# Restaurant discounts with church flyers **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 2, 2011, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439 "2011-05-02T02:55:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/181 "2011-05-04T10:35:30Z")
Everyone knows that the only thing that tastes better than Horcakes and syrup are discount Pancakes. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/182 "2011-05-04T11:42:33Z")
> [@Bearflag70](#): > > “Forgive us our trespasses. We just want a Rooty Tooty Fresh 'N Fruity.” I will give you cash money if you can get that into the Lord’s Prayer in an actual service. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/183 "2011-05-04T12:02:52Z")
Disclaimer: I skipped pages 2 & 3 of this thread. These restaurant discounts with church bulletins are common here in St. Louis, with us being well within the bible belt & all. I’m an atheist. But I like discounts. Seems like an insoluble dilemma, right? Not really. My solution is simple. There are always church bulletins blowing around in the restaurant parking lot where the clods who brought them in drop them as litter outside when they leave. So I pick one up, go in, get my discount, and dispose of it properly. I do a good deed for the Earth, get to feel morally superior to an anonymous churchgoer, and I get cheap pancakes or whatever. Trifecta of Win!! Even better if I suspect the restaurant was actually trying to engage in pro-christian discrimination (legal or not). Scamming an evil-doer is much better than scamming an innocent. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/184 "2011-05-04T13:04:22Z")
> [@Bearflag70](#): > > Methinks it is YOU who failed to read the article and it’s relationship to this discussion (as provided upthread). It’s there. Go get it. With all due respect, you have taken sections from the article and then interpreted the facts and circumstances of the OP and drawn your own conclusions. This is the same thing that **treis** has done to support his own arguments. It’s the same thing I’ve done to support my arguments, just from the other side. We’re not judges. So our opinions don’t really count, as to what is legal or not. It is however very interesting that with all of the hoopla about this issue, even with the organizations that the OP posted that have written threatening letters to restaurants coercing them to drop their programs, that there isn’t a single case across the many locations where this is common practice (as attested to by various posters here) that has ruled the practice illegal. Go figure. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/185 "2011-05-04T13:37:08Z")
> [@Gary\_T](#): > > As has been brought up upthread somewhere, you be sure to let me know when some court actually makes a ruling that clearly shows someone has indeed violated a law with this practice. In the meantime, I’ll be sitting here breathing. 😃 > [@Bearflag70](#): > > here is a real case. > [@Bearflag70](#): > > What am I, chopped liver? No, but maybe said liver is obscuring your reading vision. From your same post: “The court said this case was not one of illegal discrimination…” (underlining mine). Compare that to this part of my post quoted above: “…someone has indeed violated a law.” Please note that NOT doing something illegal is, alas, not the same as doing something illegal (i.e., violating a law). In other words, I didn’t ask for a ruling stating that IF someone did such and such it WOULD BE a violation. I asked for a ruling stating that someone DID something that ACTUALLY WAS a violation. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/186 "2011-05-04T13:58:17Z")
This atheist says the whole thing is silly. Seriously…if even TOUCHING a church bulletin is going to make you go up in flames and therefore you can’t get that 20% discount, go to freakin’ Waffle House or Perkins. Geez…you’d think IHOP had put giant neon signs on their roofs that read “ATHEISTS SHOULD BE BURNED AT THE STAKE!!!1!one!” ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/187 "2011-05-04T14:08:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I’d be willing to bet that, a lot of these places, if you went in and told the manager that you weren’t a church-goer, but were wondering about the church bulletin discount, they’d give you the discount anyway. It’s not that they’re specifically trying to encourage religion; they just want to get regular customers who come in for breakfast on a weekly basis. Atheists’ money spends just the same as anyone else’s. I would add that specifying particular days (Wednesday & Friday in the OP, I think) is generally done to encourage business on what would otherwise be a slow night. When I was in retail we’d give discounts like that. ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/188 "2011-05-04T14:32:31Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > I would add that specifying particular days (Wednesday & Friday in the OP, I think) is generally done to encourage business on what would otherwise be a slow night. When I was in retail we’d give discounts like that. How dare you discriminate against all those Christians that can’t come on on Ash Wednesday. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/189 "2011-05-04T14:42:39Z")
Looking at my church bulletin online… and the ads aren’t even in the thing! :eek: That means, that if you want the 10% off coupon at The Egg and I, you have to enter the church! :eek: :eek: OMG, the horror! Or you could, you know, get the better coupon off the Entertainer book my kid sells. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/190 "2011-05-04T14:45:05Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > How dare you discriminate against all those Christians that can’t come on on Ash Wednesday. Tell me about it. What about those restaurants that sell meat, but advertise during Lent about their Friday specials? Huh? Huh?!?! My church is being mocked, nay, _persecuted_ by its own supporters! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/191 "2011-05-04T14:48:43Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > How dare you discriminate against all those Christians that can’t come on on Ash Wednesday. You think that’s bad…wait until IHOP rolls out their “All You Can Eat Ramadan Breakfast” special! ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/192 "2011-05-04T14:53:48Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > You think that’s bad…wait until IHOP rolls out their “All You Can Eat Ramadan Breakfast” special! Or the end-of-Ramadan special, Eggs al-Fitr. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/193 "2011-05-04T14:59:35Z")
