kick in the 9th to keep things exciting. Was there a mention of multi-ball somewhere above? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-rules-changes-in-all-four-major-u-s-sports-that-completely-fix-their-flaws/991578.md?page=6)