# Rice blamed "extremists w/ heavy weapons" not protesters, crowds or movie. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 19, 2013, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717 "2013-05-19T02:43:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/21 "2013-05-20T04:20:21Z")
> [@bbonden](#): > > I am not sure what the OP is trying to disprove/rebut. > > But it was known, from minute 1, that there was no protest at the diplomatic mission in Benghazi. Any mention of a “demonstration” or a “gathering” or a “mob” or a “copycat . . . of Cairo” is fiction. And it was known to be fiction at the time. > > Keep in mind, there were real-time audio links between Benghazi and Tripoli, and Tripoli and Washington. There was email. There surely was some fog of war, but there were no particular mysteries. Heck, the US even knew the perpetrators in real time: > > [http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-idUSBRE89N02C20121024](http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-idUSBRE89N02C20121024) > > Nor is there any suggestion of a counter-story, other than one put out as PR. There were seventeen security cameras at the Benghazi compound, and yet there is not one video snippet, or still shot, of anything resembling a protest. We appear to have the last communications out of Benghazi from Ambassador Stevens and Sean Smith. Neither mentioned a protest. There are dozens of Americans who were in Benghazi on September 11, 2012 with some knowledge of the events (albeit most of them, it seems, at the Annex and not the mission). None of them have mentioned a protest. > > To the contrary, the notable images in the security videos are of “a large number of people – a large number of men, armed men, flowing into the compound.” > > [http://factcheck.org/2012/10/benghazi-timeline/](http://factcheck.org/2012/10/benghazi-timeline/) > > It certainly is possible that some attackers were motivated by the video; I have my opinions, but who am I to say what was in someone elses head? What is not possible is that Benghazi was anything at all like Cairo, or that any informed person thought that it was. Other than the the date and the presence of US State Department personel and facilities, there were no similarities at all. > > For what it is worth, I expressly include the 9/14/12 4:42 iteration of the “talking points” promulgated by the CIA. To me, that is where the mystery starts. Then you still need to explain FIRST why everyont think Susan Rice ‘blame the move’ or blamed the protest. She clearly blamed the Extremists that brought heavy weapons. And then you need to explain SECOND why the CIA clearly and unequivocally was quite certain enough to produce Talking Points for the House of Representatives and in those talking points the CIA declared there was a protest, a crowd gathered and it was spontaneous because of the events in Cairo. Here is the first talking point draft sent to the White House on September 14 at around 5 PM. > [@](#): > > ORIGINAL CIA revised draft of TALKING POINTS (9/14/12 04:42 PM): > > See Link to Ibtimes for scroll of 100 originals released by the White House. > > (START) We believe based on currently available information that the demonstrations in Benghazi were spontaneously inspired by the protests at the U.S. Embassy in Cairo and evolved into a direct assault against the U.S. Consulate and subsequently its annex. This assessment may change as additional information is collected and analyzed and currently available information continues to be evaluated. On 10 September we warned of social media reports calling for a demonstration in front of the Embassy and that jihadists were threatening to break into the Embassy. > > The crowd almost certainly was a mix of individuals from across many sectors of Libyan society. That being said, we do know that Islamic extremists with ties to al-Qa’ida participated in the attack.Initial press reporting linked the attack to Ansar al-Sharia. The group has since released a statement that its leadership did not order the attacks, but it did not deny that some of its members were involved. > > The wide availability of weapons and experienced fighters in Libya almost certainly contribute to the lethality of the attacks. > > The Agency has produced numerous pieces on the threat of extremists linked to al-Qa’ida in Benghazi and eastern Libya. These noted that since April, there have been at least five other attacks against foreign interests in Benghazi by unidentified assailants, including the June attack against the British Ambassador’s convoy. We cannot rule out the individuals has [sic] previously surveilled the U.S. facilities, also contributing to the efficacy of the attacks. > > We working with Libyan Authorities and intelligence partners in an effort to help bring justice those responsible for the deaths of US citizens. > > [the daily howler: 2013](http://dailyhowler.blogspot.com/2013)…-benghazi.html > > [http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...did-it-know-it](http://www.motherjones.com/politics/...did-it-know-it) > > [Newly Released Benghazi Emails Reveal Talking Points Timeline [FULL TEXT TRANSCRIPT] | IBTimes](http://www.ibtimes.com/newly-release...script-1262877) (see page 14 and 15 on the scroll of 100 email documents} > Page 21 (5:09 p.m.): A version of talking points is sent to the White House and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence at 5:09 p.m. This is the second draft of the talking points, when the reference to “attack” was changed to “demonstrations.” ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/22 "2013-05-20T04:31:51Z")
