# Resolved: The US should bomb Syria
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [August 31, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695 "2013-08-31T21:34:23Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 3
### Author:  [@openminder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/openminder)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/41 "2013-09-01T22:09:40Z")
> [@newcomer](#):
>
> Maybe… just maybe it’s time to entertain some other possibilities of what’s going on, what the long term goal is and who is behind all of this. Maybe, just maybe when you have a contradictory evidence or conclusion that contradicts reality… maybe it’s time to question evidence or conclusion?
How about this? Stop supporting the rebels. There will always be some nitpicks within a country opposing the country’s policy. Majority of Syrian support for Assad. These nitpicks pick to fight to overthrow the majority govt.
The mainstream media whom are controlled by certain shadow govt in the west does not tell us where the rebels get their weapons. We know Syria bought theirs from Russia and China. Just like Canada bought our weapons from US and Britain.
USA (under a shadow govt) and the west had more than once duped us into wars. Iraq’s WMD was revealed to be false. We just marched in with no questions and pure utter **ignorance**. Now we were at it again. Are we to be fooled again.
Assad was winning the war. US had previously warned the red line is chemical use. UN team were to arrive on the weekend prior to the chemical incident which took place where the rebels were holding out. UN inspectors were following up on alleged previous incidents. Many recent wars were born out of false flags. Do you not have any ounce of wit to at least question who benefits. Just in case, the rebels have the most to benefit with USA and the west claiming they would attack Assad if chemical is used. Rebels are not winning. Rebels (majority) are not Syrians. Why would they care if Syrians are killed whichever way if they can get the upper hand. Look at how the drum beats were drumming. It is thanks to enough public doubt that held back these so call govt back.
Don’t blame this all on Obama or even Bush or even congress. They are just puppets. Before they are voted into office, they swear allegiance to this \_\_\_\_. They are acting on behalf of \_\_\_\_, not to their country or Americans, though some had duel citizenships.
---
### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/42 "2013-09-01T22:12:37Z")
> [@Musicat](#):
>
> One out of two ain’t bad. A 50% rate will lead to how many lost lives this time? Will bombing _save_ lives? :rolleyes: What exactly are our objectives? Getting the Arabs to hate us more than they already do?
This is what is particularly bad in my mind, the lack of clear objectives or linking these proposed limited cruise missile strikes to these objectives.
If our objective is regime change, it’ll take a much more serious effort than these strikes. Even if our objective is to deny Assad use of his chemical weapons, a few cruise missiles simply doesn’t do that. I don’t really see many/any scenarios where I’d support basically stepping into a ready-made quagmire. However, at least if we were proposing concrete objectives (remove Assad from power, deny him use of his chemical weapons) and planning things that could **actually achieve** those goals, it’d at least be more worthy of discussion.
What we’re talking about here is launching explosives at a Middle Eastern country basically for symbolic purposes. I don’t think cruise missiles are there to be used for symbolism purposes.
---
### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/43 "2013-09-01T22:13:02Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Don’t blame this all on Obama or even Bush or even congress. They are just puppets. Before they are voted into office, they swear allegiance to this \_\_\_\_. They are acting on behalf of \_\_\_\_, not the country or Americans.
We should blame the Illuminati instead?
---
### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/44 "2013-09-01T22:14:13Z")
> [@openminder](#):
>
> How about this? Stop supporting the rebels. There will always be some nitpicks within a country opposing the country’s policy. Majority of Syrian support for Assad. These nitpicks pick to fight to overthrow the majority govt.
>
> The mainstream media whom are controlled by certain shadow govt in the west does not tell us where the rebels get their weapons. We know Syria bought theirs from Russia and China. Just like Canada bought our weapons from US and Britain.
>
> USA (under a shadow govt) and the west had more than once duped us into wars. Iraq’s WMD was revealed to be false. We just marched in with no questions and pure utter **ignorance**. Now we were at it again. Are we to be fooled again.
>
> Assad was winning the war. US had previously warned the red line is chemical use. UN team were to arrive on the weekend prior to the chemical incident which took place where the rebels were holding out. UN inspectors were following up on alleged previous incidents. Many recent wars were born out of false flags. Do you not have any ounce of wit to at least question who benefits. Just in case, the rebels have the most to benefit with USA and the west claiming they would attack Assad if chemical is used. Rebels are not winning. Rebels (majority) are not Syrians. Why would they care if Syrians are killed whichever way if they can get the upper hand. Look at how the drum beats were drumming. It is thanks to enough public doubt that held these so call govt back.
>
> Don’t blame this all on Obama or even Bush or even congress. They are just puppets. Before they are voted into office, they swear allegiance to this \_\_\_\_. They are acting on behalf of \_\_\_\_, not the country or Americans.
The mainstream media reports substantially on who is arming the rebels. A lot of it is coming from Saudi Arabia (which hates Assad) and Qatar. Saudi Arabia and Qatar are both cash rich states with interests in Syrian outcomes, and they actually conflict a bit in which rebel groups they have chosen to support. There is also support coming from al-Qaeda in Iraq and other affiliated groups, as well as some material support from Europe and the United States.