> [@Brynda](#): > > As for b) Oh, I don’t care what someone else thinks, I care who I am. I don’t want to claim to be other than who I am to be treated equally. Would you feel ok (assuming you are religious of some sort) claiming to be an atheist to be treated equally? Let me guess, you protest Christmas sales as well? _Damn it, I said charge me full price. I will not take your Christmas discount!_ ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/194 "2011-05-04T15:01:25Z")
So Transgendered Thursdays is a non-starter? ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/195 "2011-05-04T15:03:42Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > So Transgendered Thursdays is a non-starter? I prefer inappropriate touch Tuesday…followed by no eye contact Wednesday. ---
**Author:** ![whiterabbit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/cab0a1/32.png) [@whiterabbit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whiterabbit)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/196 "2011-05-04T15:20:31Z")
Ignoring any legal issues, I’ve lived in places where it is simply assumed that _everybody_ goes to church, where it is a perfectly polite question to ask “Where do you go to church?” Note, not “do you,” but “where.” And if you don’t it’s weird. I bet the managers that thought of this one are of that school of thought. It probably hasn’t even occurred to them that a discount for Christians could possibly be considered offensive or be sticky legally because, well, Christianity is Good and True, so why would there be a problem? Perhaps they think that if a few eeeeeeevil atheists or other non-Christian types go to a church to grab a bulletin they will somehow be converted. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/197 "2011-05-04T15:40:59Z")
> [@dawson](#): > > Your still entitled to full and equal enjoyment of the pancake. How much you pay for a pancake doesn’t change how good, or bad it tastes, or consequently how much you enjoy it. If it did then your saying that the most enjoyable meal you ever had was the one you paid the most for. I doubt that to be true for the vast majority of people. > The chain has an obligation to set a standard price for everyone. They cannot discriminate and charge more than their standard price, but in a free market economy they should be allowed to charge as little as they want to whomever they want. You have the right to refuse to purchase their product, purchase at the standard rate, or get a flyer and receive the discount. No one is stopping you from getting it. If it’s too much trouble for you that is your choice, live with the consequences of your decisions. But your not entitled to a marketplace’s best price just because your you. It’s out there, the onus is on you to get it, not society to bring it to you. > I think your mixing up discrimination with alienation. I’m not mixing up anything with anything. Your interpretation of the law is wrong. You can’t target a discount at a specific protected class . The law is quite clear, and, despite your odd protestations, paying more for the same service is not enjoying equal service. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/198 "2011-05-04T15:43:55Z")
> [@Sleeps\_With\_Butterflies](#): > > So now you’re attaching “church flyer” to a particular religion? It would be pretty difficult to come up with a church flier at a Synagogue, Mosque, or Hindu temple. As has been said earlier, if the restaurant accepts the equivalent from those places and something for atheists, there is not going to be a problem. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/199 "2011-05-04T15:49:44Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > With all due respect, you have taken sections from the article and then interpreted the facts and circumstances of the OP and drawn your own conclusions. This is the same thing that **treis** has done to support his own arguments. It’s the same thing I’ve done to support my arguments, just from the other side. We’re not judges. So our opinions don’t really count, as to what is legal or not. > > It is however very interesting that with all of the hoopla about this issue, even with the organizations that the OP posted that have written threatening letters to restaurants coercing them to drop their programs, that there isn’t a single case across the many locations where this is common practice (as attested to by various posters here) that has ruled the practice illegal. Go figure. It is telling that any company big enough to have a legal department doesn’t actually offer discounts for church fliers. They offer the discount for the church flyer, any other religion’s flyer, or anyone that asks for it. As Bearflag’s cited case says, if the ball club didn’t do so, they would have been in violation of the law. That is why you don’t see any lawsuits. Anyone big enough to be worth suing is in compliance with the law. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439/200 "2011-05-04T16:02:36Z")
> [@Bearflag70](#): > > Methinks it is YOU who failed to read the article and it’s relationship to this discussion (as provided upthread). It’s there. Go get it. I read it. Several times. Perhaps YOU should quote WHERE it states that the judge said it was illegal. Unless you’re talking about this: > [@](#): > > Important to the judge’s ruling, the Suns testified at a hearing in June that the ticket seller placed an extra church bulletin on the counter and told Silverman he could use it for the discount. > > According to the testimony, Silverman refused, proclaiming, “I am not a religious man.” He then paid full price for his tickets. With that, the legal dispute was born. He didn’t have to go out of his way, he was offered the bulletin RIGHT AT THE FREAKING COUNTER. He refused it. There was no discrimination – he had equal access to said “coupon”, he just refused it to make a statement. That’s his right. But then don’t whine that they were “discriminating”. They weren’t. They had extras for people who didn’t bring them in. He didn’t want that, so too bad, so sad. Next time, do your own damned homework. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/restaurant-discounts-with-church-flyers/580439.md?page=11)