# Rice, shut the fuck up about Iran already **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 9, 2005, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244 "2005-02-09T19:10:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/61 "2005-02-10T17:11:23Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Is there any actual evidence that Iran _has_ a nuclear weapons program? John Bolton’s been frothing about this supposed program for a couple of years, but there’s been precious little to back him up, and now he’s out. Obviously Iran’s been working on a uranium enrichment program, but the obvious civilian uses of that technology preclude any but rabidly paranoid asshats from casually calling that a ‘weapons program’. It bears noting that the esteemed Mr. Bolton is an advocate of a preventive (newspeak: pre-emptive) war with Cuba to take out their WMD capabilities. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/62 "2005-02-10T17:23:25Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > It bears noting that the esteemed Mr. Bolton is an advocate of a preventive (newspeak: pre-emptive) war with Cuba to take out their WMD capabilities. Wow. ---
**Author:** ![InvidiousCourgette](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@InvidiousCourgette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InvidiousCourgette)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/63 "2005-02-10T17:33:26Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > Is there any actual evidence that Iran _has_ a nuclear weapons program? John Bolton’s been frothing about this supposed program for a couple of years, but there’s been precious little to back him up, and now he’s out. Obviously Iran’s been working on a uranium enrichment program, but the obvious civilian uses of that technology preclude any but rabidly paranoid asshats from casually calling that a ‘weapons program’. Not that I am aware of. As far as the nuclear fuel enrichment program goes, it is not against the rules of the non proliferation treaty. What is against the rules is hiding the activity. It is on that specific point that Iran could potentially be brought before the UN security council. I do not think there is any evidence that they have thus far made any attempts to make nuclear weapons. Of course if they succeed with their fuel enrichment program, they are 90% of the way to getting nukes. Hence the diplomatic activity to peruade them to buy fuel rather than make it themselves. ---
**Author:** ![RevCo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@RevCo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RevCo)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/64 "2005-02-10T17:57:04Z")
> [@vinryk](#): > > Why not? Because they are fucking insane. > [@](#): > > Why is the US the only ones who are **justified**? Never stated nor implied that the US were the only ones justified. The US should strive to keep nukes out of the hands of psychos everywhere. I know it’s fun to stroke yourself and believe that America is the problem, it’s not true. There are bad people, worse than the demon US - take my word for it. Everyone shouldn’t have nuclear weapons, no matter how “justified” they are because the US invaded Iraq. > [@](#): > > You have a very weird few of the world. Never stated nor implied i didn’t > [@](#): > > You do realise that their are other countries in the world? :rolleyes: > [@](#): > > And that these are not governed by BushCo? Cute buzzword usage, but equally moronic/meaningless as the previous question ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/65 "2005-02-10T18:37:39Z")
What’d you think of Kerry’s proposal, **RevCo**? ---
**Author:** ![RevCo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@RevCo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RevCo)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/66 "2005-02-10T19:23:40Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > What’d you think of Kerry’s proposal, **RevCo**? Bill Clinton proposed the same thing to North Korea iirc 500000 barrels of oil a year, was it? - it wouldn’t fly because of public opinion/Republican’s in congress from what I saw on Frontline - can’t remember when. We did start construction on Nuclear Reactors in North Korea without the oil, but they continued their weapons program anyway. The right-wing pundits tore Bill Clinton a new asshole over it - I assume the if Kerry had won, they’d do it again. If GWB proposes this, I expect the left wing-pundits would start ripping him a new asshole - what comes around goes around in the asshole ripping dept. ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/67 "2005-02-11T08:25:24Z")
> [@](#): > > Because they are fucking insane. I think there is clear evidence that the same can be said about the US. They see WMD’s where there are none, they attack a country to retaliate for an attack that wasn’t performed, nor supported by that country. Sounds pretty delusional to me. Oh yeah, and since this is the pit, fuck yourself with a clawhammer, you dim-witted US-centric bavoon. ---
**Author:** ![PatriotX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c4cdca/32.png) [@PatriotX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatriotX)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/68 "2005-02-11T12:05:06Z")
> [@RevCo](#): > > Bill Clinton proposed the same thing to North Korea iirc 500000 barrels of oil a year, was it? - it wouldn’t fly because of public opinion/Republican’s in congress from what I saw on Frontline - can’t remember when. > > We did start construction on Nuclear Reactors in North Korea without the oil, but they continued their weapons program anyway. The right-wing pundits tore Bill Clinton a new asshole over it - I assume the if Kerry had won, they’d do it again. If GWB proposes this, I expect the left wing-pundits would start ripping him a new asshole - what comes around goes around in the asshole ripping dept. So, what do _you_ think about the proposal, **RevCo**? ---
**Author:** ![InvidiousCourgette](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@InvidiousCourgette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InvidiousCourgette)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/69 "2005-02-11T12:22:03Z")
> [@vinryk](#): > > Oh yeah, and since this is the pit, fuck yourself with a clawhammer, you dim-witted US-centric bavoon. A bavoon? What is a bavoon? Do you mean a bassoon? You don’t want be messing with a bassoon. A bassoon is a big mother fucker. It has a double reed. You don’t want to be going near a bassoon with a double reed. Even with a claw hammer. Get yourself some WMD’s. Then you are good. A bassoon vs. a WMD. Now that is going to make some telly. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/70 "2005-02-11T12:28:13Z")
Spot on commentary about fucking with Iran from a guy called “the War Nerd”. I encourage people to read other articles too, they all kick ass. [http://www.exile.ru/2005-January-27/war\_nerd.html](http://www.exile.ru/2005-January-27/war_nerd.html) ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/71 "2005-02-11T13:07:47Z")