---
### Author:  [@openminder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/openminder)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/45 "2013-09-01T22:22:38Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> We should blame the Illuminati instead?
these are just disinformations to discredit the whistleblowers.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/MeVBa4lSscw?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque
n - s- a is watching.
---
### Author:  [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/46 "2013-09-01T22:31:48Z")
> [@Musicat](#):
>
> One out of two ain’t bad. A 50% rate will lead to how many lost lives this time? Will bombing _save_ lives? :rolleyes: What exactly are our objectives? Getting the Arabs to hate us more than they already do?
## Our objectives are to persuade Assad that it’s in his best interest not to use chemical weapons. As stated in the OP.
I found a story on the false flag hypothesis, written by the journalist Dale Gavlak, who has done reporting for AP, NPR and the BBC. It’s at an obscure website: [EXCLUSIVE: Syrians In Ghouta Claim Saudi-Supplied Rebels Behind Chemical Attack](http://www.mintpressnews.com/witnesses-of-gas-attack-say-saudis-supplied-rebels-with-chemical-weapons/168135/). The idea is that the Saudi intelligence chief has the means and motive to supply chemical weapons to the Syrian insurgence. Allegedly they did not provide proper training and some of the supplied weapons went off. (Link found via [FAIR](http://www.fair.org/blog/2013/09/01/which-syrian-chemical-attack-account-is-more-credible/) and the [Washington Monthly](http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/political-animal-a/2013_09/harkin_unimpressed_by_the_case046684.php).)
## I trust there will be more picking apart of the intelligence over the next week or so.
John Mace: I was drawing a distinction between pure air wars and invasions. In Libya, air-only participation by the US succeeded in overthrowing Kadaffi without turning most of the populace against us. Historical analogies are of limited use, but the point I was making was reasonably narrow.
Martin Hyde: If our objective is regime change, it seems to me that air strikes at the levels proposed are pointless. If they work it would be predicated on the contention that lobbing an additional chemical weapon won’t provide Assad with substantially greater military advantage. It might be preferable to him to rely on his clear superiority in the air and artillery and forgo chem weapons so as to keep the US out of the conflict. No historical analogies, just an appeal to Assad’s self interest.
If we are to believe the linked article above, the Saudis are running a more ambitious playbook.
---
### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/47 "2013-09-01T22:32:27Z")
> [@openminder](#):
>
> these are just disinformations to discredit the whistleblowers.
>
> [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeVBa4lSscw](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeVBa4lSscw)
>
> n - s- a is watching.
So you’re saying that the US is being run by a secret cabal of Jews more concernd about Israel than the US?
If so, what makes you say so?
Could you provide some credible evidence from reliable sources?
Thanks.
---
### Author:  [@openminder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/openminder)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/48 "2013-09-01T22:35:19Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> So you’re saying that the US is being run by a secret cabal of Jews more concernd about Israel than the US?
>
> If so, what makes you say so?
>
> Could you provide some credible evidence from reliable sources?
>
> Thanks.
History repeats itself under ignorance
[![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/kjOH1XMAwZA/hqdefault.jpg ""USS Liberty: Dead In The Water" (BBC Documentary 2002)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjOH1XMAwZA)
---
### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/49 "2013-09-01T22:35:57Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#):
>
> Why on Earth would you assume that a post-Assad Syria would be secular, or that the Arab world would permit a US or UN led effort to oust Assad to install a secular government? Do you actually know anything about the issue that you didn’t read in the US press or coming from the US government which has every reason to portray Assad and his actions (real and purported) in nothing but the worst light?
>
> When you’ve already reduced a conflict to “Us vs. Them” you’ve eliminated any point of discussion or debate.
>
> Stranger
Are you under the impression Syria under Assad is “secular”?
Beyond that, perhaps you could define for us what you mean by “Secular”.
---
### Author:  [@openminder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/openminder)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/50 "2013-09-01T22:44:31Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> So you’re saying that the US is being run by a secret cabal of Jews more concernd about Israel than the US?
>
> If so, what makes you say so?
>
> Could you provide some credible evidence from reliable sources?
>
> Thanks.
Cabals come from all races.
examples of good people:
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDQgyTmxu0k)
https://www.youtube.com/embed/ekrCDffM5Fw?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque
---
### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/51 "2013-09-01T22:46:01Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#):
>
> John Mace: I was drawing a distinction between pure air wars and invasions. In Libya, air-only participation by the US succeeded in overthrowing Kadaffi without turning most of the populace against us. Historical analogies are of limited use, but the point I was making was reasonably narrow.
You claimed “success” in Libya, but our objective was not to overthrow Khadafi there. And what happened afterwards? Local militias took over, and they raided Libyan weapons stockpiles, sending much of that horde into Mali and into the hands of Islamists there. Fortunately, Libya did not have CWs.
