# Rick Perry Indicted **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 16, 2014, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656 "2014-08-16T00:55:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/21 "2014-08-16T02:38:25Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Just because she should resign doesn’t make “resign or i’ll veto funding for your department” any less of an abuse of power. IMO, it definitely makes it not an abuse of power. I am pretty sure any jury in Texas that is not filled with flower children from Austin will agree. The problem is not that Perry will be convicted. The problem is that the malicious prosecution will create difficulties for him if he tries to run for Prez. Not that I want him to. So I am not worried about him too much. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/22 "2014-08-16T02:39:27Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > That’s a pretty silly thing to say. “Abuse of power” is about the method – the motivation doesn’t matter at all. “Abuse of power” is all about motivation. The method - veto - is completely legal. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/23 "2014-08-16T02:39:44Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > IMO, it definitely makes it not an abuse of power. I am pretty sure any jury in Texas that is not filled with flower children from Austin will agree. The problem is not that Perry will be convicted. The problem is that the malicious prosecution will create difficulties for him if he tries to run for Prez. Not that I want him to. So I am not worried about him too much. Wow. I thought you were a “breaking the law is breaking the law” kind of guy. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/24 "2014-08-16T02:40:51Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Wow. I thought you were a “breaking the law is breaking the law” kind of guy. Except there was no breaking the law here. Governor vetoing something is completely legal. If he was doing it for the wrong motivation, that would be breaking the law. The motivation was completely correct though. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/25 "2014-08-16T02:40:47Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “Abuse of power” is all about motivation. The method - veto - is completely legal. Vetoing is legal – using a veto threat to try and get someone removed from a position may not be. And if it’s illegal, it’s illegal no matter who they’re trying to remove. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/26 "2014-08-16T02:42:56Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Except there was no breaking the law here. Governor vetoing something is completely legal. If he was doing it for the wrong motivation, that would be breaking the law. The motivation was completely correct though. This is a really silly thing to say. You can veto a bill. You can’t (according to the indictment) threaten a veto a bill to try and influence someone to be removed from office. The motivation doesn’t matter, but even if it did, the motivation is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/27 "2014-08-16T02:43:28Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Except there was no breaking the law here. Governor vetoing something is completely legal. If he was doing it for the wrong motivation, that would be breaking the law. The motivation was completely correct though. The motivation was trying to force someone to do something he has absolutely no say over, that is not correct not matter how shitty the victim is. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/28 "2014-08-16T02:44:09Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > How dare Perry try to remove someone from office for committing a DUI (three times over the limit) and having to be restrained when put in jail for wild and incoherent behavior! Abuse of power indeed. So a DUI should be a bar from holding public office? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/29 "2014-08-16T02:48:20Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > If he was doing it for the wrong motivation, that would be breaking the law. So if I was selling cocaine so that I could buy a nice car, that would be breaking the law. But if I was selling cocaine to pay my mortgage and keep my family off the street, that’s not breaking the law? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/30 "2014-08-16T02:50:49Z")
An example of an abuse of power: “I don’t think this guy that works in X department should be working there. I’m going to veto the X dept funding bill unless he’s gone.” It doesn’t matter if the guy in X department is a neo-Nazi or the greatest guy in the world – threatening a veto to get rid of him is abusing one’s political power. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/31 "2014-08-16T02:51:30Z")
Can someone please explain why threatening to use his veto is not just dirty politics, but actually a crime? Is it a specific crime, or just a general “bringing dishonor to the office” type of vaguely defined crime? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/32 "2014-08-16T02:52:06Z")
Executives can veto bills and threaten to veto bills, but they can’t threaten to veto bills to try and intimidate someone to resign or get fired. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/33 "2014-08-16T02:55:00Z")
[This](http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/PE/htm/PE.39.htm) looks like the statute (abuse of official capacity) under which he was indicted. The legalese is a little beyond my proficiency. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/34 "2014-08-16T02:58:45Z")
> [@Mosier](#): > > Can someone please explain why threatening to use his veto is not just dirty politics, but actually a crime? Is it a specific crime, or just a general “bringing dishonor to the office” type of vaguely defined crime? [From here.](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/16/us/gov-rick-perry-of-texas-is-indicted-over-veto-of-funds-for-das-office.html) > [@](#): > > At the time of Mr. Perry’s veto last year, prosecutors in the unit had been investigating a state agency called the Cancer Prevention and Research Institute of Texas. The agency — one of Mr. Perry’s signature initiatives — came under scrutiny by state lawmakers after accusations of mismanagement and corruption; a former official there was indicted last year for his handling of an $11 million grant. As I understand it, if the head of the Public Integrity Unit had stepped down, Perry would be the one to appoint the replacement. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/35 "2014-08-16T03:02:34Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > So if I was selling cocaine so that I could buy a nice car, that would be breaking the law. But if I was selling cocaine to pay my mortgage and keep my family off the street, that’s not breaking the law? Selling cocaine is illegal regardless of motivation. Governor vetoing laws is legal. The right analogy is: me giving money to you as a birthday gift is not breaking the law. Me giving money to you so that you lower my house’s county assessment value so I could pay smaller RE tax is breaking the law. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/36 "2014-08-16T03:04:18Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > Selling cocaine is illegal regardless of motivation. Governor vetoing laws is legal. > > The right analogy is: me giving money to you as a birthday gift is not breaking the law. Me giving money to you so that you lower my house’s county assessment value so I could pay smaller RE tax is breaking the law. And threatening a veto to try and influence someone to be removed from their position is breaking the law, at least according to the indictment. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/37 "2014-08-16T03:08:21Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > And threatening a veto to try and influence someone to be removed from their position is breaking the law, at least according to the indictment. “According to the indictment”. As I said, malicious prosecutor wielding a bunch of flower children from Austin. No danger of conviction whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/38 "2014-08-16T03:09:22Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > “According to the indictment”. As I said, malicious prosecutor wielding a bunch of flower children from Austin. No danger of conviction whatsoever. Or a legitimate indictment based on the possibility that threatening a veto to intimidate someone into being removed from office really is against the law. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/39 "2014-08-16T03:10:45Z")
I guess, according to **Terr** , the President could threaten to veto a disaster-aid bill to Texas after a natural disaster unless Rick Perry resigned, and this wouldn’t be against the law. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2014, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656/40 "2014-08-16T03:13:38Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I guess, according to **Terr** , the President could threaten to veto a disaster-aid bill to Texas after a natural disaster unless Rick Perry resigned, and this wouldn’t be against the law. Sure could. And no, it wouldn’t. The Prez, if he did it, would lose all respect/power and become an instant lame duck though. And bring a lot of his party down as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rick-perry-indicted/695656.md?page=3)