> [@bbonden](#): > > I am not sure what the OP is trying to disprove/rebut. > > But it was known, from minute 1, that there was no protest at the diplomatic mission in Benghazi. Any mention of a “demonstration” or a “gathering” or a “mob” or a “copycat . . . of Cairo” is fiction. And it was known to be fiction at the time. > > Keep in mind, there were real-time audio links between Benghazi and Tripoli, and Tripoli and Washington. There was email. There surely was some fog of war, but there were no particular mysteries. Heck, the US even knew the perpetrators in real time: > > [http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-idUSBRE89N02C20121024](http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-idUSBRE89N02C20121024) > > . You made a claim that it was known on day one yet you provide a link Reuters that is dated about DAY 45… what is up with that? > [@](#): > > By Mark Hosenball > > WASHINGTON | Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:11pm EDT > > (Reuters) - Officials at the White House and State Department were advised two hours after attackers assaulted the U.S. diplomatic mission in Benghazi, Libya, on September 11 that an Islamic militant group had claimed credit for the attack, official emails show. And you link is flawed when it mentions “an Islamic militant group had claimed credit for the attack” See the Talking Points - the real ones, not the Republican ones. The CIA mentioned an email that a group claimed credit for the attack but the CIA on Day 4 had contact with that groups leadership and they denied responsibility … but said some of its members could have participated. So that email was a fraud. You should not rely on news reports and hearsay… Did Susan Rice blame the Video or did she blame ‘extremists’? Don’t feel bad I’ve been asking this question over six months.. Very few want to answer it for some reason. I don’t see what the problem is. I really don’t. Can I get an answer? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/23 "2013-05-20T04:40:45Z")
Further reading of the Reuters link reveals that the report explains it all. And the Admin explanation is valid is has been verified by the release of the emails; > [@](#): > > Administration spokesmen, including White House spokesman Jay Carney, citing an **unclassified assessment prepared by the CIA, maintained for days that the attacks likely were a spontaneous protest against an anti-Muslim film.** > While officials did mention the possible involvement of “extremists,” they did not lay blame on any specific militant groups or possible links to al Qaeda or its affiliates until intelligence officials publicly alleged that on September 28. > > There were indications that extremists with possible al Qaeda connections were involved, but also evidence that the attacks could have erupted spontaneously, they said, adding that government experts wanted to be cautious about pointing fingers prematurely. > > **U.S. intelligence officials have emphasized since shortly after the attack that early intelligence reporting about the attack was mixed.** Why are people saying that they know somehow that the CIA was not mixed in the immediate aftermath of the attack.? ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/24 "2013-05-20T13:27:34Z")
On Oct 17th, we had this exchange on the SDMB. This is a full month after the attacks on 9/11/12, and you’ve got posters on the SDMB who still didn’t know that the attacks weren’t just a riot and were rather a planned and coordinated assault. This is after it had been widely reported and was known by the media and anyone paying attention. This speaks volumes about the administrations ability to craft a narrative that people buy into without questioning. > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/899): > > Weren’t the crowds in Cairo protesting the video the day before the attack in Libya? Also, it was the _Libyans_ who told on-scene reporters that the video was the reason for the riot. Good for the administration to wait until all the facts were known. > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/905): > > That’s just the thing. There wasn’t a riot. > > It didn’t happen. It was either a mistake or a lie to claim there was a riot depending on how much you trust the administration. > > There was an organized terror attack in Libya on 9/11/2012, not a mob rioting. No one disputes this anymore. > > I guess we can put to bed the argument that Obama Administration couldn’t possibly have been hoping to deceive the American people about the nature of the attack since there’s someone right here in this thread who still insists that some riot took place, rather than an organized and planned terror attack. > > Have you been reading the thread? You should make some effort to have knowledge of the basic facts before participating. > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/906): > > My guess