# (Return of the) Discworld Reading Club 7: Pyramids **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 13, 2006, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886 "2006-01-13T21:51:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/1 "2006-01-13T21:51:47Z")
By the will of the Great A’tun, I resurrect the Discworld reading club! 😃 (For those who missed them, the previous DWRC threads are: [DWRC 1: The Color of Magic](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=319942) [DWRC 2: The Light Fantastic](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322121) [DWRC 3: Equal Rites](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=323881) [DWRC 4: Mort](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=325906) [DWRC 5: Sourcery](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=329316) [DWRC 6: Wyrd Sisters](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=331474)) Appropriately enough, just as the DWRC returns from beyond, the next book in the queue is **Pyramids,** otherwise known as _How to Become a Pharoah Without Training._ As with a number of early Discworld titles, this is a fun read, but not particularly deep. It’s primarily intended as a sendup of Egyptian stereotypes, especially the animal-heads-on-people-gods and royal-inbreeding cliches. Still, despite its light tone, **Pyramids** has a number of memorable characters. Teppic, especially, strikes me as regretfully ignored; I’m a bit disappointed that he hasn’t popped up in any subsequent novels, if only as a cameo (hey, it’d be a break from dropping Carrot or Granny Weatherwax into everything). Dil and his sons were also fun, but admittedly it’s hard to work them into other stories. The most interesting thing about **Pyramids,** though, is Dios. He’s not cut from the Evil Grand Vizer cloth, but is simply a single-minded person driven by ceremony and repetition. If the road to Hell is paved with good intentions, the road to Djel is paved with Dios’ rituals. And to shamelessly plug my [Terry Pratchett quotes collection,](http://www.electric-escape.net/quotes) here’s my favorite **Pyramids** quote: > [@](#): > > **Teppicymon:** “I hate pyramids.” > **Ashk-ur-men-tep:** “You do not.” > **Teppicymon:** “Excuse me, but I do.” > **Ashk-ur-men-tep:** “But you do not. What you feel nowe is myld dislike. When you have lain in one for a thousand years, _then_ you will begin to know the meaning of hate.” 😃 Fun book. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/2 "2006-01-13T21:55:26Z")
I just wanted to say, hooray! I’ll chime in Monday with my thoughts re: Pyramids ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/3 "2006-01-13T22:18:45Z")
Pyramids probably ties for my least favorite Discworld novel with Sourcery and Monstrous Regiment. Dios is a good character, as was the camel, but none of the other characters are all that memorable, and I don’t really like Pteppic. (I also don’t like the whole “Pt” thing. Yes, Terry, we know about Ptolmey, but you’re just being cute. Same with the Djelibeli thing) Part of the problem was the pacing, which was uneven (and which is a problem in a lot of the earlier Discworld books) There’s a long period of time where nothing happens and then everything happens at once. Small Gods was a much better look at the Om-Ephebe-Tsort-Djelibeli region. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2006, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/4 "2006-01-13T23:08:17Z")
I particularly liked the insight it gave us into the Assassin’s Guild. I’d love to see a book centering on the AG… although it might be kind of redundant considering how much AG already showed us. On another note, I really liked Ptracy. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2006, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/5 "2006-01-14T01:11:02Z")
> [@Captain Amazing](#): > > Same with the Djelibeli thing Djelibeybi ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2006, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/6 "2006-01-14T16:16:06Z")
I like Pyramids. Most notable for me is our first real look at the philosophers - ground we’d revisit in _Small Gods_ - also Dios reads _in some ways_ as a first pass at Vorbis - a personified comment on singleminded religion, I think. Certainly that sort of thing is much better dealt with in _SG_, but I can see the cogs begin to turn here. I liked the whole assasin’s school beginning, too. Something proto-Potter about it, but what, I can’t quite articulate. Also, the whole thing is a wonderful pisstake of the sort of pseudoscience beliefs of pyramidiots who try and use them to sharpen razors. Sharp wit there… Definitely there are serious undertones to the whole book - more of Pterry’s humanist philosophy, not just a silly romp. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2006, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/7 "2006-01-14T16:58:53Z")
