# Retaliatory tariffs **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Tags:** trump\ **Created:** [January 24, 2025, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322 "2025-01-24T04:48:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/181 "2025-02-03T16:02:46Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > Trump backs down all the time. He’s already giving Mexico a one month pause on his new tariffs. From his Truth account: > [@](#): > > I just spoke with President Claudia Sheinbaum of Mexico. It was a very friendly conversation wherein she agreed to immediately supply 10,000 Mexican Soldiers on the Border separating Mexico and the United States. These soldiers will be specifically designated to stop the flow of fentanyl, and illegal migrants into our Country. We further agreed to immediately pause the anticipated tariffs for a one month period during which we will have negotiations headed by Secretary of State Marco Rubio, Secretary of Treasury Scott Bessent, and Secretary of Commerce Howard Lutnick, and high-level Representatives of Mexico. I look forward to participating in those negotiations, with President Sheinbaum, as we attempt to achieve a “deal” between our two Countries. ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/182 "2025-02-03T16:35:11Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > I look forward to participating in those negotiations, Oh, boy. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/183 "2025-02-03T19:39:21Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > He’s already giving Mexico a one month pause on his new tariffs. Well, that is what he has _said_. But Trump, mercurial being that he is, could change his mind tomorrow for any reason or for no reason at all. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/184 "2025-02-03T20:13:53Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > And has any economy type person not in the maladministration spoken out in favor of these tariffs? There have been a lot of commentators opposed. The only ones mentioned in this article who support the tariffs are Trumpy Republicans. And that’s who counts, apparently. > **[ANALYSIS | U.S. tariffs on Canada: (Almost) nobody wants this, except the guy...](https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7446585)** > > The American public dislikes them, along with business leaders, many Republicans and nearly all experts. But Trump has a zeal on the import taxes, and surrounding himself with like-minded figures. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/185 "2025-02-03T20:33:08Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Trump’s tariffs are likely to hurt both sides. Wouldn’t other countries raising tariffs just make the problem worse? > > What would Canada gain by doing this? War hurts both sides, yes. But the alternative is rolling over and letting the enemy win. Which doesn’t just screw you over in the short term, it emboldens everyone else to start or continue doing such evil things to you in the future. Some things are worth fighting for. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/186 "2025-02-03T21:03:28Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Some news items (some are paywalled, but trying to give a general scan): Great cites, I found another- > **[Six things that could get more expensive for Americans under Trump tariffs](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvgpvq20qmdo)** > > Economists warn that the introduction of tariffs could lead to prices rising on a wide range of products. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/187 "2025-02-03T21:24:22Z")
> [@wguy123](#): > > He’s already giving Mexico a one month pause on his new tariffs. From his Truth account: If the intent is, really, to negotiate then that would not be backing down. It would be the plan working as stated. That said, Mexico is different from Canada. There are probably real disagreements where the only solutions are that Mexico do the hard thing or cede sovereignty to someone else who will make them do the hard thing. In the case of Canada, the only excuse for the tariffs that I’ve seen is fentanyl. Canada has their own opiate and fentanyl crisis and, I’d expect, was working just as hard to crack down on fentanyl imports as us. In general, it seems to be an imaginary complaint just to create the basis for tariffing them. There’s no actual basis for tariffs except the desire to tariff. It would be like me punching a guy and telling him that he needs to fly me to Mars if he wants me to stop. Either I’m manic with hallucination episodes or I just want to punch the guy and am simply saying the first thing that pops into my head to justify it. Given that we seem to be tariffing on at least one side for the sake of tariffing, my expectation would probably be that, even if Mexico plays ball, they’ll simply get a reduced level of tariffs - say 10% - and get strung along for more “tasks”, that they’ll never be able to accomplish. The goal is to tariff, not to get traction. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/188 "2025-02-03T22:27:35Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > In general, it seems to be an imaginary complaint just to create the basis for tariffing them. There’s no actual basis for tariffs except the desire to tariff. Legally, in order for Trump to tariff without congressional approval, there has to be an “emergency”, and fentanyl was that emergency. His public statements profess wanting to replace income tax with tariffs, which is clearly a non-emergency thing. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/189 "2025-02-03T22:50:53Z")
Since he signed a deal with the San Francisco tech bros, I suspect that we’re looking at the start of a move for a Universal Basic Income. Socialism \o/ From San Francisco \o/ Obviously, we’re going straight to the needs and desires of Trump’s base. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/190 "2025-02-03T22:53:15Z")
This is close to a Factual Question, but it is so political, and the answer is no much a matter of degree, that I will try it here: Was it physically and practically possible for the United States to begin collecting tariffs, for goods entering the U.S. from Mexico and Canada, at 12:01 AM Eastern Time on February 4, 2025? I’ll stipulate that even if needed forms were being printed up the last several days, and if staff was being called in for training (overtime, right?) over the past three days, there would have been long vehicle delays at border stations. My question is – was any real effort being made to have an infrastructure to collect the tariffs? Or was the idea of starting tariffs on Feb. 4 utterly fictional? P.S. This does not apply to China because the new Trump administration tariffs, still apparently on track there, are a rate increase, rather than something all new. P.P.S. Especially since there was no minimum below which the Canada//Mexico tariff applied, there would have been a massive money handling issue. How were travelers supposed to pay? U.S. cash? Canada/Mexico cash? Check? Credit card? If cash, how would it be controlled? P.P.P.S. Is even thirty days long enough to implement tariffs at the Canada and Mexico borders? ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/191 "2025-02-03T23:13:56Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > My question is – was any real effort being made to have an infrastructure to collect the tariffs? Or was the idea of starting tariffs on Feb. 4 utterly fictional? As I noted in another thread (in fact in reply to you) I’m going with the “entirely fictional” interpretation of both the tariff threat and the alleged reasons for it (with respect to Canada; fentanyl and other drug trafficking is a real problem at the Mexico border). It was purely a narcissistic display of power by an idiot who blurts out whatever comes into his head. A serious tariff threat would be (a) backed up by actual facts, and (b) scheduled within an achievable timeframe, not impetuous declarations like “on Day One” or “tomorrow”. ---