If exactly what happened in Libya happens in Syria, that will be a gigantic failure, not a success. And I don’t consider what happened in Libya to be a success, either.
---
### Author:  [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/52 "2013-09-01T22:47:58Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> Are you under the impression Syria under Assad is “secular”?
>
> Beyond that, perhaps you could define for us what you mean by “Secular”.
Well I am under that impression. The Baath Party is suppose to be a secular one. I understand that Assad’s Alawite base is divided between those sympathetic to further democratization, unsympathetic, and positively loony tyrannical. Presumably the first group has been thoroughly marginalized by now. Or a few of them may have switched sides.
ETA: John: And I’m not advocating air strikes at the level we did in Libya. I was merely responding to highly generalized contentions regarding the impotence of air-only actions.
---
### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/53 "2013-09-01T22:48:53Z")
> [@openminder](#):
>
> Cabals come from all races.
>
> examples of good people:
> [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDQgyTmxu0k](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDQgyTmxu0k)
> [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekrCDffM5Fw](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekrCDffM5Fw)
You’re not scoring any debate here by linking to a series of youtube videos. Spell out what your argument is in plain English.
---
### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/54 "2013-09-01T22:56:43Z")
> [@openminder](#):
>
> History repeats itself under ignorance
>
> [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjOH1XMAwZA](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjOH1XMAwZA)
Yup, you’ve convinced me.
ZOG needs to be exposed and destroyed.
The Jews have for too long been getting the goyim to do their bidding.
They fooled us into ripping apart poor Germany after Germany fought back against them and invented something they chose to call the Holocaust and then with their puppets, the Elks, the Masons and the Shriners flooded our countries with drugs, made us take over much of the Middle East and now are trying to get us to make war on the beloved homeland of the Aryan people, also known as Iran.
Worst of all, they have made us for decades mutilate the penises of our male offspring.
Thankfully, there are a courageous few who do stand up to them.
[http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/3934.htm](http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/3934.htm)
---
### Author:  [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/55 "2013-09-01T22:57:31Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#):
>
> I understand that there are no plans to bomb their chemical plants, since that would poison civilians in the area.
That assumes that there _are_ civilians in the area - don’t weapon stockpiles tend to be kept under military control and not in built-up areas?
---
### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/56 "2013-09-01T23:06:55Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#):
>
> Well I am under that impression. The Baath Party is suppose to be a secular one.
You mean the same government who’s Constitution declares “all laws herein are inspired by the Holy Quran” requires the President be “a believing Muslim”, requires religious instruction in schools, has separate schools for Muslims and Christians, requires all Syrians have their religion listed on their national ID, has laws against blasphemy and “insulting Islam”, sponsors religious broadcasts on both the radio and TV, and as late as 2005(I don’t know if it’s still true) had laws making honor killings effectively legal?
And that’s not even bringing up their relations with Hezbollah(Party of God) and the Islamic Revolutionary Government of Iran.
Assad’s government is lots of things, but it’s not “secular”.
---
### Author:  [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/57 "2013-09-01T23:10:23Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> Are you under the impression Syria under Assad is “secular”?
No. What in my post would possibly lead you to believe that I have asserted that Assad’s regime is secular?
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> Beyond that, perhaps you could define for us what you mean by “Secular”.
Interpreted in terms of the US Department of State, “secular” apparently means “subservient to the interests and desires of the United States”.
Stranger
---
### Author:  [@Claverhouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Claverhouse)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/58 "2013-09-01T23:42:08Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> You’re not scoring any debate here by linking to a series of youtube videos. Spell out what your argument is in plain English.
The hint here is to _read the comments_: the clues are all there if you study them and connect the dots.
---
### Author:  [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)
#### Post date: [September 1, 2013, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/59 "2013-09-01T23:53:18Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#):
>
> You’re not scoring any debate here by linking to a series of youtube videos. Spell out what your argument is in plain English.
It’s pretty clear. He thinks the only “good Jews” are those who claim the Holocaust is a hoax and/or rail against the “Holocaust industry” while supporting Hezbollah.
---
### Author:  [@openminder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/openminder)
#### Post date: [September 2, 2013, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/resolved-the-us-should-bomb-syria/667695/60 "2013-09-02T02:40:39Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#):
>
> Thankfully, there are a courageous few who do stand up to them.
>
> [http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/3934.htm](http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/3934.htm)
problem is there are millions who are so uninformed. I think the reporters and journalists do want to speak out but are afraid of being ostracized
my profound thanks to individuals mentioned here:
https://www.youtube.com/embed/7rMtKgLMEl8?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque
Remember the young man referred in the above youtube had a 10K??/month job in Hawaii. Tell me who would give that up. Our society is heading towards Orwellian state. That young man and many others as you have mentioned whom society owes a great deal to if we could be saved.
GG and DM latter being detained. Talk about free world free speech, democratic…
https://www.youtube.com/embed/9oDnktdzVyA?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque
“Fighting ignorance since …”
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