I like Pyramids a lot, too. I actually have a first edition copy - the only first edition I own, and it was not on purpose. I loved the Assassin’s Guild stuff. And I loved the “test”, although I was disappointed when It wasn’t a real person! I also liked the whole Godhead thing, with the corn stalks, etc. And the smuggler ship. I have based many smugglers ships on that one - looks fat and looks like it wallows like a cow but moves like an angel. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2006, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/8 "2006-01-14T17:00:28Z")
Oh, and I’m SO happy this is back up! ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2006, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/9 "2006-01-15T18:41:30Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Most notable for me is our first real look at the philosophers - ground we’d revisit in _Small Gods_ - also Dios reads _in some ways_ as a first pass at Vorbis - a personified comment on singleminded religion, I think. Certainly that sort of thing is much better dealt with in _SG_, but I can see the cogs begin to turn here. I can’t quite make the Dios == Vorbis connection myself. Dios was a well-intentioned but misguided caretaker, whereas Vorbis was a self-serving malicious bastard. Dios would have been appaled at Vorbis’ action, and doubtlessly would have pointed him as an example of the barbarism of the “false religions” outside. > [@MrDibble](#): > > I liked the whole assasin’s school beginning, too. Something proto-Potter about it, but what, I can’t quite articulate. Teppic, Chidder, et al are supposed to be a parody of the old “Tom Brow’s Schooldays” children’s books, according to the Annotated Pratchett File. I guess that sort of thing goes back. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2006, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/10 "2006-01-15T22:12:49Z")
I mostly didn’t like the ending. The entire “unending Dios” line was overly cute. In other news, I think that people are bit too hard on Vorbis. He was perfectly religious. It was, as it happeneed, that he was a devout follower of a very cold and unpleasant god. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/11 "2006-01-16T11:49:39Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > I like Pyramids. > > Most notable for me is our first real look at the philosophers - ground we’d revisit in _Small Gods_ - also Dios reads _in some ways_ as a first pass at Vorbis - a personified comment on singleminded religion, I think. Certainly that sort of thing is much better dealt with in _SG_, but I can see the cogs begin to turn here. > > I liked the whole assasin’s school beginning, too. Something proto-Potter about it, but what, I can’t quite articulate. > > Also, the whole thing is a wonderful pisstake of the sort of pseudoscience beliefs of pyramidiots who try and use them to sharpen razors. Sharp wit there… > > Definitely there are serious undertones to the whole book - more of Pterry’s humanist philosophy, not just a silly romp. Proto-Potter my fat, hairy arse. You’d think no-one had ever written a school story before Rowling. Not just Tom Brown, but Malory Towers and half a hundred others, and only a few years ago there was hardly a children’s annual but had a school story in it. I really, really like You Bastard, the great mathematician. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/12 "2006-01-16T15:02:41Z")
Oh, I totally forgot about the camel. I still call one of my math-savvy friends You Bastard affectionately. ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/13 "2006-01-16T17:26:09Z")
Sorry that I didn’t continue the threads. I kinda lost interest when no one else was actually re-reading the books but me. Anyway, I think Pyramids is a sort of trial run for Small Gods. Not that I think Pterry\* intended it as such -but I think he was flexing his writing muscles to see what he could get away with. This is the first real outing into him making fun of our own world, instead of having fun and making parody of the fantasy genre.As such,ity’s very good, though of course it pales as compared to his later works. \*I don’t know when the fans started calling him Pterry, but if it was prior to Pyramids, then I bet the whole Pt thing is more a nod to that than something to do with Ptolemy. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/14 "2006-01-16T20:34:25Z")
> [@The Gaspode](#): > > Sorry that I didn’t continue the threads. I kinda lost interest when no one else was actually re-reading the books but me. Heh. I’m back up to _The Fifth Elephant_ right now… ---