is friend Debaser isn’t hung up on facts and reality. Attack Obama with every breath, ignore the details. Rinse, later, repeat. > > Edited to add: What the fuck are you even talking about, Debaser? > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/908): > > In fact there is plenty of dispute. > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/910): > > There was no riot in Libya at all? This is literally the first time I’ve heard this. I tried several Google searches using variations on “Libya riot,” but I haven’t found anything that indicates that there were no riots at all. What source am I missing for this story? > [@The second presidential debate: 10/16/2012](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/the-second-presidential-debate-10-16-2012/637847/923): > > [Boston Globe Today](http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2012/10/17/debate-president-obama-and-mitt-romney-leave-out-libya-details/RctYXwbiSV2NoznKJgVSVP/story.html) > > [Lindsey Graham on the 15th of this month](http://www.greenvilleonline.com/article/20121015/NEWS/310150009/Graham-criticizes-administration-Libya-attack?odyssey=nav%7Chead) > > [Romney, during the debate said it.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/decision2012/2012-presidential-debate-president-obama-and-mitt-romneys-remarks-at-hofstra-university-on-oct-16-running-transcript/2012/10/16/be8bfb9a-17dd-11e2-9855-71f2b202721b_story_4.html) > > Obama didn’t challenge this. It’s not in dispute, except I guess to those of you who don’t know. How is it possible, that despite it being reported in every newspaper in the country that **Miller** and others had no idea what the attack was about? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/25 "2013-05-20T13:53:30Z")
**NFBW** : I’m not going to respond to your wall of text. The facts are very simple. The riot, per Rice, started because of the video. After that, it was “taken over” by extremists who had not planned to do so in advance. No video, no riot. No riot, nothing for the extremists to take over. Q.E.D. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/26 "2013-05-20T14:01:11Z")
From the Boston Globe link in **Debaser’s** post: > [@](#): > > Earlier on Sept. 11, protesters angered by the video had climbed the wall of a US embassy in Cairo and removed an American flag. On Sept. 16, United Nations Ambassador Susan Rice appeared on multiple political talk shows, including NBC’s “Meet the Press,” where she characterized the Benghazi attack as “a spontaneous reaction to what had just transpired hours before in Cairo, almost a copycat of the demonstrations against our facility in Cairo, which were prompted, _of course,_ by the video.” Emphasis, and double emphasis, added. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/27 "2013-05-20T14:19:23Z")
The militia group responsible for the attack issued a statement stating that they were motivated by the video: [QUOTE=Ansar al-Shariah] Ansar al-Shariah Brigade didn’t participate in this popular uprising as a separate entity, but it was carrying out its duties in al-Jala’a hospital and other places where it was entrusted with some duties. The Brigade didn’t participate as a sole entity; rather, **it was a spontaneous popular uprising in response to what happened by the West.** [/QUOTE] I don’t know why people can’t accept that this was motivated by the video. This was a militia group, tasked with providing regional security in the wake of the Gaddafi regime, which was anti-American and pro-sharia law. It’s true that there wasn’t a civilian protest in Benghazi like there was in other cities, but the attack itself was motivated by anger over the video and a general hatred of a continuing American presence in their city. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/28 "2013-05-20T14:23:35Z")
I think the movie was more of an excuse than a motivation-the militia group was going to attack, movie or no movie, but this gave them something to blame other than themselves. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/29 "2013-05-20T14:28:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I think the movie was more of an excuse than a motivation-the militia group was going to attack, movie or no movie, but this gave them something to blame other than themselves. Well I’d agree with that to an extent – it was a spark that set off a bunch of lingering hatred and gave them something to rally around. Similarly, I’m guessing all of the Cairo protesters weren’t too keen on America prior to the video. It’s not like all of that anger came out of nowhere. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/30 "2013-05-20T14:35:42Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I think the movie was more of an excuse than a motivation-the militia group was going to attack, movie or no movie, but this gave them something to blame other than themselves. It also gives the sense that this was supported by the Libyan people, in general, as opposed to that particular militia or extremist or whatever you want to call them. However, I’m not taking any message from them at face value. The Benghazi “affair” was a botched CIA operation, and it appears that the militants knew what they were attacking and that’s why they attacked-- not because of some stupid video. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/31 "2013-05-20T14:45:56Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The Benghazi “affair” was a botched CIA operation, and it appears that the militants knew what they were attacking and that’s why they attacked-- not because of some stupid video. Cite? They attacked the consulate, which is a very obvious US building of little strategic value. They attacked it haphazardly and set it on fire as opposed to looting it for intelligence or equipment. They didn’t attack the CIA annex until several hours later, and they failed to breach it. If their goal was to attack the CIA operation, they sure did have a funny way of doing it. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/32 "2013-05-20T16:53:42Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > Cite? They attacked the consulate, which is a very obvious US building of little strategic value. They attacked it haphazardly and set it on fire as opposed to looting it for intelligence or equipment. They didn’t attack the CIA annex until several hours later, and they failed to breach it. If their goal was to attack the CIA operation, they sure did have a funny way of doing it. This [WSJ article](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204712904578092853621061838.html) is a good read on the subject. It does say that it’s unclear if the militants knew about the CIA, so perhaps I was a bit more emphatic about than I should have been. However, the “Consulate” appears to have been little more than a CIA cover, which tells me we will probably never know the real story, since we all know the first rule about CIA operations. There’s certainly plenty of room for speculation about why the attack took place, but “the video” doesn’t pass the smell test, IMO. Perhaps that’s a debate for another thread, though, since the OP only wants to talk about whether Rice blamed the attack on the video, which she clearly did. There can be no debate about that. Why someone would want to bring that up is beyond me. Unless the OP is trying to make the Republicans look good… ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/33 "2013-05-20T17:38:51Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And Bush never said Iraq was behind 9/11. And he never said it in such a way that millions were convinced of the truth of it. **That’s** some spindoc for yo’ ass! ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/34 "2013-05-20T18:12:07Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > And he never said it in such a way that millions were convinced of the truth of it. **That’s** some spindoc for yo’ ass! You just got whooshed. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/35 "2013-05-20T20:07:23Z")
Maybe its that I don’t have the proper Right wing mud tinted glasses but I’m still stuck with the question of **WHO CARES?** In order for there to be spin or a cover-up there has to be something that was spun or covered up The facts are the a group of heavily armed extremists managed to kill four Americans in Libya including a high ranking member of the state department. Whether this tragedy could have been avoided is worthy of investigation. However whether the extremists were opportunists taking advantage of a spontaneous demonstration or was instead a well planned attack that happened to coincide with protests of the video in Cairo seems totally irrelevant. Can someone please explain to me why I am supposed to view the situation in a better light if it was part of a spontaneous? I think if anything I feel better about the security of our embassies knowing that they were overcome by a planned attack rather than something that was put together on the fly. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/36 "2013-05-20T21:01:53Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > **NFBW** : I’m not going to respond to your wall of text. The facts are very simple. The riot, per Rice, started because of the video. After that, it was “taken over” by extremists who had not planned to do so in advance. No video, no riot. No riot, nothing for the extremists to take over. Q.E.D. That is faulty logic at best. Had there been no video protest in Cairo there would have been no fog of war confusion by the CIA at Benghazi. And then Romney would not have embarrassed himself by accusing the President of sympathizing with the attackers who were mad about the movie. The attack in Benghazi would have been a straightforward attack aimed at the 9/11 anniversary. Then Romney and the right would have had to find another way to politically exploit the deaths of four Americans serving on dangerous foreign soil. But you do admit that you do understand that whether or not a crowd gathered prior to the attack it was extremists that committed the attack - not just a mob that was mad about the video that managed to overtake the Consolate as Rice was told by the CIA that was their assessment at the time. So your complaints must go against the CIA and not against Obama or Hillary or Susan Rice if you you still must muddle language and claim that anybody involved actually blamed the movie. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/37 "2013-05-20T21:33:10Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > That is faulty logic at best. Had there been no video protest in Cairo there would have been no fog of war confusion by the CIA at Benghazi. And then Romney would not have embarrassed himself by accusing the President of sympathizing with the attackers who were mad about the movie. > > The attack in Benghazi would have been a straightforward attack aimed at the 9/11 anniversary. > > Then Romney and the right would have had to find another way to politically exploit the deaths of four Americans serving on dangerous foreign soil. > > But you do admit that you do understand that whether or not a crowd gathered prior to the attack it was extremists that committed the attack - not just a mob that was mad about the video that managed to overtake the Consolate as Rice was told by the CIA that was their assessment at the time. > > So your complaints must go against the CIA and not against Obama or Hillary or Susan Rice if you you still must muddle language and claim that anybody involved actually blamed the movie. I don’t have any complaints except about your misrepresentation of the facts in your OP. Rice said the riots were caused by reaction to the video. That is a fact. And nothing in your post here even addresses that. Bitch about the Republicans all you want, but the thesis in your OP is not only wrong, it’s WTF wrong. This isn’t an issue anyone, other than you, seems to be pushing. As noted in the factcheck link upthread: > [@](#): > > We cannot say whether the administration was intentionally misleading the public. We cannot prove intent. There is also more information to come — both from the FBI, which is conducting an investigation, and Congress, which has been holding hearings. > > But, at this point, we do know that Obama and others in the administration were quick to cite the anti-Muslim video as the underlying cause for the attack in Benghazi that killed four U.S. diplomats… If you want to argue that it was a reasonable assumption to make, that is one thing. But you’re pretending it never happened. Why you want to pretend that, I can’t imagine. Unless, like I said, you are trying to make the Republicans look reasonable by comparison. On that, you’re doing a pretty good job! ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/38 "2013-05-20T21:46:46Z")
> [@steronz](#): > > It’s true that there wasn’t a civilian protest in Benghazi like there was in other cities, but the attack itself was motivated by anger over the video and a general hatred of a continuing American presence in their city. All reporting I have read does not indicate general hatred against Americans. We took part in the coalition that saved a few thousand Benghazi residents from genicide by Gadhaffi’s armored units heading to exterminate the rats, as I believe Gadhaffi put it. This attack was the work of a relatively few extremists and most likely from outsiders. Do you recall the news immediately following the attack that Benghazi residents rose up against a nearby extremist militia complex and drove them away for good. The people of Benghazi loved Amb Stevens and America for their liberation. If what you said is true - I’d like to see the reports. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/39 "2013-05-20T21:49:45Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Maybe its that I don’t have the proper Right wing mud tinted glasses but I’m still stuck with the question of **WHO CARES?** Mostly, Obama haters. > [@](#): > > The facts are the a group of heavily armed extremists managed to kill four Americans in Libya including a high ranking member of the state department. Whether this tragedy could have been avoided is worthy of investigation. However whether the extremists were opportunists taking advantage of a spontaneous demonstration or was instead a well planned attack that happened to coincide with protests of the video in Cairo seems totally irrelevant. Well, if you think it’s worthwhile figuring out how this tragedy could have been avoided, don’t you think we need to know _how it happened_? Whether it was Spontaneous Protesters Gone Wild or a planned attack by Anti-Western Militants. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2013, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717/40 "2013-05-20T21:51:19Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > All reporting I have read does not indicate general hatred against Americans. We took part in the coalition that saved a few thousand Benghazi residents from genicide by Gadhaffi’s armored units heading to exterminate the rats, as I believe Gadhaffi put it. > > This attack was the work of a relatively few extremists and most likely from outsiders. > > Do you recall the news immediately following the attack that Benghazi residents rose up against a nearby extremist militia complex and drove them away for good. > > The people of Benghazi loved Amb Stevens and America for their liberation. > > If what you said is true - I’d like to see the reports. He didn’t say all Libyans were anti-American, but I think we can assume the ones who killed the 4 Americans were not our BFFs. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-blamed-extremists-w-heavy-weapons-not-protesters-crowds-or-movie/658717.md?page=3)