**Author:** ![leahcim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b4bc9f/32.png) [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/192 "2025-02-03T23:28:55Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > P.P.S. Especially since there was no minimum below which the Canada//Mexico tariff applied, there would have been a massive money handling issue. How were travelers supposed to pay? U.S. cash? Canada/Mexico cash? Check? Credit card? If cash, how would it be controlled? I assume in the same way that current customs handling is done for anyone who doesn’t say “nothing to declare” when passing through. The infrastructure is there, but even if not the capacity. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2025, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/193 "2025-02-03T23:51:53Z")
> [@leahcim](#): > > I assume in the same way that current customs handling is done for anyone who doesn’t say “nothing to declare” when passing through. The infrastructure is there, but even if not the capacity. AFAIK, the U.S.has not collected customs, at land border entries, for decades. And they have never collected it at Canadian airport facilities such as this, because U.S.-Canada tariff elimination predates their establishment: > **[US Customs at Pearson](https://www.torontopearson.com/en/departures/us-customs-pearson)** > > With US Customs at Pearson Airport, travellers to the US are able to clear US customs and immigration before boarding their flight. Learn more about the process of clearing US customs before your flight, including priority lines and kiosks. The procedures used at U.S. airports could be a starting point, but modifications would be necessary. I’m mostly thinking here of private individual travel because I’m a private individual, but business to business trade would raise more complex issues. The more I think about it – 30 days for planning and implementation is not nearly enough. If Trump insists on that, it will be a cluster you know what. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/194 "2025-02-04T00:02:06Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Was it physically and practically possible for the United States to begin collecting tariffs, for goods entering the U.S. from Mexico and Canada, at 12:01 AM Eastern Time on February 4, 2025? Yes. On the shipment documentation on all goods is the tariff classification, which a harmonised international standard classification. It’s how you know e.g. the value of potash imports from various countries. Or the value of US automotive exports by destination. The code, may have local domestic subcodes (tariff classification order, tariff advise etc) The harmonised tariff code of each country specifies the current tariff, even if free. So Customs know what goods are coming in, when they arrive, their value and hence the tariff levied. US Customs advise the various customs agents of any change of duty rate and the value added to the import invoice. In usual circumstances the duty needs to be paid before the customer can collect the goods and will stay in bond until that occurs. But there is no reason why an invoice can’t follow the goods, just as there can be duty drawbacks, rebates or refunds when the duty is reduced. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/195 "2025-02-04T00:12:05Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I suspect that we’re looking at the start of a move for a Universal Basic Income. Paid in meme-coins so cash yours in early to avoid the insider pump and dump and rug pull that leaves them worth nothing . . . which is what they were worth in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/196 "2025-02-04T00:15:23Z")
penultima\_thule — seems like you know about this. So, if I understand, when a truck enters the U.S. from Mexico, there is a mechanism to pay a tariff if, say, the truck originated in Guatemala. But at the northern border, that wouldn’t apply. Or would it perhaps apply today if the goods had been offloaded from a cargo flight which landed at Vancouver, originating in China? Even if businesses could have paid Trump’s new tariff, there was no minimum or other provision excluding tourists. ---
**Author:** ![penultima\_thule](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penultima_thule/32/3833_2.png) [@penultima\_thule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/penultima_thule)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/197 "2025-02-04T00:42:53Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > But at the northern border, that wouldn’t apply. But it does apply. All imports will include a customs declaration as to the nature and value. How else do you know that any material has crossed from Canada into the US, or vice versa? The driver doesn’t get out and hand over a brown bag of cash to pay the duty. The customers customs agent handles that. > [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Or would it perhaps apply today if the goods had been offloaded from a cargo flight which landed at Vancouver, originating in China? Canadian duty is applicable on arrival at Vancouver. If the goods are on-forwarded to the US then USA duty is due on arrival. The goods will carry the certificate of origin, which will determine US duty. People have been trying to evade paying duty on goods since time immemorial, it’s called smuggling. Customs agents are good, 'cause it’s their job, of detecting this. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/198 "2025-02-04T01:01:12Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > Customs agents are good, 'cause it’s their job, of detecting this. So to put it in my own words, for business-to-business, whatever the economic damage, Trump’s Canada and Mexico tariffs could, as a practical matter, have been collected tomorrow. But for tourists, and business travelers, and people visiting relatives, and American border town residents whose only nearby supermarket is in Canada – that’s where it would have been nearly impossible, with massive border delays I guess that massive border delays is not the same as impossible. But I still suspect that without training, at land border crossings and Canadian airports, on how to collect tariffs from tourists, it would not have been practical. And was there such training? P.S. Someone could say – collect at the American airport, as for travelers arriving from overseas. This requires changing the current systems. Not an overnight project! ---
**Author:** ![Culling\_The\_Herd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Culling\_The\_Herd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Culling_The_Herd)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/199 "2025-02-04T22:35:43Z")
Seems to me Trump has gotten concessions from Columbia, Panama, Mexico and Canada just by threatening action. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [February 4, 2025, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322/200 "2025-02-04T22:41:05Z")
What actual concessions and not things that were already in place? And it’s Colombia. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/retaliatory-tariffs/1013322.md?page=11)