> [@](#): > > A bavoon? What is a bavoon? Do you mean a bassoon? You don’t want be messing with a bassoon. A bassoon is a big mother fucker. 😃 And a bassoon sounds a lot better than RevCo’s jammering. BTW I love your username. Actually I meant baffoon (is that the right spelling?), but that is quite insulting to our simian friends. ---
**Author:** ![Digital\_Stimulus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@Digital\_Stimulus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Digital_Stimulus)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/72 "2005-02-11T13:20:31Z")
> [@vinryk](#): > > Actually I meant baffoon (is that the right spelling?), but that is quite insulting to our simian friends. You meant _baboon_. Although, you might opt for _buffoon_. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/73 "2005-02-11T14:08:30Z")
> [@RevCo](#): > > Because they are fucking insane. Cite? > [@](#): > > Never stated nor implied that the US were the only ones justified. The US should strive to keep nukes out of the hands of psychos everywhere. What do you call an Administration that start wars under false premises, outright lies and count amongst its most prominent members religious fanatics and blind ideologues? > [@](#): > > I know it’s fun to stroke yourself and believe that America is the problem, it’s not true. Well, as with the rest of your premises, you’re wrong. I know of no one who’s idea of “fun” is dealing with and trying to infuse some common sense into a bunch of warmongering ideologues in control of the most powerful country in the world. > [@](#): > > There are bad people, worse than the demon US - take my word for it. Everyone shouldn’t have nuclear weapons, no matter how “justified” they are because the US invaded Iraq. Your word means nothing to me – however, US actions _do_. Like destroying a country for no good reason – if we discount filling some pockets with outrageous amounts of money – and butchering countless innocents during the process. Sure, there are worse regimes out there, but A-they do not threaten anyone outside their borders, and B-talk about small comfort, is that what the US is reduced to now a days? Secondly, why wouldn’t a sovereign state under threat from the world’s mightiest military be justified in adquiring any means available for their self-defense? Quite the contrary, I’d say it’s their duty to do so. ---
**Author:** ![EmeraldGrue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dc4da7/32.png) [@EmeraldGrue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EmeraldGrue)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/74 "2005-02-11T14:51:31Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > No you’re missing the point totally. What Bush is doing is _making them seek nukes faster!_ > > Shit, by our preemptive war logic, Iran would be within it’s rights to strike us. How warped is that? This is specifically why you don’t let the genie out of the bottle. Will this warped logic lead to an infinite regress, or a vicious circle? US: Iran will strike, so we must strike first. Y’hear that, Iran?! Iran: OMGWTF?! The US is going to strike! We must strike before they do…! US: Iran has threatened to strike us! We must beat them to it! Iran: Quick, ready the nukes, we’ve got to get the US before they get us! US: Fuck, the way things are going, we’ll have to bomb them two years ago! ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/75 "2005-02-11T15:03:29Z")
> [@EmeraldGrue](#): > > Will this warped logic lead to an infinite regress, or a vicious circle? > > US: Iran will strike, so we must strike first. Y’hear that, Iran?! > Iran: OMGWTF?! The US is going to strike! We must strike before they do…! > US: Iran has threatened to strike us! We must beat them to it! > Iran: Quick, ready the nukes, we’ve got to get the US before they get us! > US: Fuck, the way things are going, we’ll have to bomb them two years ago! Soon we’ll be sending each other back in time. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/76 "2005-02-11T15:06:44Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Secondly, why wouldn’t a sovereign state under threat from the world’s mightiest military be justified in adquiring any means available for their self-defense? Quite the contrary, I’d say it’s their duty to do so. It’s one of the jobs of a government to protect the country from outside aggression. If the USA can ignore its international treaty obligations to promote its own self-interest then so can any country. ---
**Author:** ![InvidiousCourgette](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e47c2d/32.png) [@InvidiousCourgette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InvidiousCourgette)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/77 "2005-02-11T15:31:55Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Secondly, why wouldn’t a sovereign state under threat from the world’s mightiest military be justified in adquiring any means available for their self-defense? Quite the contrary, I’d say it’s their duty to do so. True enough, as far as it goes. Iran is, however, being encouraged by the US to believe that it will make itself safer by not attempting to acquire nuclear weapons than by doing so. Which makes one wonder how the Iranians view this. They could look to several other countries and reach different conclusions based on what they see: Libya. Got rid of all weapons programs and now is a quite respected member of the international community. Iraq. Got rid of all weapons programs and were invaded. Regime change is now the after the event justification. N. Korea. Have developed nuclear weapons and have a stronger bargaining position as a result. International pariah, however. If Iran consider themselves at risk of a regime change minded US, it seems like a no brainer for them. They need to get nukes. But for the precedent of Iraq, it would have seemed a much safer option to avoid them completely. ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/78 "2005-02-11T15:44:16Z")
> [@](#): > > You meant baboon. Although, you might opt for buffoon. Aha!! _Buffoon_ it is. **RevCo** , you, sir, are a dim-witted US-centric buffoon. There, take that!! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ZombiesAteMyBrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b4bc9f/32.png) [@ZombiesAteMyBrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZombiesAteMyBrain)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/79 "2005-02-11T15:54:53Z")
> [@blowero](#): > > America - World Police. :rolleyes: America - World Bullies ---
**Author:** ![RevCo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@RevCo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RevCo)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244/80 "2005-02-11T16:34:59Z")
> [@PatriotX](#): > > So, what do _you_ think about the proposal, **RevCo**? Sorry I missed your point - I think it’s a good idea. I’d like to state that there is a better way, but until you or I think of it - it would have to do. The only other option is to threaten them to the negotiating table - which is another valid course of action since we already have all those troops in their backyard. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rice-shut-the-fuck-up-about-iran-already/289244.md?page=5)