**Author:** ![The\_Punkyova](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@The\_Punkyova](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Punkyova)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/15 "2006-01-16T21:39:52Z")
> [@The Gaspode](#): > > Sorry that I didn’t continue the threads. I kinda lost interest when no one else was actually re-reading the books but me. I was reading them. It was my excuse to go out and buy the ones I didn’t have yet. I don’t post a lot because I don’t have anything particularly incisive to say. I remember the pyramid stuff. I was at a spend the night party and the father of the household had made a little cardboard pyramid that he kept his razor under. Even as an 8-year-old, I knew that was dumb. In some ways, having the central conceit of the book be a slap at a long-gone fad makes the book less funny. But it isn’t just a one note satire\*, and there is plenty of other stuff in there. It’s fun, if not as great as things eventually got. \*My biggest “complaint” about later books is the constant complaining about the class system. Yes, we get it, privelege based on birth is dumb. I wonder if the class system is that much more overt and pervasive in Britain, or if it is just Pratchett’s personal bete noir. In either case, I keep wanting him to move on and make fun of something else, already. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2006, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/16 "2006-01-16T21:54:46Z")
> [@The Gaspode](#): > > \*I don’t know when the fans started calling him Pterry, but if it was prior to Pyramids, then I bet the whole Pt thing is more a nod to that than something to do with Ptolemy. It began just after Pyramids was released, on alt.fan.pratchett. It can probably even be traced back to an individual person who started it. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2006, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/17 "2006-01-17T00:45:49Z")
> [@smiling bandit](#): > > In other news, I think that people are bit too hard on Vorbis. He was perfectly religious. It was, as it happeneed, that he was a devout follower of a very cold and unpleasant god. Who? Om? This is more of a discussion for the next thread, but while Om was, especially before his encounter with Brutha, fairly cold and unpleasant, he was still infinitely more compassionate and less cruel than Vorbis, and in fact, Om ends up being the one to kill Vorbis. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2006, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/18 "2006-01-17T06:54:48Z")
A Pyramids quote that I particularly liked was when Xeno and Ibid were bickering… “Ibid is a well-known authority on everything,” said Xeno. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2006, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/19 "2006-01-17T10:32:37Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > I can’t quite make the Dios == Vorbis connection myself. Dios was a well-intentioned but misguided caretaker, whereas Vorbis was a self-serving malicious bastard. Dios would have been appaled at Vorbis’ action, and doubtlessly would have pointed him as an example of the barbarism of the “false religions” outside. I very carefully said “_in some ways_” - I even italicised it, for Pete’s sake. I never said “Dios == Vorbis”, just that they shared a certain singlemindedness about their take on religion, even when that take is at odds with the observed reality around them. And they are both willing to sacrifice others in serving their singleminded ends. Now, those are not the same ends, and I never said they were. Just that one has the seeds of part of the other’s character in him. > [@rjung](#): > > Teppic, Chidder, et al are supposed to be a parody of the old “Tom Brow’s Schooldays” children’s books, according to the Annotated Pratchett File. I guess that sort of thing goes back. Naah, it’s not that - I’ve read enough public school stuff, from Tom Brown all the way to Billy Bunter and annuals like Valiant and Mandy, to get the antecedents. I _ **did** _ say it was hard to articulate, but there’s something in the modern style of TP that Rowling also has, but the earlier stuff lacked. I wouldn’t be surprised if JK had read TP, given he was Britain’s best selling author befor her. If all you think I’m getting at is the public school setting, you’re mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2006, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886/20 "2006-01-17T11:38:58Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Proto-Potter my fat, hairy arse. You’d think no-one had ever written a school story before Rowling. Amen. And there was even a series called _The Worst Witch_ that was set in a witches school, and the protagonist was an ordinary student and not some smug little “chosen one” git. > [@Malacandra](#): > > Not just Tom Brown, but **Malory Towers** and half a hundred others, and only a few years ago there was hardly a children’s annual but had a school story in it. You see, it’s stuff like this that makes people think you’re a girl! You probably read Trebizon as well. > [@matt's sister](#): > > Harry Potter’s kind of like Mallory Towers, but with spells! > [@Malacandra](#): > > I really, really like You Bastard, the great mathematician. 😃 To make him go, you hit him with a stick. To make him stop, you _really_ hit him with a stick… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/return-of-the-discworld-reading-club-7-pyramids/339886.md?page=2)